Can One Be Christian and Not Believe In The Trinity?

[MonoBiblical]

It would be a lie though.

No it wouldn't

Jesus was God the Word , made flesh and who dwelt among us.

Which word in Greek speak?

 

[HealthyShape]

I don't see the name in the rest of the New Testament. What is interesting is that names are nouns in Greek, and Hebrew. They shall call his/its? name, Immanuel. Did they all name him Immanuel? no they named their event; God is with us. What kills this is that the article before his name is neuter. τὸ ὄνομα αὐτοῦ Ἐμμανουήλ,

I rest my case.

You are just jumping from place to place. Emmanuel is and was a regular personal name. Nothing pathetic about it etc.

We are not talking about if you like the name or whether Jesus was actually called this name by others.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Emmanuel is and was a regular personal name

You are just assuming it was a personal name.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

No it wouldn't

View attachment 74518
Which word in Greek speak?

You think I referenced the vocabulary when referring to The Word.


You should read John 1.

John 1 - The Word Became Flesh

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. In Him was life, and that life was the light of men.

biblehub.com

 

[ProverbsInPink]

You are just jumping from place to place. Emmanuel is and was a regular personal name. Nothing pathetic about it etc.

We are not talking about if you like the name or whether Jesus was actually called this name by others.

RE: That you notice they jump all over the place in their efforts at Exegesis.

Have you considered they could be a Bot?


Source: NBC News Researchers secretly infiltrated a popular Reddit forum with AI bots, causing outrage

 

[MonoBiblical]

You think I referenced the vocabulary when referring to The Word.


You should read John 1.

John 1 - The Word Became Flesh

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made. In Him was life, and that life was the light of men.

biblehub.com

LOGOS has a plural inflection in Greek--- LOGOI. So anything that is unit and informs is a LOGOS. Jesus is LOGOS in his name. Yahweh is a LOGOS in his name. et cetra.

The picture is about that. The word what?

Prepositions are LOGOI as well.

 

[HealthyShape]

RE: That you notice they jump all over the place in their efforts at Exegesis.

Have you considered they could be a Bot?


Source: NBC News Researchers secretly infiltrated a popular Reddit forum with AI bots, causing outrage

I do not know. Generally, some posters seem to significantly change their posting quality, one day quite cohesive and rational posting, another day unintelligible wording and an obvious problem to stay focused. There may be various explanations.

 

[Berean]

Are there any scriptures that declare one must believe in scriptures to gain salvation? Are there any scriptures that declare that one must believe in salvation to gain salvation? To believe in heaven? Etc.

And we could continue with such questions further and further, dissolving Christianity piece by piece.

Nice dodge, but you didn't answer the question.

 

[Berean]

The question is:
Are there prerequisites to being defined as Christian?

I'd say the top 3 are:
Belief that Jesus is God
thus
Belief in the Trinity
The resurrection of both Jesus and all persons, eventually.

The problem is, these are YOUR prerequisites, NOT God's.

 

[Berean]

No, that is the saving grace.
For the first 3 centuries there were two schools of thought. That there were Yahweh and Yeshua and Holy Spirit, 3 Gods or the Belief that there were 2 Gods and the Holy Spirit was not a God but the Spirit of Yahweh.
It was not until the 4th century that the 3 in 1 formula for the Trinity was forced on Christianity by the Roman Catholic Church.

Actually, you forget the Arian view, that there is one God, Yahweh, and one Lord, Yeshua, sent by God. That is my view.

 

[Grailhunter]

Actually, you forget the Arian view, that there is one God, Yahweh, and one Lord, Yeshua, sent by God. That is my view.

Arianism is often considered to be a form of Unitarian theology in that it stresses God’s unity at the expense of the notion of the Trinity, the doctrine that three distinct persons are united in one Godhead. Arius’s basic premise was the uniqueness of God, who is alone self-existent (not dependent for its existence on anything else) and immutable; the Son, who is not self-existent, cannot therefore be the self-existent and immutable God. Because the Godhead is unique, it cannot be shared or communicated. Because the Godhead is immutable, the Son, who is mutable, must, therefore, be deemed a creature who has been called into existence out of nothing and has had a beginning. Moreover, the Son can have no direct knowledge of the Father, since the Son is finite and of a different order of existence. And so He subordinate to the Yahweh.

A lot can be learned by the whole Arian thing.
The Catholic Church’s mission was to define one Christian belief. Not only to promote one belief but that turned into belief control to the extreme. Not only was it a fool’s folly it sent the Church down an evil and dark path to the point that historically all the good it did has been nearly forgotten due to the magnitude of it corruption and atrocities.

What can we learn from that? Promoting true beliefs are a good thing….but condemning is usually a bad thing. The Apostle Paul said, But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed! Galatians 1:8

They preached the truth and expressed the basics in a statement of faith we call the Apostle’s Creed that was recited before Baptism.

