When will the earth be 6,000 years old?

[1stCenturyLady]

You have been wrongly taught to take Apostle Paul's metaphors and treat them as literal conditions of the flesh. Paul didn't do that. OF COURSE WE ALL alive on earth in flesh bodies are STILL IN THE FLESH, LITERALLY. You need to come to terms with that and quit lying to yourself. So HOW did Apostle Paul really mean that?

Apostle Paul was speaking metaphorically about not being in the flesh. He was speaking according to what he taught in Galatians 5 about us being dead to the law IF... we walk by The Holy Spirit. Don't you see the condition Paul also said in that above Romans 8:9 verse with, "... if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you"?

Your confusion I believe is probably caused by the use of the modern Bible translations which get away from Apostle Paul's teaching those things by making a distinction about our 'flesh', instead of using philosophical terms like 'sin nature' which comes from men's doctrines of humanism. Most preachers today hand out modern English Bible translations at baptisms now days, instead of the more accurate KJV Bible.

It is not a metaphor at all. Paul is talking about the nature, whether a sin nature, or a nature that can partake of the divine nature of God. That is the IF. He speaks of another flesh which is our body, but when he refers to not being in the flesh in Romans 8:9 he means the carnal flesh of the previous verse, 8, "So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God." Do you think that means being alive? Please tell me if you really believe we cannot be holy until we leave these bodies in the grave.

The sin nature is the old man that was crucified on Jesus' cross.

 

[Grailhunter]

It is not a metaphor at all. Paul is talking about the nature, whether a sin nature, or a nature that can partake of the divine nature of God. That is the IF. He speaks of another flesh which is our body, but when he refers to not being in the flesh in Romans 8:9 he means the carnal flesh of the previous verse, 8, "So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God." Do you think that means being alive? Please tell me if you really believe we cannot be holy until we leave these bodies in the grave.

Right.
Paul called Christians saints.
Some better than others.
But as Christ said those that are not sick do not need a doctor. He is out to save the sinners too. Yeshua loved us yet we were sinners. The more He forgives the more we owe Him.

 

[Davy]

BRETHREN IN CHRIST JESUS:

Beware of the wolves in sheep's clothing hiding in some Churches today, even here within forums like this one.

Lord Jesus DID NOT NAIL ALL OF GOD'S LAWS TO HIS CROSS.

In the following New Testament Scripture, Apostle Paul reveals how that many of God's law are STILL IN EFFECT TODAY... for those who walk by their FLESH and sin...

1 Cor 6:9-10
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
KJV

Hey, that above is not from the Old Testament, it is Apostle Paul speaking in 1 Corinthians 6 to the Christian Church at Corinth.

Back in the previous 1 Corinthians 5 Chapter, Paul had to deal with a specific matter of a member of that Church who was having sexual intercourse with his mother, telling the body there to boot that member out of that Church, and rebuking the rest of the members for not having taken care of that sinner themselves, and for them to repent of their guilt in the matter.

Now just what... commandment was Apostle Paul following with the authority to kick that sinner out of that Church at Corinth involving having sex with his own mother? SEE Leviticus 20:11 and Deut.22:30. Who did not know having sex with one's own mother, step-mother, sister, sister-in-law, etc., is STILL A SIN per The New Covenant??

BRETHREN IN CHRIST HAD BETTER... GO BACK TO THE OLD TESTAMENT AND READ THOSE TYPE OF THINGS WHICH THE FATHER AND HIS SON STILL... DO NOT APPROVE OF TODAY UNDER THE NEW COVENANT. Apostle Paul set the stage for STILL STUDYING THOSE LAWS, so we in Christ would KNOW the difference between the UNHOLY and the PROFANE.

But do you parents instead let your children on their own DISCOVER many of those laws from God's Old Testament law that are STILL ON THE BOOKS in TODAY'S COURTS, and BY THAT IGNORANCE THEY POSSIBLY LAND IN JAIL, OR PRISON, FOR BREAKING THEM?


