THE GOSPEL AND HEALING

[Doug]

before your Father In Heaven in your prayer!

Does this save you?
What scripture are you referring to in saying this

 

[LoveYeshua]

For you to say that reflects your lack of understanding scripture
If you read scripture it is readily apparent Jesus taught another message
You cant find Jesus preaching his death and resurrection for the salvation of all. He and the twelve preached only faith in his name which was for them to believe he was their Messiah the Son of God

Israel diminished and the earthly kingdom offer with it. The gospel of the kingdom will be preached again in the tribulation

If the kingdom arrived with Christ on earth then why did the disciples ask if he would restore it again? Why would they be looking for a kingdom that was already here?

Doug, christ announced his death, told them why. jesus SHOWED HIS CRUCIFIXION DEATH AND RESURRECTION, how can you say he did not preach it? He lived it they all saw it......they wrote about it!!!!!!!!

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You can be Biblical but not dispensational. Confession was for Israel in the Bible not us
Are you going to thrown out of the synagogue for confessing Jesus is the Messiah the Son of God?

Have no idea what you are trying to get at here. I am offline for 10 days, will pick back up then.

And yes you can have many correct doctrines as a covenant/allegorical heremneutical biblicist. However as you take many things allegorically, it leaves way too many of Gods word left to mans opinion as to what He meant instead of accepting what is written.

I am offline for ten days. Will pick back up then.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Does this save you?
What scripture are you referring to in saying this

Im short of time but will get back to you soon.

 

[Doug]

Doug, christ announced his death, told them why. jesus SHOWED HIS CRUCIFIXION DEATH AND RESURRECTION, how can you say he did not preach it? He lived it they all say it......they wrote about it!!!!!!!!

What scripture says Jesus told them why he would die and rise the third day?
He only told them that he would be crucified and rise again not why

 

[Doug]

Have no idea what you are trying to get at here. I am offline for 10 days, will pick back up then.

And yes you can have many correct doctrines as a covenant/allegorical heremneutical biblicist. However as you take many things allegorically, it leaves way too many of Gods word left to mans opinion as to what He meant instead of accepting what is written.

I am offline for ten days. Will pick back up then.

What I am getting at is that we arent required to confess him. Jesus was only speaking to Israel here...................
[Matthew 10:32 KJV] "Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven."
[Matthew 10:33 KJV] "But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."..............if you think you need to confess you are being Biblical because confession is in the Bible, but you arent being dispensational because you are saying what was for Israel I will say is for me

 

[LoveYeshua]

For you to say that reflects your lack of understanding scripture
If you read scripture it is readily apparent Jesus taught another message
You cant find Jesus preaching his death and resurrection for the salvation of all. He and the twelve preached only faith in his name which was for them to believe he was their Messiah the Son of God

Israel diminished and the earthly kingdom offer with it. The gospel of the kingdom will be preached again in the tribulation

If the kingdom arrived with Christ on earth then why did the disciples ask if he would restore it again? Why would they be looking for a kingdom that was already here?

Here is a clear, direct answer you can post. Simple language, gloves off, and grounded only in Jesus and the twelve.

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Doug, this ""You cant find Jesus preaching his death and resurrection for the salvation of all."" is simply not true, and Scripture proves it.

Jesus did preach His death and resurrection, and He did it before the cross, repeatedly, and He said it was necessary for salvation.
Jesus did not just say “believe I am Messiah” and stop there. He explained what the Messiah must do.
Jesus said plainly, “The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected… and be killed, and after three days rise again” (Mark 8:31, ASV).
This was not hidden. He said it openly.

Jesus tied His death directly to life and salvation. He said, “As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; that whosoever believeth may in him have eternal life” (John 3:14–15, ASV).
That is the cross. That is salvation language.

Jesus said, “The bread which I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world” (John 6:51, ASV).
That is not just “believe my name.” That is His death for the world.

At the Last Supper, Jesus said, “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many unto remission of sins”(Matthew 26:28, ASV).
Forgiveness of sins comes through His blood. That is the gospel.

