Rapture ... soon?

[Jay Ross]

The LORD did not require the Bride to be in the parable.

Unless the bride was in the banqueting hall, then the coming of the Husband would have been in vain. The question still remains, Who was going to be the bride of Christ?

In His foreknowledge and in accordance with His Gospel, His criteria in the parable for us = is the 'OIL'

This is a secondary understanding for the parable. For His Saints to be fully prepared to wait for the coming of the Husband for the bride.

But the waiting of the ten virgins outside of the banqueting hall would have been in vain if the Bride was not inside.

Again, "Who is the Bride that Christ comes to get from the banqueting Hall?

Who among all of the Saints, is special to the Lord?

PS: - The answer is found in Deuteronomy.

 

[David in NJ]

Unless the bride was in the banqueting hall, then the coming of the Husband would have been in vain. The question still remains, Who was going to be the bride of Christ?

The question of "who is the Bride of Christ?" was fully answered by the LORD beginning in Genesis, confirmed in the Gospel,
and confirmed again by the Apostles.

It is a "RED HERRING" and a 'RABBIT TRAIL' to be DIVERTED away from the MAIN FOCUS given by the LORD = "the OIL"

In our LORD's parable (10V) the Instruction/Promise/Warning for us is 'the OIL'

Parable = Without the OIL, one cannot enter into Eternal Life

Looking for the Bride is a 'mute' point = specified by the LORD = HE wants our FOCUS on the OIL

What @Jay Ross missed:
#1 - Matthew chapter 24 verse 42 with this conclusion:
Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day on which your Lord will come.
#2 - Matthew chapter 25 verse 13 with the SAME conclusion:
Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day on which your Lord will come.

FOCUS = Only One Second Coming of CHRIST Spoken by the LORD beginning in Genesis, Prophets, Gospel, Apostles and Revelation.

 

[Jay Ross]

In a similar approach, I am as much a 'pup' as Christ was to the Jewish elders.

The Holy Spirit is my Guide/Teacher and most Christians today have NOT grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

If you fall into the trap of 'age based legalism' you will fail to learn from the Holy Spirit in younger vessels = Matthew 18:1-5

It is GOD who decides what, how much and to whom HE gives understanding = Luke 11:13

In one of the Letters, are not the newer women in Christ told to learn from the women who are older in the Lord and their understanding?

Firstly, your claim that You are like Jesus in that He seemed to be younger in comparison to the Jewish Elders when the reality was that Jesus was from the time before they were even a nation. In other words, He was older and had more wisdom to teach from than they did.

Secondly, an internet forum is not the place where you can judge the credentials of other members of this forum and whether or not they have grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

Thirdly, I have not fallen into the trap of 'age based legalism' as you are suggesting in that I should listen to you because you have learned from the Holy Spirit, even if you are a younger vessel. Then you referenced this passage from Scripture: -

Matthew 18:1-5: - Who Is the Greatest?​

​

1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”​

​

2 Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them, 3 and said, “Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me.​

Yes, being humble like a little child is an attribute that all Saints should try to achieve in their walk with the Lord.

Fourthly you invoke this: - "It is GOD who decides what, how much and to whom HE gives understanding." and then referenced this passage of scripture: -
​

Luke 11:11-13: - 11 What father among you, if his son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13 So if you who are evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”​

Yes, but in Acts when Simon the sorcerer asked for the Holy Spirit, the Apostle refused because of his wrong spirit.

Yes, we can use scripture to prove or disprove a perspective we want.

Surely, if you have been given the Holy Spirit then my question should not be difficult for you to answer.

Shalom​

 

[David in NJ]

In one of the Letters, are not the newer women in Christ told to learn from the women who are older in the Lord and their understanding?

Firstly, your claim that You are like Jesus in that He seemed to be younger in comparison to the Jewish Elders when the reality was that Jesus was from the time before they were even a nation. In other words, He was older and had more wisdom to teach from than they did.

Secondly, an internet forum is not the place where you can judge the credentials of other members of this forum and whether or not they have grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

Thirdly, I have not fallen into the trap of 'age based legalism' as you are suggesting in that I should listen to you because you have learned from the Holy Spirit, even if you are a younger vessel. Then you referenced this passage from Scripture: -

​

Matthew 18:1-5: - Who Is the Greatest?​

​

1 At that time the disciples came to Jesus, saying, “Who then is greatest in the kingdom of heaven?”​

​

2 Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them, 3 and said, “Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 Whoever receives one little child like this in My name receives Me.​

Yes, being humble like a little child is an attribute that all Saints should try to achieve in their walk with the Lord.

Fourthly you invoke this: - "It is GOD who decides what, how much and to whom HE gives understanding." and then referenced this passage of scripture: -
​

​

Luke 11:11-13: - 11 What father among you, if his son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will give him a scorpion? 13 So if you who are evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”


Yes, but in Acts when Simon the sorcerer asked for the Holy Spirit, the Apostle refused because of his wrong spirit.