1 Tim 1:8-11
8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.
KJV

Apostle Paul spoke that per his authority given him by Christ within The Gospel of The NEW COVENANT. Apostle Paul was actually a scholar of The Old Testament, having been trained under the best Hebrew scholar of his day, Gamaliel.


Gal 5:16-25
16 This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh.
17 For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
KJV

Paul gave a CONDITION in the above. Only IF... we walk in The Spirit are we not under God's laws which are STILL in EFFECT upon the SINNER. Walk according to your FLESH, and you will have sin, and be back subject to God's laws, and that even as a BELIEVER ON JESUS CHRIST! You do realize today's courts throw law breakers into jail, even though they might be a Christian, don't ya?

Don't just stop reading at the Galatians 5:24 verse about those in Christ having crucified the flesh. Paul's condition of IF... we live in The Spirit still applies for that 24th verse to be true.

 

[Davy]

Can't answer the question, huh?


I wonder where... Paul got that idea to love thy neighbour as thyself, and even Lord Jesus too in Mark 12:31?

Gal 5:14
14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself."
KJV

Rom 13:9
9 For this, 'Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet'; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, 'Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.'
KJV

Mark 12:30-31
30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31 And the second is like, namely this, 'Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.' There is none other commandment greater than these.
KJV

Apostle Paul AND... Lord Jesus Christ, QUOTED that 'Thou shalt love they neighbour as thyself' from HERE:

Lev 19:18
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
KJV

Leviticus 19! That's OLD TESTAMENT brethren in Christ!


"But I thought jelly-bean, that all of God's laws of The Old Testament were nailed by Christ on His cross, and are no longer in effect??", some might say.

I hope brethren don't feel that way about God's Ten Commandments also!

 

[Davy]

What if they are just being their real self rather than a fake fraud? I am not talking about you specifically, but I am just saying in general... as a general question...

There are people that suggest you need the right hair line, the right eyeliner, the right speech, the right words, or whatever.

Thats a bunch fake bullcrap.

Always stay with The Word of God as written, then you will always know the difference.

 

[MatthewG]

Always stay with The Word of God as written, then you will always know the difference.

God forbid we have some actual dialogue.

That’s just a deflection. The truth is people need to think for themselves. Those who want God in their lives will come willingly—not by coercion, not by manipulation, but by conviction.

It’s not some preacher man that gets us to Jesus. It’s God who initiates the reach—through Jesus, the mediator, the reconciler. He gave Himself to bring us near, not by force, but by grace. As it is written, God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting our trespasses against us, and has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

So now, it’s our choice. We respond. We believe. We reconcile ourselves to God through faith. For by grace we are saved through faith, and that not of ourselves—it is the gift of God.

He stands at the door and knocks. Whether we open, that’s on us.

 

[MatthewG]

Apostle Paul AND... Lord Jesus Christ, QUOTED that 'Thou shalt love they neighbour as thyself' from HERE:

Lev 19:18
18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.
KJV

Leviticus 19! That's OLD TESTAMENT brethren in Christ!


"But I thought jelly-bean, that all of God's laws of The Old Testament were nailed by Christ on His cross, and are no longer in effect??", some might say.

I hope brethren don't feel that way about God's Ten Commandments also!

So what? He was fulfilling those things, within himself.

I personally do not think the 10 commandments has any relation to us today... cause it was specifcally to Israel with blessing and cursings.


I don't live by the 10 commandments, I choose to walk in the power of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[MatthewG]

Right.
Paul called Christians saints.
Some better than others.
But as Christ said those that are not sick do not need a doctor. He is out to save the sinners too. Yeshua loved us yet we were sinners. The more He forgives the more we owe Him.

He called specifical people saints... I dont believe any saints live in this world today.


To the people in Rome who are known as saints,

Etc...

Im a stickler for truth when it comes to the audience....

There are no saints today, and no one today is part of the church bride of christ today - considering Jesus had came and took that bride whom were saints, and the very bride of christ.

