Using the term "rapture" incorrectly

[Douggg]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

Dougg, please stop being silly. No one is going to do this because it's completely unnecessary. Everyone knows that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens first and then the rapture (catching up to meet the Lord in the air) of the resurrected dead in Christ together with those who are alive and remain happens immediately afterwards. So, if someone refers to the rapture, then anyone who knows what is written in 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17, which is a vast majority of us, will know that it occurs at the time of the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

Have you seen anyone on this forum try to claim that the rapture occurs at a different time than the resurrection of the dead in Christ?

 

[Douggg]

Dougg, please stop being silly. No one is going to do this because it's completely unnecessary. Everyone knows that the resurrection of the dead in Christ happens first and then the rapture (catching up to meet the Lord in the air) of the resurrected dead in Christ together with those who are alive and remain happens immediately afterwards. So, if someone refers to the rapture, then anyone who knows what is written in 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17, which is a vast majority of us, will know that it occurs at the time of the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

Have you seen anyone on this forum try to claim that the rapture occurs at a different time than the resurrection of the dead in Christ?

Using the correct term "resurrection/rapture" not only is respectful for the dead in Christ, but also cancels some timing views of the resurrection/rapture event. Such as the view that Matthew 24:31 is speaking about the event.

Also the resurrection/rapture event is not just a resurrection alone. So it important when speaking about the event to use the correct term, the resurrection/rapture event.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Using the correct term "resurrection/rapture" not only is respectful for the dead in Christ, but also cancels some timing views of the resurrection/rapture event.

Everyone who has read 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 knows that the resurrected dead in Christ are part of the rapture.

Such as the view that Matthew 24:31 is speaking about the event.

It is. When will you ever learn that not all passages that relate to the second coming of Christ contain all of the same details regarding that event? Just because Matthew 24:31 does not specifically mention a resurrection does not mean that the resurrection of the dead in Christ doesn't occur at that time. This is not how to interpret scripture, Douggg. There is no mention of any gathering being done by angels in Revelation 19:11-21, so does that mean Matthew 24:30-31 and Revelation 19:11-21 are not referring to the same event, namely the return of Christ?

Also the resurrection/rapture event is not just a resurrection alone.

No one says that a resurrection doesn't occur when the rapture occurs, so this is just silly.

So it important when speaking about the event to use the correct term, the resurrection/rapture event.

No, it is not. It's only important to you in order to make people think that 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17 is a different event from Matthew 24:30-31. Your arguments from silence are not going to convince anyone who actually knows what the scriptures teach.

Douggg, think about how badly you misinterpreted Zechariah 13:7 before I corrected you and showed you how Jesus applied it. Consider what other scripture you might be completely mistaken about besides that one. As long as you keep interpreting scripture based on doctrinal bias, you will never discover the truth of end times scriptures.

 

[Truth7t7]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

Yes the resurrection and (catching up/rapture) takes place on (The Last Day) not 3.5 years before it, as dispensationalism falsely teaches

John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 11:23-24KJV
23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

 

[Davidpt]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

Here's what we need to call it if we are going to call it exactly what it is. And that you need to call it this as well---"last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event"---IOW, 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-57, for one.

From now on let's all call it that, including you, exactly what it is--"last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event"

Then ask ourself this question. Which makes better sense, period---a "last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event" before great tribulation? Or a "last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event" after great tribulation?

 

[quietthinker]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

The word 'rapture' ......ahhhh, where did that come from if not cobbled to some secretive cosmic event?

 

[Douggg]

Here's what we need to call it if we are going to call it exactly what it is. And that you need to call it this as well---"last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event"---IOW, 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 and 1 Corinthians 15:51-57, for one.

From now on let's all call it that, including you, exactly what it is--"last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event"

Then ask ourself this question. Which makes better sense, period---a "last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event" before great tribulation? Or a "last trumpet/resurrection/rapture event" after great tribulation?

There is controversy over what is meant by the last trumpet. So that should not be part of the description of the resurrection/rapture event.

