Who is "the god of this world"? God or satan?

[Keiw]

That's not an answer to my Q-
WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?
Please read these passages-

2 Peter 3:5-7
5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6through which the world at that time was destroyed by being flooded with water.
WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?

PSALM 33
6By the word of YHWH the heavens were made,

And by the breath of His mouth all their hosts.

7He gathers the waters of the sea together as a heap;

He puts the depths in storehouses.

8Let all the earth fear the LORD;

Let all the inhabitants of the world stand in awe of Him.

9For He spoke, and it was done;

He commanded, and it stood firm.

WHO SPOKE in v 9? THE WORD--- see verse 6.


Heb 11:3
By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible.


Again- WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD?
John 1:1,3 In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.
ALL THINGS WERE MADE through Him and without HIM NOTHING was made that was made.

WHO is the Word of God? Did an angel speak all things into creation? OR did GOD create thru HIS WORD who spoke?
What say you Keiw? WHO IS THE WORD OF GOD? - What does it say?

twisting gets one know where. All have a word on matters basically. So its not as you think.

 

[Keiw]

Genesis is the Foundation of All Truth that will follow.

Genesis and Hebrew is the KEY to unlocking the Riches of His Glory.

But you need the Ruach HaKodesh, which is the 2nd Promise of the FATHER

There is Only ONE WAY to receiving the Baptism in/of the Ruach HaKodesh = John 14:15-18

“If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

KEEP it the WAY The GOD intended:

"the god of this aionos/era has blinded the minds lest the glorious Gospel should shine into them."

We know that this passage clearly distinguishes between The God of our Lord Jesus Christ and "the god of this aionos/world"

Why is "aionos" used here? = that is what you need and @ewq1938 to discover!!! = yet you already know!!!

age
αἰῶνος (aiōnos)
Noun - Genitive Masculine Singular
Strong's Greek 165: From the same as aei; properly, an age; by extension, perpetuity; by implication, the world; specially a Messianic period.

Here is a clue = "If satan cast out satan..........."

Yes 2Cor 4:4 satan is the god of this world.

 

[Keiw]

No son can also be his own father. Only Oneness/Trinity deniers think something like that.

All sons are made by their Father.= reality.

 

[PS95]

twisting gets one know where. All have a word on matters basically. So its not as you think.

I posted scriptures and asked you who the WORD OF GOD is.
You refused to answer 3x.
2 Peter 3:5-7 fits Jws well.

 

[Button]

All sons are made by their Father.= reality.

And mother. Whose Mitochondrial, mother DNA , is found in everyone.

 

[Aunty Jane]

And mother. Whose Mitochondrial, mother DNA , is found in everyone.

If Jesus had a DNA test when in human form, he would not have carried a single gene from his earthly mother. If he did, he would have inherited her sin as both parents contribute to their offspring’s DNA....sin is a defect at the genetic lever or else it could not be inherited.

Sin causes humans to make silly mistakes, and to be prone to committing active sin....when consequential thinking should prevent it.
Being barred from “the tree of life”, death would follow as a natural consequence. (Gen 3:22-24)

We were not created to die....we were created to live forever in mortal flesh, in an earthly paradise that was to be our eternal home....but something went wrong when a rebel angel took steps to replace God in the lives of humans, in order to receive their worship.
The rest is how God gets us all back to square one....in his own time and in his own way....this is what many fail to understand.

His solution was painful but brilliant!....making sure that no rebellion could ever take place again....and his original purpose for mankind on this earth will go ahead as he first purposed. (Isa 55:11)

 

[David in NJ]

All sons are made by their Father.= reality.

What about the Word that was God = made/created???

Or Eternal Existence with the FATHER = John 17:5

Truth or Lie
We cannot deny
John 17 verse five

 

[David in NJ]

And Paul is speaking about Him in those 9 verses. Not once does Paul bring up satan in those verses. It's all about God blinding people.