Yes, we can use scripture to prove or disprove a perspective we want.

Surely, if you have been given the Holy Spirit then my question should not be difficult for you to answer.

Shalom​

Well, you took the bait = as expected

Of course the LORD is from Eternity = but not in front of the 'elders'

Therefore, the Holy Spirit can and WILL teach, of any age, the MOST valuable Truths of Scripture as HE "hovers over the waters" looking for those who are Hungry and Open and humble AND who have purged their hearts from "respect of persons"

Secondly, an internet forum is not the place where you can judge the credentials of other members of this forum and whether or not they have grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

Thirdly, I have not fallen into the trap of 'age based legalism' as you are suggesting

My Dear Brother Jay, it was you who opened the door by suggesting: "If this is the case, then you are a pup trying to teach someone who is older and possibly wiser."

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

"where is the Bride in the parable"

red herring

noun​

1. A smoked herring having a reddish color.
2. Something that draws attention away from the matter being discussed or dealt with.
3. A smoke-cured and salt-brined herring strong enough to turn the flesh red; a type of kipper.

 

[Jay Ross]

Well, you took the bait = as expected

Of course the LORD is from Eternity = but not in front of the 'elders'

Therefore, the Holy Spirit can and WILL teach, of any age, the MOST valuable Truths of Scripture as HE "hovers over the waters" looking for those who are Hungry and Open and humble AND who have purged their hearts from "respect of persons"


My Dear Brother Jay, it was you who opened the door by suggesting: "If this is the case, then you are a pup trying to teach someone who is older and possibly wiser."

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

"where is the Bride in the parable"

red herring

noun​

1. A smoked herring having a reddish color.
2. Something that draws attention away from the matter being discussed or dealt with.
3. A smoke-cured and salt-brined herring strong enough to turn the flesh red; a type of kipper.

No, the Bride is most important in this parable. Those who were prepared for the Husband to come for His bride are the ones who celebrated with the Lord in the Banqueting Hall with the bride and Husband after the doors had shut.

What is the first thing that happens at the beginning of the Age after the Fig Tree had Budded? Have we witnessed this event yet? I believe that we have and the lesson from the fig tree tells us when the next age will begin and when all of Israel will be saved and Israel becomes the bride of Christ/God once again and resumes her role in the Great Harvest.

Who was Christ's audience who would have understood what He was saying about all of Israel being saved.

I believe that it is you have fallen for the "red herrings" that have been placed in your way towards the truth of this parable in understanding this parable literally.

 

[David in NJ]

No, the Bride is most important in this parable. Those who were prepared for the Husband to come for His bride are the ones who celebrated with the Lord in the Banqueting Hall with the bride and Husband after the doors had shut.

What is the first thing that happens at the beginning of the Age after the Fig Tree had Budded? Have we witnessed this event yet? I believe that we have and the lesson from the fig tree tells us when the next age will begin and when all of Israel will be saved and Israel becomes the bride of Christ/God once again and resumes her role in the Great Harvest.

Who was Christ's audience who would have understood what He was saying about all of Israel being saved.

I believe that it is you have fallen for the "red herrings" that have been placed in your way towards the truth of this parable in understanding this parable literally.

Ok Jay, as you wish = disregard the LORD's Intent, Purpose and Warning of "the OIL"

Disregard = There are two Israels and two Jerusalems and Jacob had two brides

Disregard = Romans, Galatians and Ephesians

Disregard = Who the HOLY SPIRIT adorns as the Bride of CHRIST

PAY FULL ATTENTION to the Jewish people and the earthbound nation Israel who are in bondage to sin.

FYI = i KNOW of the prophecies of the earthbound sinful nation Israel and WHEN they will be brought into the One New MAN in the ISRAEL of GOD

 

[Jay Ross]

Ok Jay, as you wish = disregard the LORD's Intent, Purpose and Warning of "the OIL"

Disregard = There are two Israels and two Jerusalems and Jacob had two brides

Disregard = Romans, Galatians and Ephesians

Disregard = Who the HOLY SPIRIT adorns as the Bride of CHRIST

PAY FULL ATTENTION to the Jewish people and the earthbound nation Israel who are in bondage to sin.

FYI = i KNOW of the prophecies of the earthbound sinful nation Israel and WHEN they will be brought into the One New MAN in the ISRAEL of GOD

I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding God's intent re the purpose and warning re the "oil".
I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding the two Israels, the two Jerusalems and Jacob had two wives even though he recognised the two maids given to him were also his wives as well, although his regards for the two maid wives was less than for Leah and Rachel.
I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding Romans, Galatians and Ephesians.
I am sorry that you believe that I do not know who the Holy spirit adorns as the Bride of Christ.