 

[Davidpt]

There is controversy over what is meant by the last trumpet. So that should not be part of the description of the resurrection/rapture event.

If there is controversy over what is meant by the last trumpet, you can bet doctrinal bias has something to do with it then.


You don't dispute that 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 involves a trumpet? Right? And Paul connects a resurrection event with that of the last trumpet(1 Corinthians 15:51-57). Right? A coincidence? Or is someone trying to tell us something here?

1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump(salpigx) of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:


1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet(salpigx) shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

In your mind, what exactly is the difference between all of the following?

and the dead in Christ shall rise(1 Thessalonians 4:16) vs. and the dead shall be raised(1 Corinthians 15:52)


We shall not all sleep(1 Corinthians 15:51) vs. concerning them which are asleep--even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him---we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep(1 Thessalonians 4:13-15)

How can the dead in Christ that shall rise not equal the dead shall be raised? If it doesn't equal that, what does it equal then?

How can 1 Thessalonians 4:13-15 not equal we shall not all sleep? If it doesn't equal that, what does it equal then?


We are supposed to prove Scripture with Scripture. I'm clearly doing that here. But are you doing it as well?

 

[Davy]

I observe in nearly all posts that the term "rapture" is used incorrectly.

It will not be just a "rapture" event, but a "resurrection/rapture" event.

The event involves resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture of the living in Christ.

So please, everyone, start using the term "resurrection/rapture event", not just rapture by itself.

No way. That idea is just the kind of junk you've been wrongly taught by the false Pre-trib Rapture preachers.

The word 'rapture' is actually not in the Greek New Testament manuscripts. It comes from a Latin translation of the Greek word that is... in the manuscripts, i.e., harpazo (NT:726), which means to seize.

In 1 Thessalonians 4 by Apostle Paul, the Greek word harpazo is used only in the 1 Thessalonians 4:17 verse, as "caught up" (KJV). It is ONLY about the saints that are still alive on the day of Christ's coming to gather His Church.

The resurrection that will happen first, per 1 Thessalonians 4:13-16 is about Jesus bringing the saints that died in Christ with Him FROM HEAVEN. They are already there in Heaven with Jesus, which is how He will bring them with Him when He comes like Paul showed. Paul covered how this is in the 2 Corinthians 5 Chapter, to be absent from the body is to be present with The Lord.

So don't let the followers of the false Pre-trib Rapture theory dupe you like they are.

 

[Douggg]

No way. That idea is just the kind of junk you've been wrongly taught by the false Pre-trib Rapture preachers.

I believe that the resurrection/rapture event count happen anytime between right now and the day the Antichrist commits the transgression of desolation act.

 

[Douggg]

You don't dispute that 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 involves a trumpet? Right? And Paul connects a resurrection event with that of the last trumpet(1 Corinthians 15:51-57). Right? A coincidence? Or is someone trying to tell us something here?

The word "trump" and "trumpet" do appear in the text, agreed.

But what the last trumpet means in 1 Corinthians 15:52 is controversial. Some persons think last trumpet means the seventh trumpet (of the 7 trumpet judgments).

Or it could simply means that when God The Father sends Jesus for the resurrection/rapture event, that a series of trumpets will sound in heaven.

Also, it could mean such as being like the last trumpet sounding back in the days of Exodus, signaling the camp to begin moving forward to it's next location.

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Just refer to the event as the resurrection/rapture event. To avoid controversy over the timing.

 

[Davy]

I believe that the resurrection/rapture event count happen anytime between right now and the day the Antichrist commits the transgression of desolation act.


View attachment 86412

We've been over this all before. You are HIDING the fact that you believe the false Pre-trib Rapture. And it's so... obvious, that you can't even realize that your attempt to deceive about it is hanging like a booger on the end of your nose.

 

[CrowCross]

We've been over this all before. You are HIDING the fact that you believe the false Pre-trib Rapture. And it's so... obvious, that you can't even realize that your attempt to deceive about it is hanging like a booger on the end of your nose.

besides the bible proclaiming a pre-trib rapture....one of the reasons I don't believe in a post-trib rapture is because of the way they mock christians who understand the rapture is pre-trib.