God allowing the Jews blindness to remain = No Gentiles included in this passage of BLINDNESS

Now if the ministry of death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at the face of Moses because of its fleeting glory, will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? For if the ministry of condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry of righteousness! Indeed, what was once glorious has no glory now in comparison to the glory that surpasses it. For if what was fading away came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which endures!

Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at the end of what was fading away.

But their minds were closed. For to this day the same veil remains at the reading of the old covenant. It has not been lifted, because only in Christ can it be removed. And even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. And we, who with unveiled faces all reflect the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into His image with intensifying glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.

Satan is indirectly included in this passage
Therefore, since God in His mercy has given us this ministry, we do not lose heart. Instead, we have renounced secret and shameful ways. We do not practice deceit, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by open proclamation of the truth, we commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.

The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For we do not proclaim ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake.
For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made His light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Furthermore, FOUR important applications in this passage:
#1 - God is spoken of in present tense active on behalf of believers = "God in His mercy"
#2 - Distinguished from = "secret shameful ways, deceit, distorting the word of God"
#3 - Satan is mentioned above(#3) as these are his ways since chapter 3 Genesis and BEFORE, when he rebelled prior to Creation/Mankind
It is at this point in the juncture where "The god of this age" is the source of blindness in the minds of unbelievers

#4 - God's Mercy is Distinguished from "The god of this age" in the very last verse that sums UP this passage.
For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made His light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

Can you see the MAGNIFICATION of Distinction??? = Paul is quoting GENESIS ch1 & JESUS John 3:16

This is what you are alluding to = "For God so loved the world that HE blinded the minds of them who believe not the Gospel" = ???

Or, we can believe this = "The god of this world has blinded their minds thru "secret shameful ways, deceit, distorting the word of God" = John 3:19-20

"And this is the condemnation, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than Light, because their deeds were evil. For everyone practicing evil hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his deeds should be exposed

Who causes men to "love darkness" = Satan

NOTICE: JESUS never mentioned Satan in John 3:16-22, just as Paul never mentioned Satan in 2 Cor ch3 & ch4

NOTICE #2: There is a very LARGE group of people, both Jews & Gentiles, who God does give over to "believing a lie"
But they are not mentioned by Paul in this Letter for Paul will detail them in 2 Thessalonians

 

[Aunty Jane]

No. the pre-incarnate Jesus was not created because he is God the Son.

There is no such person mentioned in the Bible...please give me a reference where Jesus is ever called that?
This title was given to Jesus by Catholic trinitarians....it does not exist in Scripture.

See above.

Not an answer...just a programmed response...from someone who knows their theology but not the Bible.

The Son has no beginning. Only the human child born to Mary had a mortal beginning and ending but the one who incarnated is God and existed before Mary was even alive. He (Jesus) is the one who created all things because his father wanted it.

You ignored the Scripture I gave you....the pre-human Jesus existed because his Father created him....not in the womb of Mary but as the very first of his creation. (Rev 3:14)

Have you never thought about why Jesus and his Father were called Father and Son by each other? These are human relationships based on the fact that a father is responsible for the existence of his children.
He is “begotten” which means that he needed a ‘begetter’ who existed before him.

Does gender exist in heaven? Spirit beings have no gender, but God, his son and all his angels present as male. Do you know why? Do you know why all the positions relating to worship were all filled by males?

Trinitarians already understand this.

I’m sorry, but trinitarians understand their theology on a very superficial level. They know what they are told, but very few venture past the cherry picked verses used to support something that is not taught by Jesus or his apostles, who were all Jewish. To present a completely different God to the one who filled their Scripture was a bit of clever, well timed trickery by the one who rules this world.

This thread is already the evidence of that. Do you agree that the verse addressing the "God of the world/Aion" is speaking of God and not satan?

If you believe that God is ruling this world, then again you have little knowledge of Scripture....
Who was it that handed world rulership over to the devil, as stated by satan himself to the Son of God.

“And he led Him up and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. And the devil said to Him, “I will give You all this domain and its glory; for it has been handed over to me, and I give it to whomever I wish. Therefore if You worship before me, it shall all be Yours.” Luke 4:6-7 NASB)

Read it again....if Jesus knew that this was a lie, he would have challenged satan over that claim....Jesus didn’t say a word to contradict him. He could not give to Jesus what was not in his possession....and he could not possess it unless God handed it over to him. It’s there in black and white.....

