Amil interpretation of 2 Peter 3:10-12 vs Genesis 9:15

[Spiritual Israelite]

@Spiritual Israelite asked:
"What are you talking about here exactly? Be specific."
@Earburner replied:
In post #110 I had been pointing out through scripture, that the false belief about God giving man an Eternal living soul directly opposes the words in Gen. 2:7, that "man became a living soul" through "the breath of life", which is Oxygenated AIR.
[7] And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
My three conclusions in post #110 are:
1. no one has ever been given an eternal soul, but rather have become a [mortal] living soul, and

A person is a living soul, but each person has a body, soul and spirit. Our souls and spirits do not die.

1 Thessalonians 5:23 Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[rwb]

NO! Not like it WAS at the first creation.
Most do not understand what the New is!!

It's all about WE who ARE the NEW CREATURES (not made over, enhanced or refurbished) but rather an entirely NEW Perfect creation, having Eternal Life IN IMMORTALITY, "whereIN [within] dwelleth [God's] Righteousness."
2 Peter 3
[13] Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Question:
WHERE does God desire to permanently indwell, with His Righteousness??
Ans. John 14:23; Rev. 3:20.

Did you do the Strong's word study about the word "mansion" and "abode"?
Compare-
G3438- mansions- John 14:3
G3438- abode- John14:23

We ARE NOT going to a mansion!!
WE ARE the mansions!!

Man who has been born again possesses eternal life through the Spirit of Christ in us the moment we believe. Though man possesses eternal life inwardly the moment we believe, we are still clothed in mortal body destined to die. That's why all who are of faith must be bodily resurrected immortal & incorruptible when the last trumpet sounds. That's when our eternal spirit as living soul in heaven will return with Christ to give life to our resurrected immortal & incorruptible body of flesh. This is when faithful man becomes whole having immortal body + eternal spirit, and together again become complete living soul. Exactly as we read the creation account when God created man from the dust of the earth (body), breathed His breath of life into the body (Spirit), and the two together became a living soul.

As long as faithful man continues to be alive in body of flesh & blood, we are only new creature inwardly through eternal spiritual life we receive when we have been born again.

Because we HAVE eternal life through the Spirit of Christ in us, the moment we have been born again, when our body breathes its last, we ascend to heaven a spiritual body without human form as living soul. This is the place the Christ has prepared for His people in heaven called mansions where as living souls in spiritual body reside with Christ until the last trumpet sounds and we receive resurrected immortal body.

John 14:2-4 (KJV) In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

Before departing from this world Jesus promised that He would not leave us comfortless saying: "I will come to you." When Christ does come to us we would know that He is in the Father, and we are in Him, and "I in you." The way that Christ manifests Himself to believers is through His Spirit who comes to us, to make His abode (staying place) within us. That's why Christ says, "we will come unto him (believers) and make our abode (home) with him".

John 14:18-20 (KJV) I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you. Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also. At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you.

John 14:21 (KJV) He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

John 14:23 (KJV) Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

 

[Scott Downey]

I would say it is relevant, Sodom and Gomorra were local and the flood was local. That’s important information when we look at 2 Peter 3.

The whole entire planet didn’t perish when He came in 70AD

Bible Gateway passage: Genesis 7 - 21st Century King James Version

And the LORD said unto Noah, "Come thou and all thy house into the ark, for thee have I seen righteous before Me in this generation. Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female; and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female. Of fowls also of...

www.biblegateway.com

17 And the flood was forty days upon the earth, and the waters increased and bore up the ark, and it was lifted up above the earth.

18 And the waters prevailed and were increased greatly upon the earth, and the ark went upon the face of the waters.

19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth, and all the high hills that were under the whole heaven were covered.

20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail, and the mountains were covered.

21 And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl and of cattle and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:

22 all in whose nostrils was the breath of life, all that was on the dry land, died.

23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man and cattle, and the creeping things and the fowl of the heaven, and they were destroyed from the earth. And Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.

24 And the waters prevailed upon the earth a hundred and fifty days.

 

[Scott Downey]

Genesis 6:17
And behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth to destroy all flesh wherein is the breath of life from under heaven; and every thing that is on the earth shall die.