After the resurrection, Jesus Himself explained the message to the disciples:
“Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer, and rise again from the dead the third day; and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name unto all the nations” (Luke 24:46–47, ASV).
Jesus defines the gospel here. Suffering. Resurrection. Repentance. Forgiveness. All nations.

Now look at the twelve. They preached exactly this, not something new.

Peter said, “Jesus of Nazareth… ye by the hand of lawless men did crucify and slay: whom God raised up” (Acts 2:22–24, ASV).
Later Peter said, “Those things, which God foreshewed… that his Christ should suffer, he thus fulfilled” (Acts 3:18, ASV).

That is the same message Jesus taught them before the cross and explained after the resurrection.

So no, Jesus did not preach “another message,” and the twelve did not preach a temporary gospel. The problem is not Jesus changing messages. The problem is later teaching that separates what Jesus kept together.

Jesus preached one gospel:
His death for sins, His resurrection, repentance, obedience, and the kingdom of God for all nations.

If someone says Jesus did not preach that, They are disagreeing with Jesus’ own words.

The idea that the twelve preached a temporary gospel

Israel diminished and the earthly kingdom offer with it. The gospel of the kingdom will be preached again in the tribulation.e tribulation DOUG we are now very close to the start of the tribulation I recieved visions of this ,amy timea always the same one, thus confirmed. this if why I do post about it, it is perhaps time for me to do so again.

As I stated elsewhere this idea makes Paul one of the twelve. He was just preaching a more complete gospel. The problem is exactly what you said, he wasnt with Jesus from the beginning and therefore could not be numbered with them

You said Paul couldnt say anything different. Jesus taught the law. Paul taught we arent under the law. Not the same

sorry Doug I must correct a serious mistake here the 12 was deplace by the disciple and it was not paul according to scripture and this is clear,

Here is the full, clear context from Acts, showing why the twelve had to be complete again and what was required of the man chosen. This answers the issue directly, using Scripture alone, no speculation.

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After Judas fell, Peter stood up and explained why another apostle had to be chosen.

Acts 1:15–17 (ASV)

And in these days Peter stood up in the midst of the brethren, and said (and there was a multitude of persons gathered together, about a hundred and twenty), Brethren, it was needful that the scripture should be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spake before by the mouth of David concerning Judas, who was guide to them that took Jesus. For he was numbered among us, and received his portion in this ministry.

Peter makes it clear Judas was truly one of the twelve, and his loss left a real vacancy that had to be filled according to Scripture.

Then Peter explains the requirement for the replacement. This is the key point many miss.

Acts 1:21–22 (ASV)

Of the men therefore that have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and went out among us, beginning from the baptism of John, unto the day that he was received up from us, of these must one become a witness with us of his resurrection.

This is crucial.
The replacement must:

• Have followed Jesus from the beginning
• Have witnessed His ministry
• Have witnessed His resurrection

That means the foundation of the apostolic message was already fixed:
Jesus’ life, His death, and His resurrection.

Then they prayed, showing this was God’s choice, not man’s idea.

Acts 1:24–25 (ASV)

And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, who knowest the hearts of all men, show of these two the one whom thou hast chosen, to take the place in this ministry and apostleship from which Judas fell away, that he might go to his own place.

Finally, the choice is made.

Acts 1:26 (ASV)

And they gave lots for them; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

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Why this matters and must be understood​

The twelve were restored before Paul ever appears in Acts.

And the requirement proves something very important:
The apostles were chosen to be witnesses of the resurrection, not just teachers of “faith in a name.”

This completely refutes the claim that Jesus and the twelve preached a message that did not include His death and resurrection.

The resurrection was so central that no one could be an apostle without witnessing it.

That means the gospel preached by Jesus, confirmed by the twelve, and carried to the nations was one message, not different gospels for different times.

Jesus did not change the message.
The apostles did not invent a new one.
They testified to what they had seen and heard, exactly as Jesus commanded.

If the kingdom arrived with Christ on earth then why did the disciples ask if he would restore it again? Why would they be looking for a kingdom that was already here?