Satan is the god and ruler that the humans chose in Eden, so Jehovah allowed him to prove his case....giving him what he wanted.....and up to date his rulership has failed in every way that humans have chosen to govern themselves....

The last one is what is practiced in the majority of “free” nations in the world today....democracy....but again it is disintegrating because of the corrupt nature of the humans in power.

Our God did not design us to rule ourselves or each other.....haven’t we proven that beyond a shadow of doubt? Corruption is always waiting in the wings, promising everything but delivering nothing.

Are you still falling for it?

 

[amigo de christo]

What about the Word that was God = made/created???

Or Eternal Existence with the FATHER = John 17:5

Truth or Lie
We cannot deny
John 17 verse five

I dont think he grasps to procreate verses create .
Jacob knew . It was why he told rachel when she told him
GIVE ME CHILDREN lest i die ,
AM I IN THE STEAD OF GOD , he has witholden your womb .
GOD didnt create JESUS . he created all things . And when i said HE
WELL i mean GOD . Wait I mean HIS WORD
Wait what am i saying THE WORD WAS GOD .
Hello folks . Time this generation learned something .
THE WORD was never created . THE WORD DID ALL THE CREATING .
And WHO created all things GOD DID . HE SPOKE , IT WAS . GOD in action friends .
Very troubling are the things i am seeing in this generation .
And worse it be getting ALL the time .
WE got us a generation that has never been so in love .......................
and i mean SO in love . ONLY IT AINT WITH TRUTH , its with a lie .
And now a word .
ALL who loved and made a lie . ever heard that phrase used . Beleive me the place they end up
IS the SECOND death lake of fire . TIME TO LOVE THE TRUTH , BUY THE TRUTH and SELL her not . to the trenches david .

 

[JLB]

Jesus' father did that, but yes.

Joh 12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
Joh 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
Joh 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

So you believe God the Father is the god of this world who blinded the eyes of the people of this world?


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16

 

[JLB]

I do not believe the verse is speaking about Satan being the God of this world. Satan is called the Prince of the world (not a God and not a King) but not the God of it. Certainly much of the world worships Satan in one form or another but in order to know whom is being spoken of we simply have to use the context:



2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Some will say it's a little "g" on god so that means its not God. Not so. There are no capitals vs. small letters in the manuscripts. The small g is purely the translators opinion.


So who was it that "blinded the minds of them which believe not"?

It was God.

John 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.


The HE here is God and this is very similar language. God blinded them so they could not convert and be healed! Isn't that what the other verse is saying?

Romans 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
Romans 11:8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear) unto this day.


God does the blinding!

While Satan can be considered a false god of this world, he simply isn't the one being spoken of because it is God which blinds so people cannot convert to Christ and be healed.
There are no capitals in the manuscripts.

Gen_24:3 And I will make thee swear by the LORD, the God of heaven, and the God of the earth, that thou shalt not take a wife unto my son of the daughters of the Canaanites, among whom I dwell:

Isa_54:5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the LORD of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.

Revelation 11:4 these are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the god of the earth.

Is this Satan because it is believed that saying "god of something" rather than just "god" means that it isn't the one true God? If Satan is the supposed "god of this world" then he must also be the "god of the earth" right?

Remember, there are no capitals in the manuscripts. god and God are spelled exactly the same way so we can't go by that. Naturally, context matters. Naturally, using other scriptures to help us understand scriptures matter. Forget tradition, forget what has been assumed for generations and look without assumption at all the evidence and decide who is doing the blinding in the world.

The god of this world is Satan.


We know that we are of God, and the whole world lies under the sway of the wicked one.
1 John 5:19

 

[Aunty Jane]

@Aunty Jane. Here is what I am talking about to another JW, but on a different site.

