Is God Magnanimous? - (as opposed to tyrannical)

[Hiddenthings]

How is it you are quick to tell me how it is for me Hidden.....full of advice while patting yourself on the back?

This is all your doing, not mine - don't play that victim card again!

My conclusion is that your world is one where you consider yourself an unsolicited advisor as opposed to a bearer of good news.

I've spelled out the Goodnews many times and you have ignored all of it!

Even The Good News is hijacked, reworked and made to serve your theories so that it surfaces like a commodity for sale at prices you set.

It's all there spread out beautifully by the Apostles ready for you to dive in and immerse yourself in truth.

Yes, your advice and your hoops have a pious flavour, confess, repent, be baptised followed by further ratcheting to other sub categories, keeping your prisoners in anxiety, fear of judgement and the ubiquitous lack of assurance.

It’s all just empty talk, isn’t it? You’ve got nothing but a few verses that are twisted out of context, and even those are often misinterpreted within their chapters.

Why not put all that "wingy energy" to better use for your own benefit?

 

[Hiddenthings]

You are shameless in your attempts to pull me down Hidden. I know that spirit!

Your courage comes from within your nature, not from your faith. How can I say this? Because everything you’ve expressed is your own version of the gospel (small g), not the one taught to you in the Word.

This you and I can be 100% certain of.

 

[ProDeo]

What will happen to the people who were called, chosen and rejected at the judgement?

Okay, no answer to my question, fine, was it an unanswerable question? A hidden thing?

Here is (for me) another unanswerable question, but maybe you have wisdom.

Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth.

God said nothing about afterlife and judgement, no concept of hell, let alone the Lake of Fire, which BTW is only mentioned in the book of Revelation.

So, what is going to happen to those billions who never heard the Gospel because there was no Gospel yet, neither were they warned of judgement in afterlife.

Will God have mercy on those ?

 

[ProDeo]

@ProDeo Whether we’re speaking of the Old Testament or the New, the process has always been the same, whether it was Israel, the foreigner among them, or anyone who chose to join themselves to God and learn His ways.

If you want me to expand on each of these four steps - happy to do so anytime!

Sure thing, but then please try to give an answer to my questions. An "I don't know" is also an answer.

 

[Lizbeth]

I think he created us in his image because he desires friends and friendship....which I guess is a privilege over other creations.
I mean, servants don't have the same status as children let alone any talk of inheritance.

Jesus tells us in John 15:15
'I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business. Instead, I have called you friends, for everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you.'

Did His friends stop serving Him? Of course not. Friendship indicates a more intimate relationship based on love and regard than that of someone who is only a servant. But it doesn't mean to stop being His servants does it. Greater love has no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends. We are His servants and friends as well as being His children and brethren and wife/bride. But I hope you aren't saying we are His equal.

 

[Lizbeth]

@Lizbeth, I know this might sound painfully obvious, but I don't believe St. SteVen is aware of, or understands, what God has done in Egypt or throughout history. For SteVen, the Bible seems more like a 'choose your own adventure' book, where he skips the chapters that reveal God’s judgments and instead focuses on those that let him craft his own version of God. He attributes God with no Justice or Righteousness at all.

I'm really enjoying his posts because they provide an opportunity to teach truth. In a similar way, God works with both the wicked and the faithful, through His justice and judgment, the obedient learn to revere His Holiness.

Amen. Like darkness provides an opportunity and backdrop for light to shine. The Lord is SO wise!

 

[Lizbeth]

So strange that you just blindly ignore the "WHAT IF..."

Strange how you appear to be interpreting that. Well, God's word does test our hearts.

 

[Wrangler]

How is it you are quick to tell me how it is for me Hidden

Primarily because you are nothing special, though you pretend to be; the path to salvation is the same for all - including you. Simple.

 

[quietthinker]

Did His friends stop serving Him? Of course not. Friendship indicates a more intimate relationship based on love and regard than that of someone who is only a servant. But it doesn't mean to stop being His servants does it. Greater love has no man than this, that he lay down his life for his friends. We are His servants and friends as well as being His children and brethren and wife/bride. But I hope you aren't saying we are His equal.

Jesus is our brother.

 

[St. SteVen]

Strange how you appear to be interpreting that. Well, God's word does test our hearts.

Strange that you would think that your interpretation is the only valid one.

 

[Lizbeth]

Incorrect.

Acts 15:14: “Simeon hath declared how God at the first did (1) visit the Gentiles, (2) to take (3) out of them (4) a people for his name.”

Not all Gentiles will come to a knowledge of God or the Gospel only those He determines should be first called, then chosen and finally accepted or rejected like your Judas example.

Here is the process clearly given:

1. Visitation
2. Invitation
3. Separation
4. Dedication

@ProDeo Whether we’re speaking of the Old Testament or the New, the process has always been the same, whether it was Israel, the foreigner among them, or anyone who chose to join themselves to God and learn His ways.

If you want me to expand on each of these four steps - happy to do so anytime!

I'd be interested in seeing what you have on that 4-step process, if you have time to share it....please and thanks!

 

[Lizbeth]

Jesus is our brother.

Yes, in a manner of speaking, He is our ELDER brother......which speaks to authority. But that isn't all He is.

 

[Lizbeth]

Strange that you would think that your interpretation is the only valid one.

Just look at the whole chapter, which gives context to what is being said. It's not that hard, except for those who have an agenda of defending a false doctrine.

 

[Hiddenthings]

Okay, no answer to my question, fine, was it an unanswerable question? A hidden thing?

Here is (for me) another unanswerable question, but maybe you have wisdom.

Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth.

God said nothing about afterlife and judgement, no concept of hell, let alone the Lake of Fire, which BTW is only mentioned in the book of Revelation.

