Why doesn't your "whole Bible view" include Universalism?

[shepherdsword]

We are all born dead. Spiritually dead. We are born carnal. When we are baptized into Christ we are baptized into his death.

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Not everyone is baptised

That is the death that matters.

Heb 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

And this is physical death

1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

Our physical death is not first death.

Mat 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.

Physical death is the first death. Nothing you posted refutes that

Jhn 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that i8I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

This has nothing to do with death

The lake of fire is not literal and neither is second death.

The lake of fire IS literal and the scripture itself states it is the second death.
Rv 20:11-15
Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. From his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them. 12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done. 13 And the sea gave up the dead who were in it, Death and Hades gave up the dead who were in them, and they were judged, each one of them, according to what they had done. 14 Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15 And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

Second death is judgment to destroy the man of sin, the carnal mind. We will all go through this fire. Some now, in this life/age but most later.

See above, where the scripture itself defines it.

 

[shepherdsword]

Perdition in Greek is....“apōleia” which is translated as...
“Destruction...waste...wasted....perish...perdition”

It is used in Scripture 18 times....14 times as “destruction”.

So anyone who faces this sentence is “destroyed”....they cease to live. They “perish”.

It would be nice if you were right....unfortunately you are not.

 

[Lizbeth]

Dead is dead.
No need to add "eternally" to it.
When you are dead you will remain dead until you are resurrected.
It seems to me, Christianity claims that we do not die with their "eternal life" doctrine.

Jhn 11:25-26
Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?


1Co 6:9-11
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.


Gal 5:19-21
Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


Gal 6:7-8
Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.


Rev 22:15
For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

 

[St. SteVen]

No confusion, it's very simple. The "sentence" for sin is death, and the only way to secure a "pardon" is through faith in Christ....we need to have our names written in the Lamb's book of life.

What is the point of a judgement then?
We're all sinners.

 

[St. SteVen]

It would be nice if you were right....unfortunately you are not.

Are you the Doctrine Gestapo, or what? #422
Judge not, lest ye be judged.

cc: @Aunty Jane

 

[Lizbeth]

What is the point of a judgement then?
We're all sinners.

We will all face judgment..........whether we are shown clemency or not is the question. Those in the Lamb's book of LIFE will not see death....the second death. That can't be said of those who are not in the Lamb's book of LIFE.

 

[St. SteVen]

We will all face judgment..........whether we are shown clemency or not is the question. Those in the Lamb's book of LIFE will not see death....the second death. That can't be said of those who are not in the Lamb's book of LIFE.

What about these folks? (whole Bible view)

Romans 2:14-16 NIV
(Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law,
do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves,
even though they do not have the law.
15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts,
their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts
sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.)
16 This will take place on the day when God judges people’s secrets
through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

 

[shepherdsword]

Are you the Doctrine Gestapo, or what?
Judge not, lest ye be judged.

cc: @Aunty Jane

You need to google "judge" because you obviously misunderstand it. In fact...you are doing the very thing you are complaining about. I guess anyone that disagrees with your demonic doctrines is judged by you as "Doctrine Gestapo"

 

[Beebster]

God never gave us humans immortality....he made us mortal for a reason....but he never intended for us to die, so he gave the humans the means to go on living.....as long as they obeyed his command, they would have access to “the tree of life”.....all creation was declared to be “very good” by the Creator at the close of the 6th “day”.....but after that, a rebel spirit derailed God’s first purpose by enticing the woman to disobey God, promising her that ‘she would not die’....she in turn enticed her husband to also disobey. What was the result? (Gen 3:22-24)

The way you make it sound, God set himself up for failure.
I tell you, everything that happened in the garden was God's intention.

We all die because of what Adam chose to do. (Rom 5:12).....and most of us will be resurrected when the Kingdom of God is finally ruling the earth....according to Jesus. (John 5:28-29)

We will all be resurrected.

He paid for our sins and he will be the one to restore the lives we lost. But not all will receive a resurrection.....there is a place where God sends the incorrigibly wicked....to remain dead forever....”Gehenna”.

When Jesus spoke of Gehenna he was speaking in figurative language; he was speaking about judgment by fire.

He was comparing a literal trash heap with a spiritual trash heap. JUDGMENT.

Paul speaks of it here:

1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

And God alone is the one who sentences them to that eternal death.

Thou shalt not kill.
Rules for thee but not for me.

The resurrection is a return to life...not a continuation of it in the spirit realm.

In it's simplest form yes.
However Jesus Christ says he is the resurrection.

Jhn 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

The dead are not in a conscious state. (Eccl 9:5, 10) They know nothing...feel nothing....can do nothing.

True.
Now apply that to being spiritually dead.

What do you see as our purpose here? Why did God create us as mortal beings on a material earth, if we have to endure suffering and pain and loss...? What is the end result?

To become sons and daughters of the living God.

 

[St. SteVen]

You need to google "judge" because you obviously misunderstand it. In fact...you are doing the very thing you are complaining about. I guess anyone that disagrees with your demonic doctrines is judged by you as "Doctrine Gestapo"

You need to Google "social skills" so you can learn to get along with others.

 

[amigo de christo]

What is the point of a judgement then?
We're all sinners.