 

[CrowCross]

Yes the resurrection and (catching up/rapture) takes place on (The Last Day) not 3.5 years before it, as dispensationalism falsely teaches

John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 11:23-24KJV
23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

What is this "last day'?
Is it a reference to a particular date on a calendar? If so what particular verse in the bible describes this last day?
Could the last day refer to a period of time?
Could it be the last day of a dispensation?
Could a particular dispensation be considered as a last day?
Does the age of Grace have a last day?
Is this last day the last day of the tribulation? The last day of the millennial reign? The day of the white throne judgement?
Does the last day proceed the coming of the New Jerusalem? If so will there be days then?

Guys like you quote the bible...but never explain what the last day represents.
Would you like to take the time to explain just what the "last day" means?

 

[IndianaRob]

What is this "last day'?
Is it a reference to a particular date on a calendar? If so what particular verse in the bible describes this last day?
Could the last day refer to a period of time?
Could it be the last day of a dispensation?
Could a particular dispensation be considered as a last day?
Does the age of Grace have a last day?
Is this last day the last day of the tribulation? The last day of the millennial reign? The day of the white throne judgement?
Does the last day proceed the coming of the New Jerusalem? If so will there be days then?

Guys like you quote the bible...but never explain what the last day represents.
Would you like to take the time to explain just what the "last day" means?

It most likely, in all cases, is the third day or the day Jesus rose from the dead.

 

[CrowCross]

The word "trump" and "trumpet" do appear in the text, agreed.

But what the last trumpet means in 1 Corinthians 15:52 is controversial. Some persons think last trumpet means the seventh trumpet (of the 7 trumpet judgments).

Or it could simply means that when God The Father sends Jesus for the resurrection/rapture event, that a series of trumpets will sound in heaven.

Also, it could mean such as being like the last trumpet sounding back in the days of Exodus, signaling the camp to begin moving forward to it's next location.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Just refer to the event as the resurrection/rapture event. To avoid controversy over the timing.

One more trumpet event....Some say the rapture will occur at the end of the Jewish feast of trumpets when they blow the last trumpet.

One more, more thing....some say there is a difference between the trump of God in 1 Thes and the trumpets of angels in the judgements of Revelation.

These people act as if they know for sure what the last trumpet is....

 

[CrowCross]

It most likely, in all cases, is the third day or the day Jesus rose from the dead.

??? I'm not following.
Is that when the last days began and the last days has a last day?

 

[Truth7t7]

What is this "last day'?
Is it a reference to a particular date on a calendar? If so what particular verse in the bible describes this last day?
Could the last day refer to a period of time?
Could it be the last day of a dispensation?
Could a particular dispensation be considered as a last day?
Does the age of Grace have a last day?
Is this last day the last day of the tribulation? The last day of the millennial reign? The day of the white throne judgement?
Does the last day proceed the coming of the New Jerusalem? If so will there be days then?

Guys like you quote the bible...but never explain what the last day represents.
Would you like to take the time to explain just what the "last day" means?

(The Last Day) Represents The Time Of The Resurrection And The Final Judgement, The End

1 Corinthians 15:21-24KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

Jesus Taught (The Last Day) Was The Time Of Final Judgement, He Also Taught It Was The Time Of Resurrection

John 12:48KJV
48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

John 11:23-24KJV
23 Jesus saith unto her, Thy brother shall rise again.
24 Martha saith unto him, I know that he shall rise again in the resurrection at the last day.

 

[IndianaRob]

??? I'm not following.
Is that when the last days began and the last days has a last day?

The last day Jesus was in the tomb is what The Last Day means…: “I will raise him up on the last day”.

There is also “the last days” which most people believe means the end of the world but from my point of view the “lasts days” means the end of an age or the end of a system like the old covenant or a “great reset” like humanity is going through right now. We are in the last of days of the way of life that we have lived for a long time.