"What you need to know about archangels. Every country has its own archangel. Evil countries also have an archangels, but fallen angels all called princes. Like in Daniel 10, Persia's archangel is their prince. And the prince of Greece would rule next. Michael is the archangel of Israel, not the whole world. Jesus is not Michael. The prince of Israel is Michael. To Daniel, Gabriel said, "Michael is your prince. Daniel was a Jew. In Jude, Michael and Satan were fighting over the body of Moses. Why? Because Moses was a Jew.

1stCL The Bible speaks of only one Archangel.....”Michael”.
Identifying him as “THE Archangel” (Jude 9) means that there are no others by that designation.

The “princes” that Daniel speaks about are the demon princes installed by satan to mislead the nations and to misguide their rulers. God gave him world rulership. (Luke 4:5-7)

It’s scary to think that these “princes” are powerful entities put in place by satan to rule the nations he was given to control....but it appears that these are held in check by the princes that Jehovah himself has installed to keep some semblance of order. Imagine if they had free reign?!

When Daniel spoke of Michael as “one of the chief princes” what would a Hebrew speaking person understand that to mean? “Chief” in Hebrew there is “ri'šôn” and it means....”first, primary.....

רִאשׁוֹן riʼshôwn, ree-shone'; or רִאשֹׁן riʼshôn; from H7221; first, in place, time or rank (as adjective or noun):—beginning, eldest, first”.
So this agrees with the fact that this “chief prince” has the top rank or primary position of those who are assigned such positions. Michael fits that description.

Michael as the foremost Prince, is also spoken of as the chief of the angelic forces....and so is Jesus.
Michael is THE Archangel...the only one who is the Prince and Chief of all God’s angelic army.
It is these angelic princes stationed where the demon princes rule, that involves all the nations on earth.....not just Israel.

JW's are not the only ones to think this. Seventh-day Adventists know that before being born of a woman, Mary, the Word of God was called the Angel of the Lord. He is the only 'angel' mentioned in the Old Testament that allowed Himself to be worshiped.

No angel would allow himself to be worshipped.....if Jesus was an Angel of the Lord, he would have declined worship as other angels did. We have to understand the language used by the Bible writers.....so “worship” and “obeisance” are the same word, with context determining who was receiving “worship” and who rightly accepted “obeisance”. Do some study on those original language words.

“Worship” is used only for God...whereas those who had superior position or rank could receive “obeisance” as a mark of respect....as in the case of Jesus, it was not refused. The angels would rightfully give him obeisance...

In Australia the legal system was based on the British judicial system.....judges were addressed as “Your Worship” because it was believed that they deserved to receive honor in their positions.
The American system addresses judges as “Your Honor” for the same reason...it’s the same concept. Respectful honor is not worship, which is reserved for God Yahweh alone.

All other angels, even Gabriel would not allow worship. Adventists believe that Jesus was the Angel of the Lord in the Old Testament, but erroneously believe He is Michael the Archangel, just as you do. The difference between JW's and SDA's, SDA's know that Jesus is God.

There are quite a few differences between us and SDA’s, but neither of us believe that Jesus can be God incarnate because of what the Bible says about both.....

One glaring inconsistency is that Yahweh is an immortal who cannot die, no matter what form he takes.
The ransom or redemption price requires a death of equivalent value to pay the price set in Eden.....a sinless life was lost for all of Adam’s children, and a sinless life had to be given in exchange....only a being who could die would pay the set price....which is why Jesus was “sent” from heaven by his Father to pay the price of our redemption. (John 17:3: John 3:16)

Jesus is called, the Prince of Peace. That is not an archangel. In the same verse, Jesus is also called, the Mighty God, the Everlasting Father and Wonderful Counselor. Jesus is the "Child" Isaiah 9:6.

Look up all those titles in a good Concordance and see that they have multiple meanings....
Yes, Jesus is the child....but his titles do not mean what you have been led to believe that they do.

Jesus is the body of God. But the Father is His MIND. The mind is always greater than the body, but they are still one person. A weight-lifter only cares about his body, but he could be dumb as a snail."

Sorry, but I do not find that to be biblical reasoning at all....