Because they were asking about the final restoration, not the beginning.

The kingdom had already arrived with Jesus, but it was not yet completed. Jesus taught that God’s rule begins now and is finished later when He returns.

So in Acts 1:6 they were asking when the kingdom would be fully restored, not whether it existed.

 

[LoveYeshua]

As I stated elsewhere this idea makes Paul one of the twelve. He was just preaching a more complete gospel. The problem is exactly what you said, he wasnt with Jesus from the beginning and therefore could not be numbered with them

You said Paul couldnt say anything different. Jesus taught the law. Paul taught we arent under the law. Not the same

Paul being difficult to understand, it took me time to understand that most the the verses where Paul seem to be against the "LAW" he is in fact mentioning the law of Moses, it is different than the ten commandments, the law of Moses were set for the peoples who escaped the egyptians, they knew nothing, had no education, worshipped idols and had forgotten about God, they needed all these instructions at that time, today what do we need from the levetical laws, atomenent sacfifices... none of these. but the 10 Commandments remain, it is why Jesus was teaching them and explained how to follow them with the heart and not with strict letters written on stone, the commandments are Love and Mercy and Forgiveness.

paul was concetrating on the Name of Jesus and the Cross the meaning, but did he teach the ten commandments? he mentionned once that the commandments are good and just but it is about it. do not forget the original 12 were preaching all Jesus did and SAID. many forget this, please dont.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Does this save you?
What scripture are you referring to in saying this

YES!

Here are the full verses, only Jesus’ words, from the ASV, without shortening.

Asking in Jesus’ name

John 14:13–14 (ASV)

And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If ye shall ask me anything in my name, that will I do.

John 15:16 (ASV)

Ye did not choose me, but I chose you, and appointed you, that ye should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should abide: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

John 16:23–24 (ASV)

And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, If ye shall ask anything of the Father, he will give it you in my name. Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be made full.

Jesus saying He is always with us

Matthew 28:18–20 (ASV)

And Jesus came to them and spake unto them, saying, All authority hath been given unto me in heaven and on earth. Go ye therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit: teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I commanded you: and lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world.

Asking our Father in the name of Jesus does confess your beliefs in Christ, but one must ask in faith and pure heart with good intentions as God knows our heart better than ourselves do.

 

[LoveYeshua]

What scripture says Jesus told them why he would die and rise the third day?
He only told them that he would be crucified and rise again not why

Jesus did say clearly that He would rise on the third day, and He explained it more than once. Here are the key verses, straight and clear (ASV).

Mark 8:31 (ASV)

And he began to teach them, that the Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected by the elders, and the chief priests, and the scribes, and be killed, and after three days rise again.

Matthew 16:21 (ASV)

From that time began Jesus to show unto his disciples, that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and the third day be raised up.

Luke 9:22 (ASV)

saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and the third day be raised up.

Jesus connects the “three days” to prophecy

Matthew 12:40 (ASV)

for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

After the resurrection, Jesus reminds them He already said this

Luke 24:46 (ASV)

and he said unto them, Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer, and rise again from the dead the third day.

So the record is clear:
Jesus did not just predict death and resurrection in general.
He specifically said He would rise on the third day, and He said it before it happened.

 

[Doug]

Jesus did preach His death and resurrection, and He did it before the cross, repeatedly, and He said it was necessary for salvation.
Jesus did not just say “believe I am Messiah” and stop there. He explained what the Messiah must do.
Jesus said plainly, “The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected… and be killed, and after three days rise again” (Mark 8:31, ASV).
This was not hidden. He said it openly.

Jesus was only telling them he would be crucified and rise again. Jesus didnt say what it would accomplish. People know of the death and resurrection for salvation and read into verses like this. Just read what it says not what you want it to say. Jesus didnt say and after this is accomplished you will preach my death and resurrection for salvation.

 

[Doug]

Jesus tied His death directly to life and salvation. He said, “As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up; that whosoever believeth may in him have eternal life” (John 3:14–15, ASV).
That is the cross. That is salvation language.