I would also like you to know that I have paid full attention to the Jewish people and the earthbound nation of Israel who you are claiming are in bondage to sin and that after the fourth age of the existence of Israel, that the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers upon their children and the children's children comes to its completion that all of Israel will be saved. Now that statement is based on Paul's claim in Romans 11:25b-26 and I for one will not disagree with what Paul wrote, but many scholars have changed the intent of what Paul wrote to men something entirely else.

I know that when God begins to gather them that He will plant them in His fertile soil and that He will teach them on the fundamental truth that the Rock that comes down out of heaven carries such that this rock/stone will then become the largest mountain in all of the earth. I also know that this will happen during the time of the kings that make up the fifth segment of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy which we have already witness after the invasion of Iraq/The Land of Babylon in 2003 AD. I also know that when God gathers Israel to Himself that He will leave them scattered through all of the earth so that Israel will be able all the nations/people of the earth who also choses to inhabit God's fertile soil/ground/field.

I am sorry that you cannot see what God has written about Israel and what His Purposes are for Israel in the scriptures.

Shalom

 

[David in NJ]

I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding God's intent re the purpose and warning re the "oil".
I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding the two Israels, the two Jerusalems and Jacob had two wives even though he recognised the two maids given to him were also his wives as well, although his regards for the two maid wives was less than for Leah and Rachel.
I am sorry that you believe that I am disregarding Romans, Galatians and Ephesians.
I am sorry that you believe that I do not know who the Holy spirit adorns as the Bride of Christ.

I would also like you to know that I have paid full attention to the Jewish people and the earthbound nation of Israel who you are claiming are in bondage to sin and that after the fourth age of the existence of Israel, that the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers upon their children and the children's children comes to its completion that all of Israel will be saved. Now that statement is based on Paul's claim in Romans 11:25b-26 and I for one will not disagree with what Paul wrote, but many scholars have changed the intent of what Paul wrote to men something entirely else.

I know that when God begins to gather them that He will plant them in His fertile soil and that He will teach them on the fundamental truth that the Rock that comes down out of heaven carries such that this rock/stone will then become the largest mountain in all of the earth. I also know that this will happen during the time of the kings that make up the fifth segment of the Daniel 2 Statue prophecy which we have already witness after the invasion of Iraq/The Land of Babylon in 2003 AD. I also know that when God gathers Israel to Himself that He will leave them scattered through all of the earth so that Israel will be able all the nations/people of the earth who also choses to inhabit God's fertile soil/ground/field.

I am sorry that you cannot see what God has written about Israel and what His Purposes are for Israel in the scriptures.

Shalom

You can escape sorrow, due to unbelief, thru faith in the Word that was Elohim.

Make this correction in your heart/mind and soul about the sinful nation Israel of the flesh = Isaiah 1:4 and Galatians 4:21-25

Hear, O heavens, and give ear, O earth!
For the Lord has spoken:
“I have nourished and brought up children,
And they have rebelled against Me;
The ox knows its owner
And the donkey its master’s crib;
But Israel does not know,
My people do not consider.”
Alas, sinful nation,
A people laden with iniquity,

Tell me, you who want to be under the law, do you not understand what the law says? For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the slave woman and the other by the free woman. His son by the slave woman was born according to the flesh, but his son by the free woman was born through the promise.

These things serve as illustrations, for the women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children into slavery: This is Hagar.
Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present-day Jerusalem,
because she is in slavery(to SIN) with her children.

O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling!
Look, your house is left to you desolate.
For I tell you that you will not see Me again until you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.’”

 

[Gottservant]

I'm of the mind, that the more eager you are for the Return of Jesus, the more God is able to reward you.

I think God sends word of the Return first, because a) He knows people will struggle to be ready, b) He knows people are at their best when they just trust (the Word) and c) the Devil can't quash plans to bring Glory to God, if he doesn't know what's going on!

Do you get that God does not just test all of mankind, when He knows they will fail?

 

[Jay Ross]

You can escape sorrow, due to unbelief, thru faith in the Word that was Elohim.

Does this not apply to both of us?

Make this correction in your heart/mind and soul about the sinful nation Israel of the flesh = Isaiah 1:4 and Galatians 4:21-25

Does this not apply to both of us?

These things serve as illustrations, for the women represent two covenants. One covenant is from Mount Sinai and bears children into slavery: This is Hagar.
Now Hagar stands for Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present-day Jerusalem,
because she is in slavery(to SIN) with her children.

O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those sent to her, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were unwilling!
Look, your house is left to you desolate.
For I tell you that you will not see Me again until you say, ‘Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord.’”