Jesus was “sent” as a sinless human to repay a debt left by our father Adam....an awful inheritance.

God could never have been the equivalent of his own human creation.....he could not become a mortal, no matter how powerful he was....an immortal cannot pay the price of a mortal’s sin. That would be like using ten trillion cans of bug spray to kill one mosquito. All Jesus needed to be was sinless....not God. He had to be Adam’s equivalent to cancel the debt. Perhaps a lesson on what redemption meant to an Israelite might be in order....?

 

[amigo de christo]

What about the Word that was God = made/created???

Or Eternal Existence with the FATHER = John 17:5

Truth or Lie
We cannot deny
John 17 verse five

Truth or lie
we cannot deny
John seventeen verse five
On the words inspired of GOD the lambs shall thrive .
People better do an about face
And run to the true GOD of grace
And get back into the bible wherein be True words
or continue to feast on a harlots rotted doctrinal ..............
You fill in the blank . cause that be her doctrine .
BIBLE TIME
Oh the saints do sing and chyme
For anything contrary to such words in that book
comes of another who be THE CROOK
And that one cannot save one soul
And the end of those who heed the crook is fire brimstone and burning coal .

 

[ewq1938]

So you believe God the Father is the god of this world who blinded the eyes of the people of this world?

Yes, that is the context of the passage speaking of God blinding people two times in 8 verses.

Joh 12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed?
Joh 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
Joh 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

Do you think John is speaking about satan blinding people in this passage?

 

[1stCenturyLady]

immature response to a very mature answer given you = twice

You are doing it again. Yes they are of the same mind and nature. But when Jesus was on earth can you explain why only the Father knew the day and the hour of the second coming? It does not have to do with knowledge. But nature. That is why when we are born again, what is reborn is our old sin nature into a new creature. That is why the nature of the born again Christian is clean, not sinful.

Do you agree? Or do you believe in only what you have learned from some denomination of man. Dangerous.

 

[ewq1938]

The god of this world is Satan.


We know that we are of God, and the whole world lies under the sway of the wicked one.
1 John 5:19

No, he rules the world but God is the God of it.

Rev_11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

 

[amigo de christo]

So you believe God the Father is the god of this world who blinded the eyes of the people of this world?


For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16

of those Who BELEIVED NOT .
notice two key words . BELEIVE . or not .
but it cannot be both . that who so ever BELIEVES IN H IM should not perish but have everlasting life .
And the ecumenical WHORE of intefaith and her interreligious dialgoue
DONT PREACH THAT MESSAGE .
It hollers rather that mulsims , buddists and any other ists are serving the same GOD we do in different ways .
Again THAT AINT what JESUS said . HE SAID I AM THE WAY
and b eleive me HE BE THE ONLY WAY TO THE FATHER . so lets keep that IN MIND . get everone you know
out of anything that in any way shape , form or fashion is connected to ecumenicism . AND DO IT NOW .
the delusion is only GROWING .

 

[1stCenturyLady]

When Daniel spoke of Michael as “one of the chief princes”

There are more than one country that are under God. America used to be at its conception. Therefore, we also have one of the chief princes. Persia and Greece were both under different princes - fallen archangels.

I think we will have to agree to disagree as you won't be able to change my mind. I KNOW when I have been given revelation not just book learning from a denomination.

 

[amigo de christo]

No, he rules the world but God is the God of it.

Rev_11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.

He is only allowed to do so . GOD is in control .
But lets not forget
IF THE PROPHET be decieved I THE LORD GOD have DECIEVED that prophet .
OH yeah . GOD allows . And HE will answer any man according to the idols OF his heart .
That too is a fact . ONE that the nar realm , popes and scores of others KNOW NOTHING about .
SEEING they been given over to such a delusion and THINK ITS OF GOD and have no idea
Its of the other one who is allowed to decieve them . watch out folks
cause that other one has a HARLOT at work who pumps her ecumeincal cup of whoredomes she calls love
UNTO THE WORLD and much of even christendom has taken a sip outta that cup .