All land creatures died, water creatures lived.

 

[Scott Downey]

Even so, some water creatures perished in the flood, we have their fossils and some fossils are high up on the sides of the mountains, so it was a global flood. God left us a sign of that flood in the rocks.

20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail, and the mountains were covered.

So then 15 cubits over the tops of the mountains the flood covered

 

[Scott Downey]

Marine Fossils on the Roof of the World: Why Seashells Are Found on Mount Everest

How did marine fossils end up on the Everest?

earthlymission.com

The world has their explanation, and we have our bible, often they do not agree. I do think the mountains could have been raised up higher after the flood, God reworked the surface of the world

 

[Earburner]

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Even so, some water creatures perished in the flood, we have their fossils and some fossils are high up on the sides of the mountains, so it was a global flood. God left us a sign of that flood in the rocks.

20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail, and the mountains were covered.

So then 15 cubits over the tops of the mountains the flood covered

Agreed 100%

 

[Earburner]

Marine Fossils on the Roof of the World: Why Seashells Are Found on Mount Everest

How did marine fossils end up on the Everest?

earthlymission.com

The world has their explanation, and we have our bible, often they do not agree. I do think the mountains could have been raised up higher after the flood, God reworked the surface of the world
View attachment 76802

Years ago, I also learned and read of this account. It is a sound, authentic Geological find, that truly is irrefutable.

If one would study the layers of the Earth's crust, they would learn that
Dinosaur fossils are found in the Sedimentary/Sandstone layer.
Rarely are they found in the Metamorphic layer, or in the Igneous layer.

The Sedimentary (Sandstone) layer was truly agitated and manipulated by water, whereby the remains of many drowned animals were fossilized in the settling sandy soil of the Sedimentary layer.

Though the scientific community have theorized their concept of "time" through the "Theory of Evolution", it does a poor job of convincing the reality of how marine fossils were discovered so high up in the mountains. The Bible description is above and beyond their understanding.

 

[ewq1938]

So then, according to your understanding, about the process of digesting "dead" food through the stomach and digestion system, we should conclude that in the New Earth, there will be sewage plants and septic systems for the sanitary means of disposing mortal "WASTE", that was excreted by billions of Eternally living Immortal people??

That's not God's idea or mine, of how having Immortality with Eternal Life works, forever and ever.

You can't speak for God on this, only yourself and your personal beliefs on this are pure opinion not based on scripture.

 

[ewq1938]

When one reads John 3:3-8, we will understand by God's Holy Spirit that in order for us to enter into the KoG, we MUST be born again of/by the Holy Spirit. In so doing, the reality of God the Father and God the Son PROMISE to take up residence WITHIN US, as their permanent "ABODE". John 14:23; Rev. 3:20.
So then, about the Lord drinking wine with us in the KoG, can you figure it out WHEN that takes place?
By His Holy Spirit you can know, IF YOU remove yourself from out under the teachings of men!
1 Cor. 2
[5] That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but [rather] in the power [authority] of God.

Mat 26:27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mat 26:29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

 

[Earburner]

You can't speak for God on this, only yourself and your personal beliefs on this are pure opinion not based on scripture.

I wasn't speaking for God. I was speaking on what you believe about Billions of Eternal living Immortal people, who eat, digest and excrete the waste of digested food.
According to your belief system, It appears that Sewage plants and Septic Systems will still be required in the New earth. Not to mention the fact that through the processing of food to eat, DEATH will not have been eradicated!