 

[Berean]

Arianism is often considered to be a form of Unitarian theology in that it stresses God’s unity at the expense of the notion of the Trinity, the doctrine that three distinct persons are united in one Godhead. Arius’s basic premise was the uniqueness of God, who is alone self-existent (not dependent for its existence on anything else) and immutable; the Son, who is not self-existent, cannot therefore be the self-existent and immutable God. Because the Godhead is unique, it cannot be shared or communicated. Because the Godhead is immutable, the Son, who is mutable, must, therefore, be deemed a creature who has been called into existence out of nothing and has had a beginning. Moreover, the Son can have no direct knowledge of the Father, since the Son is finite and of a different order of existence. And so He subordinate to the Yahweh.

A lot can be learned by the whole Arian thing.
The Catholic Church’s mission was to define one Christian belief. Not only to promote one belief but that turned into belief control to the extreme. Not only was it a fool’s folly it sent the Church down an evil and dark path to the point that historically all the good it did has been nearly forgotten due to the magnitude of it corruption and atrocities.

What can we learn from that? Promoting true beliefs are a good thing….but condemning is usually a bad thing. The Apostle Paul said, But even if we, or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed! Galatians 1:8

They preached the truth and expressed the basics in a statement of faith we call the Apostle’s Creed that was recited before Baptism.

The Catholic system, the Papacy, is antichrist

 

[CTK]

The Catholic system, the Papacy, is antichrist

Not to disagree with your comment but only on the choice of the words you used, but the papacy is truly the "little horn" of Daniel 7, 8 and 11. There is no literal individual anti-christ but there definitely is the "spirit of the anti-christ" that anyone preaching a false gospel could be labeled.

 

[Berean]

Not to disagree with your comment but only on the choice of the words you used, but the papacy is truly the "little horn" of Daniel 7, 8 and 11. There is no literal individual anti-christ but there definitely is the "spirit of the anti-christ" that anyone preaching a false gospel could be labeled.

Not an individual, it is the anti-Christ System

 

[CTK]

Not an individual, it is the anti-Christ System

Well, Danile 7 does give us a description that he will have eyes like a man and speaking pompous words... the papacy is certainly the little horn and he sits on the 4th beast kingdom - this is the "divided" kingdom that replaced pagan Rome after their demis in 476 AD (7:11). And also remember, Daniel 7 and 8 mentions that he will claim divinity, forgive sins, etc.,

 

[HealthyShape]

Nice dodge, but you didn't answer the question.

My answer is that without the basic Christian context, terms like "salvation" lose their meaning.

 

[HealthyShape]

There are no verses saying "you cannot be saved without believing in Trinity", but to which exact degree one can misidentify Jesus and God generally to still have the true salvific faith, is hard to guess.

 

[GodsGrace]

You will not find this statement from Christ in the scriptures. Mind shifter at work.

The mind shifter you're speaking of here is that the Jews were going to stone Jesus for blaspheming...

Sorry for delay....but I did want to reply to this.

Here is the passage:

John 10:22-33
22 At that time the Feast of the Dedication took place at Jerusalem;
23 it was winter, and Jesus was walking in the temple in the portico of Solomon.
24 The Jews then gathered around Him, and were saying to Him, "How long * will You keep us in suspense *? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly."
25 Jesus answered them, "I told you, and you do not believe; the works that I do in My Father's name, these testify of Me.
26 "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.
27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;
28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never * perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.
29 "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
30 "I and the Father are one."
31 The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him.
32 Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?"
33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."


Verse 24 Jesus was asked if He was the Christ...The annointed One...The Messiah.

Verse 25 Jesus told the Jews that His works tesitified of HIm...God.

Verse 31 At this point, the Jews picked up stones to stone Him.

Verse 32 Jesus asked for what work were they stoning Him.

Verse 33 The Jews replied: Not for any good work, but for BLASPHEMY,,,,because Jesus, being a man, made Himself out to be GOD.


So, yes, Jesus said He was God and for this the Jews were going to stone Him...for blaspheming.
Stating a person was God was punishable by death at that time.

 

[GodsGrace]

???????

In the 1st century there were two distinct Christian groups.....Jewish-Christians and Gentile-Christians which believed differently and practiced Christianity differently and they did not get along. By the time of the Ecumenical Councils there were several beliefs going on. For one thing they had no Bibles....They could not study the scriptures like we can.

True....but I made no such statement that would require the above reply.

THIS is what I stated:

God, when asked by Moses WHO was sending him...said to say:
I AM sent me.

Jesus, in the NT,,,,stated that before Abraham was...I AM.

Jesus used the same name as God Father did with Moses.

Exodus 3:13-14
13 Then Moses said to God, "Behold, I am going to the sons of Israel, and I will say to them, 'The God of your fathers has sent me to you.' Now they may say to me, 'What is His name?' What shall I say to them?"
14 God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM "; and He said, "Thus you shall say to the sons of Israel, 'I AM has sent me to you.' "


John 8-56-59
56 "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad."
57 So the Jews said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?"
58 Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am."
59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him


Again, we see that the Jews wanted to stone Jesus for claiming to be I AM....IOW, God.
God Father declared Himself to be I AM.
Jesus declared Himself to be I AM.

 

[GodsGrace]

I am in Greek?

In Greek what?
I don't speak Greek.

I AM means
I WAS
I AM
I WILL BE

I AM is always existing.