David when you understand what I actually know and realise what your hard heart is saying about my faith in God and the end time prophecies then there may be a chance that we can have a fulfilling conversation.

At this present time, you are not prepared to learn from what I post.

 

[David in NJ]

Does this not apply to both of us?



Does this not apply to both of us?



David when you understand what I actually know and realise what your hard heart is saying about my faith in God and the end time prophecies then there may be a chance that we can have a fulfilling conversation.

At this present time, you are not prepared to learn from what I post.

The HOLY SPIRIT is the Spirit of Truth

When you reject His words you reject TRUTH

Declaring yourself as being "wiser" then the LORD and the Apostles is the PITFALL of the Jewish people and of Gentilian religion

 

[Jay Ross]

The HOLY SPIRIT is the Spirit of Truth

When you reject His words you reject TRUTH

Agreed that the "Holy Spirit" teaches us the truth. It is our understanding of that truth that is suspect.

I agree that when we reject God's words and what He has said in the scriptures that we are rejecting His truth.

Declaring yourself as being "wiser" then the LORD and the Apostles is the PITFALL of the Jewish people and of Gentilian religion

Perhaps this is what you are referring to with your quoted remark.

. . . ., then you are a pup trying to teach someone who is older and possibly wiser.

Your rebuttals are showing that you are losing the argument.

Anyone who believes in a rapture soon is not walking with the Lord.

 

[Gottservant]

The HOLY SPIRIT is the Spirit of Truth

When you reject His words you reject TRUTH

Declaring yourself as being "wiser" then the LORD and the Apostles is the PITFALL of the Jewish people and of Gentilian religion

Truth is where the spirit and soul meet.

When you say "[someone] doesn't know the truth" you are saying either they don't care about their spirit or they don't understand their soul - which is ridiculous (to some degree).

I'm not saying this to admonish anyone, just to point out the bigger context to "truth".

 

[David in NJ]

Agreed that the "Holy Spirit" teaches us the truth. It is our understanding of that truth that is suspect.

I agree that when we reject God's words and what He has said in the scriptures that we are rejecting His truth.



Perhaps this is what you are referring to with your quoted remark.



Your rebuttals are showing that you are losing the argument.

Anyone who believes in a rapture soon is not walking with the Lord.

No one should place their trust in pre-trib rapture as it is the golden calf of the Laeodecian churches.

Good Night my Brother in Christ

 

[David in NJ]

Truth is where the spirit and soul meet.

When you say "[someone] doesn't know the truth" you are saying either they don't care about their spirit or they don't understand their soul - which is ridiculous (to some degree).

I'm not saying this to admonish anyone, just to point out the bigger context to "truth".

Keep in mind = i never said "someone/John/Jane Doe does not know truth"

What the LORD Says is this:
Among the mature, however, we speak a message of wisdom—but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7No, we speak of the mysterious and hidden wisdom of God,a which He destined for our glory before time began. 8None of the rulers of this age understood it. For if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. 9Rather, as it is written:

“No eye has seen,

no ear has heard,

no heart has imagined,

what God has prepared for those who love Him.”b

10But God has revealed it to us by the Spirit.

The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. 11For who among men knows the thoughts of man except his own spirit within him? So too, no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. 12We have not received the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us. 13And this is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom, but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.c

14The natural man does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God. For they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15The spiritual man judges all things, but he himself is not subject to anyone’s judgment. 16“For who has known the mind of the Lord, so as to instruct Him?”d But we have the mind of Christ.

 

[Marilyn C]

New Jerusalem is the Body of Christ

And scriptures please?

 

[Marilyn C]

144,000 is SYMBOLIC and they are not Jews of the flesh

And proof for that please?

 

[Marilyn C]

That is the manner in which you want the story to go. If this is the second coming of Christ, who is the Bride that Christ comes for at this time?

Israel. They are the wife of the Lamb. (Rev. 19: 7) Compare Isa. 54: 5 & 6 and Hosea 2: 19 & 20)

 

[Marilyn C]

The LORD did not require the Bride to be in the parable.

In His foreknowledge and in accordance with His Gospel, His criteria in the parable for us = is the 'OIL'

Jesus was speaking to the people of Israel . The Body of Christ was NOT revealed at that time. God`s word is for us to learn of Christ`s character and His purposes however, it is NOT ALL about `us.`

 

[Marilyn C]

In a similar approach, i am as much a 'pup' as Christ was to the Jewish elders.

The Holy Spirit is my Guide/Teacher and most christians today have NOT grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

If you fall into the trap of 'age based legalism' you will fail to learn from the Holy Spirit in younger vessels = Matthew 18:1-5

It is GOD who decides what, how much and to whom HE gives understanding = Luke 11:13

So are you saying that the Head of the Body has not been able to guide them into all the truth? And only you and a few are listening to the Head by the Holy Spirit?