 

[Grailhunter]

He called specifical people saints... I dont believe any saints live in this world today.


To the people in Rome who are known as saints,

Etc...

Im a stickler for truth when it comes to the audience....

There are no saints today, and no one today is part of the church bride of christ today - considering Jesus had came and took that bride whom were saints, and the very bride of christ.

Cynical.
I disagree.
The people Paul called saints were still sinners.
No one is perfect.
But the process of salvation was not setup for perfection or we would not need Yeshua.

 

[MatthewG]

Cynical.
I disagree.
The people Paul called saints were still sinners.
No one is perfect.
But the process of salvation was not setup for perfection or we would not need Yeshua.

That’s okay… I didn’t expect you to engage, really.

But you can’t deny—the Apostles were governing the church, the bride of Christ, called to be holy, without spot or wrinkle, washed by the water of the word. They weren’t just preaching sermons—they were laying foundations, judging matters, appointing elders, and contending for the faith once delivered to the saints. They were stewards of mysteries, charged with presenting every believer mature in Christ.

And those early believers? They were exhorted to walk worthy of the calling, to be blameless and harmless, children of God without fault in a crooked generation. When you read Revelation, you see it plain—some assemblies were warned to repent, to strengthen what remained, to return to their first love, or else their lampstand would be removed. They were told to overcome, to endure, to keep their garments white.

Otherwise, they’d miss the boat.

And yes—there were people who were blameless according to the law. Mary and Joseph were described that way, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord. Not sinless, but faithful. Righteous. It’s interesting, isn’t it? That even before the cross, God had those who lived with integrity, awaiting the consolation of Israel.

So how much more now, with the Spirit poured out, are we called to walk in the light, to be holy in all conduct, to be a living sacrifice, not conformed to the world but transformed by the renewing of our minds.



I don't believe any person in this world can be those people, they were the first and only ones. - The Bride of Christ.

Im so thankful for them!

I hate it for people to think they some saintly person, haha! Yeah right. You never lived what those people did.

Dying for their faith and having to be waiting for the return of the Lord.

 

[Davy]

It is not a metaphor at all. Paul is talking about the nature, whether a sin nature, or a nature that can partake of the divine nature of God. That is the IF. He speaks of another flesh which is our body, but when he refers to not being in the flesh in Romans 8:9 he means the carnal flesh of the previous verse, 8, "So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God." Do you think that means being alive? Please tell me if you really believe we cannot be holy until we leave these bodies in the grave.

The sin nature is the old man that was crucified on Jesus' cross.

No, Paul was NOT talking about "another flesh". That idea is where you are getting the man-made doctrine you are following. Paul was talking about our FLESH BODY, LITERALLY.


Here is a PROPER INTERPRETATION of the Romans 7 Chapter by Apostle Paul...

(For those who don't care to read this, press on with your favorite doctrines of men.)

Rom 7
7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to Him Who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Is Apostle Paul speaking the above married to one another, and married to Christ, ideas in the LITERAL SENSE, or in the METAPHORICAL SPIRITUAL SENSE? Paul is speaking metaphorically of course, towards a spiritual idea of being in Christ. We of His body are not 'literally' married to each other, nor literally to Lord Jesus, but spiritually, in the metaphorical sense.

God's Word uses many allegories of natural things we are all familiar with in order to teach a spiritual matter with. It does not... mean to translate the material object as being what the real subject is about. When Jesus said you don't put newly fermenting wine into old bottles, lest they break, but you put new wine in new bottles so both are preserved, exactly what was He really referring to, spiritually? Was He teaching about how bottles can be a spiritual thing or something, so worship with new bottles instead old bottles? No, of course not. Same thing here with Apostle Paul when speaking in the metaphorical spiritual sense.