 

[grafted branch]

Marine Fossils on the Roof of the World: Why Seashells Are Found on Mount Everest

How did marine fossils end up on the Everest?

earthlymission.com

The world has their explanation, and we have our bible, often they do not agree. I do think the mountains could have been raised up higher after the flood, God reworked the surface of the world
View attachment 76802

Interlayered within fossil-bearing sedimentary rocks on all continents are layers of evaporite rock salt (sodium cride), gypsum (hydrated calcium sulfate), anhydrite (calcium sulfate), and various potash and magnesium salts, which are associated with red beds (shales) containing fossilized mud cracks. The mud cracks can form only under drying conditions that cause the mud to shrink and form polygonal cracks. The mineral compounds in the layers are deposited in the correct chemical order predicted by the solubility of each kind of ion in these compounds and whose increasing concentrations during the evaporation of water would cause them to precipitate in a predictable deposit sequence as the water evaporates and decreases. We would expect these evaporites to be at the top of the Noah flood deposits when the water receded and the land dried out, but certainly not in different levels in between older and younger fossil layers, which is exactly what is seen within the fossil-bearing sedimentary rocks.

We read in the Bible that there is only one time in which the flood waters recede and leave the earth dry, God promises to never flood again. That means only one flood, not multiple flooding and drying cycles. On that basis alone, the Noah flood can’t describe a whole-earth flood, but it could only represent a large regional flood.

 

[Earburner]

Mat 26:27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;
Mat 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
Mat 26:29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

In ref. to my post #157, please understand what the repentant thief on the cross sald to Jesus, and then what Jesus' reply was to him.
In that day of Jesus death, did not Jesus "come into" His Father's kingdom, acknowledging that the repentant thief will be there also? Yes!!
Wasn't it Jesus Himself who became "new" on His resurrection day?

You have your answer of when the Saints BEGAN to drink the "fruit of the vine" with the new Jesus in His kingdom!!
Clue: please understand KJV John 14:23 and KJV Rev. 3:20. When you partake of the bread and the wine, in remembrance of Jesus, IS NOT Jesus within you by the Gift of the Holy Spirit? Indeed He is!!
If not, then "you are none of his". KJV Rom. 8:8-9.

 

[ewq1938]

I wasn't speaking for God. I was speaking on what you believe about Billions of Eternal living Immortal people, who eat, digest and excrete the waste of digested food.

I said no such thing.

According to your belief system, It appears that Sewage plants and Septic Systems will still be required in the New earth. Not to mention the fact that through the processing of food to eat, DEATH will not have been eradicated!

No, this is false and imaginary on your part to exaggerate gross silliness because you somehow think it helps your argument that Jesus didn't swallow food after his resurrection.

 

[ewq1938]

You have your answer of when the Saints BEGAN to drink the "fruit of the vine" with Jesus in His kingdom!!

Ppl will drink wine in the next age is the context of the statement, not when it began as you errantly suggest.

 

[Earburner]

copied from post #174

I wasn't speaking for God. I was speaking on what you believe about Billions of Eternal living Immortal people, who eat, digest and excrete the waste of digested food.

@ewq1938 replied:
I said no such thing.

@Earburner responded:
Excuse me, but after the Lord returns in all His Glory, you don't believe that people having Eternal Life with Immortality, will populate the New Earth??
If so, then I apologize for my false assumption and conclusion.

 

[Earburner]

Ppl will drink wine in the next age is the context of the statement, not when it began as you errantly suggest.

In ref. to my post #173, I would like it that you be considerate and post all of what I said, instead of portions of it.That way "onlookers" can read the entirety of what I had presented.

Here is that part of #173 that you chose to ignore:
"In ref. to my post #157, please understand what the repentant thief on the cross said to Jesus, and then what Jesus' reply was to him.
In that day of Jesus death, did not Jesus "come into" His Father's kingdom, acknowledging that the repentant thief will be there also? Yes!!
Wasn't it Jesus Himself who became "new" on His resurrection day?"
Edit:
YES!! Therefore, his words in Mat 26:29 were an implication of his soon to be resurrection, NOT his Glorious return in flaming fire!!
"But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, UNTIL that day when I drink it [in my] NEW [resurrected being] with you in my Father's kingdom.
And that is exactly what we all do, who do HAVE "the Spirit of Jesus" DWELLING within us, as his born again Saints. John 3:3-8, 14:23; Rev. 3:20; Rom. 8:9.
We partake of the bread and the WINE at His table, in remembrance of Him.

