"Before Abraham Was, I AM"

[ScottA]

You said changes have been made to the Christian faith.
I said there were changes ONLY because some were teaching heresy.

If you think there have been other changes, just list some.
In your quotes above:
WHAT did Jesus get wrong in His statements.
You say they were correct, but then go on to say that some things did not happen.
This means Jesus was wrong.

It sounds like we are actually on the same page.

But what I said was pretty clear: Jesus was correct, the apostles were correct, but false teachers were not--and yet what those false teachers taught has been the basis for theology ever since. Meaning, Jesus and the apostles spoke of His return as imminent ("soon", "quick" and "must shortly take place"), while the false teachers not seeing Him return "by observation" (which Jesus said would not be the case) began to reinterpret and teach a false doctrine of His return in the distant future.

 

[GodsGrace]

It sounds like we are actually on the same page.

But what I said was pretty clear: Jesus was correct, the apostles were correct, but false teachers were not--and yet what those false teachers taught has been the basis for theology ever since. Meaning, Jesus and the apostles spoke of His return as imminent ("soon", "quick" and "must shortly take place"), while the false teachers not seeing Him return "by observation" (which Jesus said would not be the case) began to reinterpret and teach a false doctrine of His return in the distant future.

Are you speaking only about eschatology?

I can't think of anything that has been taught from the beginning that is wrong.
I believe OSAS is incorrect.
I believe we must get baptized at some point in our walk.
I believe we have to obey God and I get pushback for this.

 

[ScottA]

That makes it better....

21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him.

Sorry, but you put a line through the second "sin' when it is actually in the original manuscripts and should read: "21 He made Him who knew no sin [to be] sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."

 

[ScottA]

Are you speaking only about eschatology?

I can't think of anything that has been taught from the beginning that is wrong.
I believe OSAS is incorrect.
I believe we must get baptized at some point in our walk.
I believe we have to obey God and I get pushback for this.

Not from the beginning, but shortly thereafter, beginning with the false teachers Peter said would bring in "destructive heresies."

The heresies were: that Jesus would NOT return "soon", "quickly" and that all "must shortly take place", which they did against what He actually said would be.

 

[GodsGrace]

Sorry, but you put a line through the second "sin' when it is actually in the original manuscripts and should read: "21 He made Him who knew no sin [to be] sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him."

Ah.
OK.
But, of course, Jesus had no sin or He couldn't have died for the sins of the world.
(and it didn't make too much sense the way I had the strike thru).

Scott.
We need a Protestant POPE....
We all need to get on the same page!!
Gotta say good night.

 

[GodsGrace]

Not from the beginning, but shortly thereafter, beginning with the false teachers Peter said would bring in "destructive heresies."

The heresies were: that Jesus would NOT return "soon", "quickly" and that all "must shortly take place", which they did against what He actually said would be.

OK
I'm not very good with eschatology.
I DO wonder myself why it's taking so long.
AI might be the clincher.
And to God a thousand years is as a day....
I don't think about this too much.
More important to me is how God should be impacting our lives.
Gotta go.
'night.

 

[ScottA]

2. If Jesus never sinned...
WHY did He never sin?

What is it that induces man to sin?
Why can we not completely remove sin from our lives?

Jesus never sinned because He was obedient to the Law of our Father.

Mankind sins because we all were born "according to our kind" (Genesis 1:11)--"the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so." Interestingly--as metaphors go--Jesus was "the BRANCH"--"a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots."

 

[GodsGrace]

Jesus never sinned because He was obedient to the Law of our Father.

Mankind sins because we all were born "according to our kind" (Genesis 1:11)--"the fruit tree that yields fruit according to its kind, whose seed is in itself, on the earth”; and it was so." Interestingly--as metaphors go--Jesus was "the BRANCH"--"a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots."

I understand your point, but I just want to point out that when God said that all would yield according to its kind...He meant that a tree will make a tree, a human will make a human...each kind will reproduce its own kind.