So, what is going to happen to those billions who never heard the Gospel because there was no Gospel yet, neither were they warned of judgement in afterlife.

Will God have mercy on those ?

Have you heard of the Cost of Creation principle?

 

[Hiddenthings]

I'd be interested in seeing what you have on that 4-step process, if you have time to share it....please and thanks!

"How God at the First"

The initial work of God is mirrored in the deliverance of a family of Gentiles from the oppression of sin (Acts 10:34-38; 11:14). Simeon’s testimony speaks to Yahweh's selection of a people for His Name in four distinct stages: Visitation, Invitation, Separation, and Dedication.

"Did visit the Gentiles" — Visitation

The Greek word for "visit" (epeskepsato) implies an inspection, looking upon, or searching for something with intent. God’s purpose is to select from sinful humanity a people who will respond to His goodness and demonstrate His qualities. This principle was revealed to Solomon when the great temple was completed in Zion. Yahweh declared: "If My people, which are called by My name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land" (2 Chr. 7:14). The divine blessing rests upon those who seek God’s restoration.

"To take" — Invitation

Salvation is fundamentally God’s calling. People are summoned to respond to His will. In this sense, the gospel is not merely a personal choice but an injunction to be obeyed, for God "now commands all men everywhere to repent" (Acts 17:30).

God takes individuals as a parent decides to have a child. It is the act of the parent, not the child; therefore, when called by the gospel, a person must respond.

"Out of them" — Separation

The Greek word ex (similar to ek, part of ecclesia) emphasizes the need for separation from worldliness for those seeking divine restoration (cf. 1 Cor. 6:17; Rev. 18:4).

"A people for His name" — Dedication

The name of Yahweh, first declared through Moses when Israel was delivered from Egypt and constituted as God’s firstborn son (Psalm 136:11), holds deep significance. To the Hebrews, a name represents more than identification; it expresses the character and purpose of its bearer. Yahweh’s name reveals His intention for manifestation, to be seen in His children who bear His character: "Now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is" (1 John 3:2). His children are those who reveal His disposition, as shown by the Son of His family: "For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother" (Matt. 12:50).

 

[Lizbeth]

This verse shows Jesus is NOT the unchanging God of Scripture. Why else would Jesus need perfecting through suffering?

Just like when He was baptized....not because He needed to be, but it was in order to fulfill all righteousness in obedience to the Father. He set an example for us and also was our forerunner and tip of the spear, making the way so that we could follow. He left behind His deity so to speak when He was found in the form of a man...

Phl 2:5-11

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:

That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (That means to acknowledge that Jesus Christ is God.)

 

[Hiddenthings]

@ProDeo

While you are thinking about the Cost of Creation principle lets ponder some verses together shall we?

2 Thessalonians 1:8-9

"He will punish those who do not know God

This refers to the Gentiles, those who are "without God" or "atheists" in the world (Ephesians 2:12; Galatians 4:8; 1 Thessalonians 4:5) who are estranged and alienated from Him (Romans 1:18-32; Ephesians 4:17-18). In the Old Testament, similar language is used to describe the "heathen" or the nations (Jeremiah 10:25; Psalm 79:6). Paul highlights these Gentiles for special judgment, particularly because of their active role in persecuting the Gentile believers in Thessalonica (Acts 17:5; 1 Thessalonians 2:14).

AND do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.

Here, Paul is addressing the Jews those who were well-versed in the Scriptures and should have been the first to accept the gospel of Jesus. These Jews, the natural descendants of Abraham (Romans 10:3), were the ones who, despite being enlightened, rejected the gospel in the first century (John 3:18-19; 9:31; 12:48-50). Unlike the Gentiles, who had less knowledge of God, the Jews had no excuse for their rejection. They were also staunchly opposed to the believers in Thessalonica and the surrounding areas (Acts 17:5,13).

They will be punished with everlasting destruction (permanent death) and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might."

I hope this first point helps clarify that those who have never heard the Gospel or have no knowledge of God are not held accountable for what they don't know. The free gift of life is their reward.

However, those who actively persecute God's people will not escape judgment for their actions.

 

[St. SteVen]

This verse shows Jesus is NOT the unchanging God of Scripture. Why else would Jesus need perfecting through suffering?

Wrangler does not believe in God the Son (Jesus) or God the Holy Spirit.
He denies the deity of Christ. (and claims that I am a demoniac) #446

 

[Hiddenthings]

@ProDeo

Now if you go over to Romans 1:21 we are given further insight into your question:

"For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened."

Consider the people in Noah's time: Genesis 6:5; 8:21. The idea is that mythology and idolatry arose from humanity's deep desire to recognize a higher power, yet their refusal to acknowledge God as the supreme authority led them to create substitutes. Interestingly, the verb "to become futile" in this context is closely related to a noun that was used for idols (Acts 14:15). Idols are empty and worthless, and worshiping them only leads to further futility and separation from the true, living God. This is similar to Daniel's rebuke of King Belshazzar in Daniel 5:23.

Everyone believes in some form of god, whether it's themselves or deities created by human hands.

Once again, this is the cost of creation, God knew that creating humanity would come with a personal price. This is why He grieved that He had made mankind during Noah's time, and throughout history, He has expressed in His heart...

I am not slow at keeping my promise, as some understand slowness. Instead, I am patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

Though in His foreknowledge He knew many would perish.

This is a reality that God accepted when He said, "Let there be light." While many may try to judge Him for granting free will and all its consequences, in the end, God knows who are truly His.

 

[Hiddenthings]

Wrangler does not believe in God the Son (Jesus) or God the Holy Spirit.
He denies the deity of Christ. (and claims that I am a demoniac) #446

This is because he has studied the Word of God and experienced its light. Meanwhile, you are still holding on to human creeds and pretending they come from God.