5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

There you go, there's one of Paul's first metaphors, for when we were in the flesh. We still are... in flesh bodies today, are we not? Yes, of course. So how does he mean that? He is speaking spiritually. Those in Christ are 'spiritually' no longer following their fleshy, carnal desires as a rule, but instead are to be led by The Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is of Spirit, and not of this material earthly world. Thus Paul is actually contrasting... our 'spirit' which dwells INSIDE OUR FLESH, vs. our actual FLESH and its carnal desires and wants. Our spirit instead desires the things of God.


6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Specifically, IF... we are in Christ, then we are delivered from the law, because following Christ and walking by The Spirit we won't be breaking any of God's laws. That is what Paul actually taught in Galatians 5. Go read it too.

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, 'Thou shalt not covet.'

Paul is simply saying how can one know what is righteousness without the existence of God's law? And I'm not simply talking about knowing the law by rote like some here try to throw at you to confuse brethren in Christ. What The Holy Spirit shows those in Christ, meaning those brethren who actually listen to The Holy Spirit unction given them, is actually following the laws of God! Who didn't know that already? Don't you remember God's Promise per The New Covenant, that He would write His laws in the minds and hearts of His people, per Hebrews 8:10 and Hebrews 10:16? The difference with The New Covenant is that is not about following the letter, but actually given via The Spirit from GOD Himself writing them in our hearts and minds! Who then can claim God's law is no more? That is a foolish person claiming God's laws are no more.

(continued...)

 

[Davy]

(continued...)

Rom.8:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.

How could God's law be seen as holy? It's because God's laws reveal His righteousness, even though in this world we can never... be perfect in following it. Only our Lord Jesus Christ was Perfect in keeping all of God's law, because He is God. So just because the law condemned us, like Paul says, that doesn't make God's laws bad. Instead, it shows us we all fall short, and most of all... it points to our needing something or someone else... to save us! Who would that be? Our Lord Jesus Christ, of course.

13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

The main purpose for the old covenant keeping of God's law was in order to point... to the future coming of Lord Jesus Christ to save us. Law keeping could never... save us; we can't even keep it but always fall short. Thus the sinning exposed by the law was especially to point to, and prepare for the coming of Lord Jesus and His Sacrifice upon His cross for the remission of sins, for those who believe.

14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

So God's law is "spiritual" Paul says? Yeah! And that is what The Holy Spirit goes by when teaching us all things, according to Christ's promise. Yet Apostle Paul recognized a problem that works against that spiritual law. When he said, "I am carnal", he was speaking of the fleshy part of how God created us (Hebrews 4:12). Paul will show that about our literal flesh specifically here in the next few verses.

15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

Paul says he at times finds himself doing what he does not allow; and what he would do, he does not do. But instead what he hates, he finds himself doing. And the law thus shows him the difference, and is what makes the law good. Paul then finally says, it's not really him doing those things he doesn't want, but "sin that dwelleth in me." In me where though? This is where many Bible translations and Church denominations depart on what Paul says here in this KJV translation, which this KJV is accurate.


18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.

The KJV translators were very correct in translating that Greek sarx as "flesh". Paul is specifically speaking of the flesh body also as lusts of the flesh, in connection with the mind wanting to fulfill the desires of the flesh. What it means is, the FLESH speaks to our minds what it wants, which causes our lusts and carnal desires, etc. Those lusts and desires do not come from our 'spirit' part, they come from our 'flesh' part. This also is why Paul said in Romans 8:7-8 that those in the flesh cannot please God, because of how our flesh is responsible for our carnal thinking.

Yet many of my Christian brethren still fail to grasp the Hebrews 4:12 Scripture that defines how God created each of us with a separate 'spirit', and 'soul', and 'flesh body', and... how our spirit and soul are made from the dimension of Spirit, and not made up of flesh material matter like our flesh body only is. So when Paul is speaking of being "in my flesh", he is pointing to his spirit/soul as a separate part of his being that is not... flesh, being trapped in his flesh body. Paul even made this point very clear in 2 Corinthians 5 when declaring how God made us with 2 bodies, our flesh house our spirit dwells in, and then our spirit body house which if our flesh is dissolved, is immediately manifest in the heavenly. Even back in Ecclesiastes 12:5-7 we are shown how there is a "silver cord" that attaches our 'spirit' part to our 'flesh body' part, and it is separated at flesh death, and the two parts go their separate ways.