Do you now recall the repentant thief's words to Jesus?
"Remember me when you come into your kingdom". Surely you do KNOW Jesus' reply!!

 

[Scott Downey]

Interlayered within fossil-bearing sedimentary rocks on all continents are layers of evaporite rock salt (sodium cride), gypsum (hydrated calcium sulfate), anhydrite (calcium sulfate), and various potash and magnesium salts, which are associated with red beds (shales) containing fossilized mud cracks. The mud cracks can form only under drying conditions that cause the mud to shrink and form polygonal cracks. The mineral compounds in the layers are deposited in the correct chemical order predicted by the solubility of each kind of ion in these compounds and whose increasing concentrations during the evaporation of water would cause them to precipitate in a predictable deposit sequence as the water evaporates and decreases. We would expect these evaporites to be at the top of the Noah flood deposits when the water receded and the land dried out, but certainly not in different levels in between older and younger fossil layers, which is exactly what is seen within the fossil-bearing sedimentary rocks.

We read in the Bible that there is only one time in which the flood waters recede and leave the earth dry, God promises to never flood again. That means only one flood, not multiple flooding and drying cycles. On that basis alone, the Noah flood can’t describe a whole-earth flood, but it could only represent a large regional flood.

The problem with that idea is what God said.
What did God say?
I quoted it. All land dwelling flesh that breathes air, God killed in the flood.
Except for what was in the ark.

17 And the flood was forty days upon the earth, and the waters increased and bore up the ark, and it was lifted up above the earth.

18 And the waters prevailed and were increased greatly upon the earth, and the ark went upon the face of the waters.

19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth, and all the high hills that were under the whole heaven were covered.

20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail, and the mountains were covered.

21 And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl and of cattle and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:

22 all in whose nostrils was the breath of life, all that was on the dry land, died.

23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man and cattle, and the creeping things and the fowl of the heaven, and they were destroyed from the earth. And Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.

24 And the waters prevailed upon the earth a hundred and fifty days.

 

[Scott Downey]

Peter says same too. Christ also.

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 17 - 21st Century King James Version

Then said He unto His disciples, "It is impossible but that offenses will come, but woe unto him through whom they come! It were better for him that a millstone were hung about his neck and he cast into the sea, than that he should cause one of these little ones to fall. "Take heed to...

www.biblegateway.com

22 And He said unto the disciples, “The days will come when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of Man, and ye shall not see it.

23 And they shall say to you, ‘See, here!’ or ‘See, there!’ Go not after them, nor follow them.

24 For as the lightning that lighteneth one part under heaven shineth unto the other part under heaven, so shall also the Son of Man be in His day.

25 But first must He suffer many things and be rejected by this generation.

26 And as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of Man:

27 They ate, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all.

28 “Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot: They ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built;

29 but the same day that Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.

30 “Even thus shall it be in the Day when the Son of Man is revealed.

31 In that Day, he that shall be upon the housetop, and his goods in the house, let him not come down to take them away. And he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.

32 Remember Lot’s wife.

33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it, and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.

35 Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

36 Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.”

37 And they answered and said unto Him, “Where, Lord?” And He said unto them, “Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.”

 

[Scott Downey]

you all need to consider what Christ teaches about His visible second coming, he came visibly with a body the first time, at the second coming, He returns in a visible glorified body, and every eye shall see Him and we who believe are changed to have the same kind of body He has.

The wicked unbelieving are cast into the lake of fire by the angels, And we inherit a new earth.

Matthew 13
34 All these things spoke Jesus unto the multitude in parables; and without a parable spoke He not unto them,

35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, “I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.”

36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away and went into the house, and His disciples came unto Him, saying, “Explain unto us the parable of the tares of the field.”

37 He answered and said unto them, “He that soweth the good seed is the Son of Man.

38 The field is the world, the good seed are the children of the Kingdom, but the tares are the children of the wicked one.

39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the world, and the reapers are the angels.

40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire, so shall it be at the end of this world.

41 The Son of Man shall send forth His angels, and they shall gather out of His Kingdom all things that offend and them that do iniquity,

42 and shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the Kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.