[John 3:14 KJV] "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:"...................Once again you are reading the cross where it isn't. Let's look at the passage not just the verse.

[John 3:15 KJV] "That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.".......................Jesus is saying the Son of man must be lifted up so that whosoever BELIEVES ON HIM will have eternal life. There is nothing saying to believe on his death and resurrection.

[John 3:16 KJV] "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life."
[John 3:17 KJV] "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved."................Once again Jesus says to BELIEVE IN HIM. That's all he is saying. He says nothing of the cross for salvation

[John 3:18 KJV] "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.".................What is meant by BELIEVING ON HIM? It says in this verse what it means, it means TO BELIEVE IN HIS NAME. Nothing about the cross/nothing about his death and resurrection. To believe in his name is to believe he is their Messiah, the Son of God............[John 20:31 KJV] "But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name."

 

[Doug]

Jesus said, “The bread which I will give is my flesh, for the life of the world” (John 6:51, ASV).
That is not just “believe my name.” That is His death for the world.

You have to look at the surrounding verses. He said nothing of the cross or his death and resurrection....................[John 6:47 KJV] "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life."..............He was saying to believe on him which we saw was to believe on his name...............[John 3:18 KJV] "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

 

[Doug]

At the Last Supper, Jesus said, “This is my blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many unto remission of sins”(Matthew 26:28, ASV).
Forgiveness of sins comes through His blood. That is the gospel.

Jesus shed his blood for the new testament which was only to forgive the sins Israel committed under the first testament

 

[Doug]

After the resurrection, Jesus Himself explained the message to the disciples:
“Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer, and rise again from the dead the third day; and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name unto all the nations” (Luke 24:46–47, ASV).
Jesus defines the gospel here. Suffering. Resurrection. Repentance. Forgiveness. All nations.

Look closely and see that remission of sins wasn't by the cross they were to preach not the cross, but HIS NAME

 

[Doug]

Peter said, “Jesus of Nazareth… ye by the hand of lawless men did crucify and slay: whom God raised up” (Acts 2:22–24, ASV).
Later Peter said, “Those things, which God foreshewed… that his Christ should suffer, he thus fulfilled” (Acts 3:18, ASV).

Peter wasnt preaching the cross for salvation he was condemning Israel for crucifying Jesus

 

[Doug]

This is crucial.
The replacement must:

• Have followed Jesus from the beginning
• Have witnessed His ministry
• Have witnessed His resurrection

That means the foundation of the apostolic message was already fixed:
Jesus’ life, His death, and His resurrection.

You are reading into this.

 

[Doug]

Because they were asking about the final restoration, not the beginning.

The kingdom had already arrived with Jesus, but it was not yet completed. Jesus taught that God’s rule begins now and is finished later when He returns.

So in Acts 1:6 they were asking when the kingdom would be fully restored, not whether it existed.

The kingdom they were asking about was the Davidic covenant in which Jesus would rule the nations and the twelve with him judging the twelve tribes. Jesus would sit on David's throne. None of this was even partially fulfilled as you say.

 

[Doug]

paul was concetrating on the Name of Jesus and the Cross the meaning, but did he teach the ten commandments? he mentionned once that the commandments are good and just but it is about it. do not forget the original 12 were preaching all Jesus did and SAID. many forget this, please dont.

Here is my post on this

PAUL REFLECTS THE TEN COMMANDMENTS​

 

[Doug]

YES!

Here are the full verses, only Jesus’ words, from the ASV, without shortening.

Asking in Jesus’ name

John 14:13–14 (ASV)


John 15:16 (ASV)


John 16:23–24 (ASV)


Jesus saying He is always with us

Matthew 28:18–20 (ASV)


Asking our Father in the name of Jesus does confess your beliefs in Christ, but one must ask in faith and pure heart with good intentions as God knows our heart better than ourselves do.

We are saved by believing Paul's gospel, that Christ died for our sins and rose for our justification

All the verses you gave were for Israel not us