God CREATED the first,,,but from then on all would have to RECREATE themselves.
Which is not even a good term because only God can create.
The correct term is REPRODUCE.

But yes, mankind will now reproduce himself after the fall and this means that man will have the sin nature.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Actually, only those who have faith have deeds that matter. You can have ALL of the deeds int he world, but they mean nothing without faith in Christ.

Then thou is smug without much reason.

Yes - but we're not really talking about doctrinal issues here. It's more about leadership.
John Paul the Great referred to Latin rite and the Orthodox and Eastern rites as the "Left and Right Lungs of the Church".

Leadership that doesn't care if the USA gets flooded with 3rd world immigrants?

 

[MonoBiblical]

No – rather the demons have an intellectual faith – not a REAL faith.

Pistis is not faith; it is trust. Try again.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Pistis is not faith; it is trust. Try again.

Pistis means ANY of the following - Faith, belief, trust, confidence, fidelity, faithfulness.

A Christian has trust, confidence, fidelity and faithfulness.
A demon has belief only (James 2:19) . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Then thou is smug without much reason.

Huh??
Deeds without faith are as filthy rags (Isa. 64:6).

Leadership that doesn't care if the USA gets flooded with 3rd world immigrants?

I completely disagree with the “open border” view.
But again – this is NOT a doctrinal issue.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Pistis means ANY of the following - Faith, belief, trust, confidence, fidelity, faithfulness.

A Christian has trust, confidence, fidelity and faithfulness.
A demon has belief only (James 2:19) . . .

Fidelity is not the same in Latin sir. It is just trust or belief. You are pushing the meaning of the word beyond its limits like a Protestant.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Huh??
Deeds without faith are as filthy rags (Isa. 64:6).

This has nothing to do with your protestant definition of faith which you hold to.

I completely disagree with the “open border” view.
But again – this is NOT a doctrinal issue.

But if you are not a socialist, then you aren't a trusting Catholic Christian.

 

[BreadOfLife]

This has nothing to do with your protestant definition of faith which you hold to.

No – you’re just bitter because I destroyed your 1-word = 1-meaning blunder.

“Protestant“ definition, indeed . . .

But if you are not a socialist, then you aren't a trusting Catholic Christian.

That’s nonsense – and ignorant nonsense at that.
I’m only bound to accept doctrinal teachings – NOT clerical opinions . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Fidelity is not the same in Latin sir. It is just trust or belief. You are pushing the meaning of the word beyond its limits like a Protestant.

Wrong. Greek is not Latin – and vice versa.

 

[MonoBiblical]

No – you’re just bitter because I destroyed your 1-word = 1-meaning blunder.

“Protestant“ definition, indeed . . .

That’s nonsense – and ignorant nonsense at that.
I’m only bound to accept doctrinal teachings – NOT clerical opinions . . .

No, it is because you are moron who defines faith as more than trust. But it is a horrible translation of a word which means trust.

 

[MonoBiblical]

Wrong. Greek is not Latin – and vice versa.

But pistis and fide are cognates for Greek and Latin. But most Roman Catholics don't know Greek, so you would ignore this.

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, it is because you are moron who defines faith as more than trust. But it is a horrible translation of a word which means trust.

A “moron” – really??

When an argument is lost, it usually means that ad hominem attacks are NOT far behind.
Thank for NOT disappointing .

But pistis and fide are cognates for Greek and Latin. But most Roman Catholics don't know Greek, so you would ignore this.

MOST people living in this aren’t fluent in Greek - or Latin for that matter – and that includes non-Catholics. However, we live in an age where it’s quite easy to find an answer . . .

 

[MonoBiblical]

A “moron” – really??

When an argument is lost, it usually means that ad hominem attacks are NOT far behind.
Thank for NOT disappointing .

MOST people living in this aren’t fluent in Greek - or Latin for that matter – and that includes non-Catholics. However, we live in an age where it’s quite easy to find an answer . . .

Yes, and the answer is that pistis does not mean obedience.