19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.

Sin that dwelleth in me, where? In Paul's flesh; that is the source Paul is pointing to, his flesh, not just some human or sin nature philosophical idea, but his literal... flesh body.

22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.

What "members" is Paul speaking of there? The Greek word for it means a limb or body, meaning the flesh body. Thus there is no mistaking this now that Paul was pointing to his actual literal flesh body. Likewise, that idea of that "after the inward man" is pointing to one's 'spirit' that dwells inside their flesh body. It's our inward man that receives unction from The Holy Spirit to our spirit.

24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.
KJV

Note that in verse 25, Paul is actually saying that even though being in Christ, he with his mind (via his spirit and The Holy Spirit) will serve the law of God. But with his flesh body he will serve the law of sin. Don't sugarcoat that, that is specifically what Paul was saying there. What's he mean though, how can we do both?

It means like The New Testament Scriptures declare, particularly like Apostle John said in 1 John 1, that we are to stay on watch against deception, and try not to have future sin, BUT IF WE DO slip up and sin BECAUSE OF THE LAW OF SIN IN OUR FLESH BODY causing it, then we are to REPENT TO JESUS ABOUT IT AND ASK HIM FORGIVENESS, and He will forgive and heal us, like John said there. And like John also said there, anyone DENYING that they sin, they call Jesus a liar.

 

[Davy]

God forbid we have some actual dialogue.

That’s just a deflection. The truth is people need to think for themselves. Those who want God in their lives will come willingly—not by coercion, not by manipulation, but by conviction.

It’s not some preacher man that gets us to Jesus. It’s God who initiates the reach—through Jesus, the mediator, the reconciler. He gave Himself to bring us near, not by force, but by grace. As it is written, God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting our trespasses against us, and has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

So now, it’s our choice. We respond. We believe. We reconcile ourselves to God through faith. For by grace we are saved through faith, and that not of ourselves—it is the gift of God.

He stands at the door and knocks. Whether we open, that’s on us.

The object of my response was that ONLY God's Word is the MEASURE of all things. That's why I recommended staying in it.

 

[Davy]

So what? He was fulfilling those things, within himself.

I personally do not think the 10 commandments has any relation to us today... cause it was specifcally to Israel with blessing and cursings.


I don't live by the 10 commandments, I choose to walk in the power of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.

I follow what Lord Jesus says, and not what man says, nor independent thinkers like yourself.

Mark 12:30-31
30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
KJV

That first commandment Lord Jesus mentioned is in connection with the original Ten Commandments given through Moses.

Did you not know that engravings of The Ten Commandments with an image of Moses holding the stone tablets are upon the U.S. Federal Court building in Washington, D.C.? Copies of the Ten Commandments hang in many U.S. courtrooms today. Wonder why that is? Many in the future, at Christ's 2nd coming, will learn why, some will learn the hard way.

 

[MatthewG]

The object of my response was that ONLY God's Word is the MEASURE of all things. That's why I recommended staying in it.

I follow what Lord Jesus says, and not what man says, nor independent thinkers like yourself.

Mark 12:30-31
30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.
KJV

That first commandment Lord Jesus mentioned is in connection with the original Ten Commandments given through Moses.

Did you not know that engravings of The Ten Commandments with an image of Moses holding the stone tablets are upon the U.S. Federal Court building in Washington, D.C.? Copies of the Ten Commandments hang in many U.S. courtrooms today. Wonder why that is? Many in the future, at Christ's 2nd coming, will learn why, some will learn the hard way.

Yeah, you are your own independent thinker.

