WATER BAPTISM CAUSES DIVISIONS

[Doug]

If Jesus said the kingdom was AT HAND...
it means just that.

Please find me a verse where Jesus, or one of the Apostles, states that the Kingdom is postponed.

There are no verses that say it was postponed. but it hasnt appeared yet
The kingdom isnt said to be established until after the tribulation........[Revelation 20:6 KJV] "Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

 

[Doug]

There is the Kingdom of God --- which is within us and dwells among us.

The apostles didnt think it was within them they were still asking when it would come...........[Acts 1:6 KJV] "When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?"

 

[Doug]

There is the Kindom of heaven --- which is after we die and are fortunate enough to go with God.

The kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are used interchangeably in the gospels................[Matthew 4:17 KJV] "From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."
[Mark 1:15 KJV] "And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel."..............It is the prophetic Davidic earthly kingdom................[Daniel 7:14 KJV] "And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion [is] an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom [that] which shall not be destroyed."
[Daniel 7:22 KJV] "Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom."

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I dont get your point here sorry
There is neither Jew or Greek divisions in the body of Christ

You do not know the writings of Paul well then. While we are all one body and no divisions, yet they are the distinctions between jew and Gentile.

Jewish Christians must be circumcised for it is an everlasting covenant between god and the descendants of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. They also must keep Sabbath as that is also an everlasting covenant between god and the descendants of Abraham Isaac and Jacob..

Paul also said that there is neither male nor female. So do you believe we are all androgynous?

These distinctions are rooted in how people were allowed to worship in the jewish system and not that these distinctions were totally eradicated. Many Christians had slaves.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I appreciate your concern
You are assuming I am disabled and are wrong, but I am not pursuing this

Then just know if you do not become part of a bible believing local assembly you are in sin and a rogue Christian. We need to be directly under the god given ministry of a pastor/teacher for our maturing.

Do not decieve yourself in thinking you are growing just by media and books. You may grow some, but your ability to be used by god becomes very very limited and so won't your peace, joy and experiencing the love of god. I say this not to condemn, but to exhort to find you r place in a local assembly.

 

[Doug]

Romans 11:13 PAUL STATES HE IS SPEAKING TO THE GENTILES
Romans 11:17 THE GENTILES WERE GRAFTED IN

Paul said there was a remnant of believers which I see as concerning the Gentiles who were grafted in to believing Israel. The Gentiles grafted in are those in Acts 10:45. Paul was skeaking to these Gentiles. NOT to those in the body of Christ

 

[Doug]

It's the same Jesus...
whether or not He had died yet.

Yes
Its the same Jesus but what he would accomplish by his shed blood on the cross wasnt yet made known in John

 

[Doug]

Don't you believe the OT believers were saved by the blood of Jesus?
Jesus died for everyone - past, present and future believers.

Of course but God didnt reveal that til Paul where he was justified to forgive the past sins of Israel they committed in the old testament...........[Romans 3:25 KJV] "Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;"

 

[Doug]

Paul knew nothing more that the Apostles.

Paul persecuted the church of the apostles. God saved Paul and revealed all Paul would write

 

[Doug]

I cannot think of one thing Paul taught that Jesus and His Apostles did not.

The twelve apostles didnt teach believing Israel would be in heavenly places. They only taught they would inherit an earthly kingdom

 

[Doug]

Paul and the Apostles taught the same.

Just one example
The apostles taught to be forgiven they had to forgive
Paul said we are forgiven all tresspasses

 

[amigo de christo]

Point to Christ JESUS to the end . Ecumenical interfaith will grave ever last soul who unifies with its ungodly lie .
Only JESUS saves and one MUST believe to BE SAVED .

 

[Doug]

Not going to discuss the travels of the Apostles.
Peter was in Rome.
If you don't care to believe it - fine.

I'll tell you what there is NO scholarly debate about:
JESUS' TEACHINGS to all of His followers....
ALL.

I dont want to either
Just google evidence for Peter in Rome and you cant conclusively say he did

 

[Doug]

I've offered scripture...
you don't accept it.

You said...................
Paul's PRIMARY task was to preach..NOT to baptize. This is correct.
However, we cannot say that he didn't TEACH baptism.

You said you gave me scripture where Paul said we had to be water baptized. I dont remember so could you give me that please

 

[amigo de christo]

Paradise awaits the sheep at the end of our f aith .

 

[Doug]

Apparently,l according to YOU, the plan you state above failed miserably since the Jews did not accept Jesus as their Messiah.

So...according to YOU...no one to lead the Gentiles in the "Kingdom" to the Lord.

Bad theology Doug.
Leave it behind.

I said.......................Israel had to be saved first to be priests in the millennial kingdom to lead the Gentiles in the kingdom to the Lord

Yes Israel did indeed reject him and didnt get the kingdom at that time but that doesnt mean they wont
Israel would be priests in the kingdom to lead the Gentiles to Christ..........[Exodus 19:6 KJV] "And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These [are] the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel."
[Zechariah 8:23 KJV] "Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days [it shall come to pass], that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard [that] God [is] with you."

 

[Doug]

Jesus spoke clearly.
He didn't go throughout all of Israel so that He would NOT be understood.

I'm not getting into discussing parables and why He used them and what He meant by the statement that some were not meant for them.

Perhaps Jesus wants those who hear Him to put their thinking caps on?
Just a clue.

Very well but with no animosity or condemnation intended you are saying what you think is ignoring and in spite of what scripture clearly says. Jesus didnt speak clearly but hid his teaching in parables............
[Matthew 13:10 KJV] "And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?"
[Matthew 13:11 KJV] "He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given."

In fact here is it said by the apostles that he finally did speak plainly........[John 16:29 KJV] "His disciples said unto him, Lo, now speakest thou plainly, and speakest no proverb."

 

[DJT_47]

But He baptized many! And The Corinth church had set up camps. It was not baptism but people following that caused division. You are in disobedience.

And Apollos was apparently doing the baptizing 1 Cor 3:6

 

[rockytopva]

Baptism causes division...

Baptism sprinkle - Just enough to dabble a little
Baptism dunk - Full immersion

Water - Dabble or dunked in water
Spirit - Dabble or dunked in the Holy Spirit

I just do not want to dabble around in the things of God. I want fully immersed!

 

[Adventageous]

[Romans 6:4 KJV] "Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life."
[Colossians 2:12 KJV] "Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with [him] through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead."...........I have heard it said that after salvation we should be water baptized. They justify this by misapplying these verses. They say water baptism pictures us being buried with him into death, and raised. These verses aren't speaking of water baptism, but rather, our baptism by the Spirit..........[1 Corinthians 12:13 KJV] "For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether [we be] Jews or Gentiles, whether [we be] bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit."

Church denominations all have different procedures in regard to water baptism. Some say it is by immersion, while others say it's by sprinkling. Some claim infant baptism, while others say only adults. Should we be baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost, or in the name of Jesus? The fact is, Paul doesn't command water baptism and there are no instructions in regard to water baptism to be found. Water baptism causes divisions in the church, the body of Christ. Water baptism caused division in the Corinthian church.........[1 Corinthians 1:11 KJV] "For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them [which are of the house] of Ce, that there are contentions among you."
[1 Corinthians 1:12 KJV] "Now this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ."
[1 Corinthians 1:13 KJV] "Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?"

I am going to respond to this in full. Please do not respond, until I am finished, and I will say, "I am finished" at the end of it. It will be lengthy.