Well, I dont think you fulfilled that commandment, considering Jesus fulfilled it for you.

I don't care if they got the ten commandments or not. It's not meant for me.

Im thankful we still got federal governement, and police and things of that nature.

 

[Davy]

Yeah, you are your own independent thinker.

Well, I dont think you fulfilled that commandment, considering Jesus fulfilled it for you.

I don't care if they got the ten commandments or not. It's not meant for me.

Im thankful we still got federal governement, and police and things of that nature.

You are talking out of another hole now.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

No, Paul was NOT talking about "another flesh". That idea is where you are getting the man-made doctrine you are following. Paul was talking about our FLESH BODY, LITERALLY.


Here is a PROPER INTERPRETATION of the Romans 7 Chapter by Apostle Paul...

(For those who don't care to read this, press on with your favorite doctrines of men.)

Rom 7
7 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to Him Who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Is Apostle Paul speaking the above married to one another, and married to Christ, ideas in the LITERAL SENSE, or in the METAPHORICAL SPIRITUAL SENSE? Paul is speaking metaphorically of course, towards a spiritual idea of being in Christ. We of His body are not 'literally' married to each other, nor literally to Lord Jesus, but spiritually, in the metaphorical sense.

God's Word uses many allegories of natural things we are all familiar with in order to teach a spiritual matter with. It does not... mean to translate the material object as being what the real subject is about. When Jesus said you don't put newly fermenting wine into old bottles, lest they break, but you put new wine in new bottles so both are preserved, exactly what was He really referring to, spiritually? Was He teaching about how bottles can be a spiritual thing or something, so worship with new bottles instead old bottles? No, of course not. Same thing here with Apostle Paul when speaking in the metaphorical spiritual sense.

5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death.

There you go, there's one of Paul's first metaphors, for when we were in the flesh. We still are... in flesh bodies today, are we not? Yes, of course. So how does he mean that? He is speaking spiritually. Those in Christ are 'spiritually' no longer following their fleshy, carnal desires as a rule, but instead are to be led by The Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is of Spirit, and not of this material earthly world. Thus Paul is actually contrasting... our 'spirit' which dwells INSIDE OUR FLESH, vs. our actual FLESH and its carnal desires and wants. Our spirit instead desires the things of God.


6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

Specifically, IF... we are in Christ, then we are delivered from the law, because following Christ and walking by The Spirit we won't be breaking any of God's laws. That is what Paul actually taught in Galatians 5. Go read it too.

7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, 'Thou shalt not covet.'

Paul is simply saying how can one know what is righteousness without the existence of God's law? And I'm not simply talking about knowing the law by rote like some here try to throw at you to confuse brethren in Christ. What The Holy Spirit shows those in Christ, meaning those brethren who actually listen to The Holy Spirit unction given them, is actually following the laws of God! Who didn't know that already? Don't you remember God's Promise per The New Covenant, that He would write His laws in the minds and hearts of His people, per Hebrews 8:10 and Hebrews 10:16? The difference with The New Covenant is that is not about following the letter, but actually given via The Spirit from GOD Himself writing them in our hearts and minds! Who then can claim God's law is no more? That is a foolish person claiming God's laws are no more.

(continued...)

So you believe Romans 8:9 is talking about our body when it says you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit? Amazing!

What about Romans 7:5-6 5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. 6 But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter." Is Paul saying after we die literally, we are delivered from the law? When we were in our bodies, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death? But now that our body is dead we have been delivered from the law? Amazing!

 

[Davy]

So you believe Romans 8:9 is talking about our body when it says you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit? Amazing!

I already explained that in my previous posts, which you apparently refused to read. So now your are bearing FALSE WITNESS against me, which is a SIN per God's Word.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I already explained that in my previous post, which you apparently refused to read. So now your are bearing FALSE WITNESS against me, which is a SIN per God's Word.

Not at all. Your belief about Romans 8:9 is just unbelievable.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

You are talking out of another hole now.

That's disgusting!