Look again at what you just wrote .
you said a truth . we are all sinners .
so start preaching the name of the ONE who came TO SAVE SINNERS and call them to repentance and faith IN HIM .
You are in love with a love that is of this w orld . and its a love that satan uses
to keep the world trapped in a lie . Preach the real solution and not the false one .
PREACH JESUS and the DIRE NEED TO BELIEVE ON HIM and not rather the universal lie of satan
who has always desired the death of man
And thus he will always continue to bring a lie cloaked with truth in order to keep folks decieved .
You bought a lie my friend . TIME to buy the TRUTH and TIME to preach the TRUTH .
THAT ALL SOULS NEED to repent and beleive on JESUS in order to be saved .
AND as THIS SAVOIR once said , more than once actually , IF YE BELEIVE NOT that i am HE , THEN YE SHALL DIE IN YOUR SINS .
You are doing exactly as does the serpent . Bringing truths in order to plant a lie . NOT GOOD . PREACH JESUS
and rather than trying to deconstruct the bible , TRY READING IT FOR YOU and learning of it .

 

[amigo de christo]

You need to Google "social skills" so you can learn to get along with others.

you had said the same to JESUS . go look at his social skills .
he was not concerned or worried about getting along .
HIS desire was for the actual GOOD of humanity and to the GLORY of the FATHER .
social skills . PLEASE
You need biblical skills friend .

 

[amigo de christo]

We will all face judgment..........whether we are shown clemency or not is the question. Those in the Lamb's book of LIFE will not see death....the second death. That can't be said of those who are not in the Lamb's book of LIFE.

did i not warn ya that many are ANTI GOSPEL . If you really want to know what is going on ..........
Its an attack against the absolute DIRE need to BELIEVE ON JESUS to be saved .
And at best an idea that everyone gets a second chance after death .
FUNNY
How come the apostels went about preaching to all that still had BREATH
of the DIRE and absolute NEED to have to BELIEVE ON JESUS
and not rather as aint steven and try and imply this other message .
A message that if you examine you will see Preaches UNBELIEF to those still breathing
and gives rather an idea that , WELL even if you DIE in UNBELEIF rejecting JESUS
well you still in the end have another chance .
THE ONLY END i SEEN JESUS speak of
was EITHER A GOOD ONE or a WAILING ONE . the GOOD ONE entailed BELEIVE YE ON HIM NOW
the bad ending entailed was given for all WHO failed TO BELEIVE ON HIM .
St steven aint fooling me sister , and i can see he aint fooling you either .
HE is however fooling others and namely HIS OWN SELF too .

 

[amigo de christo]

You need to Google "social skills" so you can learn to get along with others.

forget google .
You need to BIBLE JESUS SKILLS and see HOW HE DID things and later how the apostels did .
Hurry now , there is no time LIKE RIGHT NOW to learn for yourself what IT IS you NEED TO KNOW now .

 

[amigo de christo]

Amen. Many try to eliminate the fear of God.........the Truth has always been under attack from counterfeit humanistic ideas born of the flesh and mind of man, which are fed to them by the serpent. As shepherdsword pointed out, it is the serpent who lies and says "thou shalt not surely die".

it all boils down to one thing . and we seen this from even the very days of the garden .
BELEIF .
WHO are we gonna b eleive . GOD , CHRIST , HIS TRUTH , or the voice of one who twists it .
THINK about how simple that is sister .
CHILD LIKE faith .
WHEN GOD spoke to adam and said DO NOT EAT of the TREE in the midst of the garden
for in the day ye eat thereof ye shall surely die . GUESS WHO ADAM , GUESS WHO EVE should have beleived
and CONTINUED to BELEIVE . WHY GOD of course .
but along cometh another voice , one of the darkness , one that knows how to feed and to seduce the carnal mind of man .
And the IN THE DAY YE EAT THEREOF ye shall surely die
became rather , NAY NAY surely ye shall n ot die ..........
SEEMS there is nothing new under that ol sun at all .
NOW GOD DID all that was necessary to RESTORE fallen man
TO SAVE man
AND DID SO IN THE SON .
but the same applies . WHO WE GONNA BELIEVE IN and WHO WE GONNA BELEIVE
GOD , THE SON , HIS WORDS
and CONTINUE TO BELEIVE
or as pual once wrote I fear lest ye have been begulied as was eve ...................
ME THINKS people are in dire trouble sister .
MANY hear but not all b eleive
and even some b eleive but not all continue .
But no marvel , JESUS warned us suc h is the case and he warned us AS TO WHY such as is the case .
But much of christendom now beleives , only what jesus is it they beleive . And that is something
THAT ALL need reminder of my dear sister .
For all beleive , but what is it they BELEIVE , is it a lie .....................or is it TRUTH .
Very simple it is my dear sister .
WHO has the sheep . WHO .
And who has the cino .
The cino has the very same one as does the world and all false religoins . But b leieve me when i say
ITS not the one we ought to have followed .
Cino . CHRISTAIN IN NAME ONLY . As in THIS PEOPLE honors me with their lips
BUT BOY OH BOY is their heart FAR FROM ME . and they worship GOD IN VAIN through the precepts and false sensual love of men .

 

[amigo de christo]

My mistake, I meant to post John 5:28,29 where it says the wicked will have a "resurrection of judgment."

In verse 29, it seems that the term judgment is used in the sense of a process of evaluation and probation or as one Greek lexicon says a "scrutiny of conduct." Those who receive "a resurrection of judgment" are apparently the same as "the unrighteous" mentioned in Acts 24:15. These unrighteous ones will be judged based (according to Romans 6:7), not on what they did in the past but rather on their conduct after their resurrection, under the kingdom rule of Christ and His "brothers" (Matthew 25:40), who are also fellow rulers & judges.

See how Romans 6:7 helps us understand the Judgment? Because as Romans 6:23 further says, "the wages of sin is..." -- what? -- it's death ....not torment, not anything else.


Take care, my friend.

Errr
st steven put a like on this .
But i challenge you to ask him something .
ASKS him what occurs at the end .
Ask him IN the end will even satan and the unrepentant be restored again .
AND SHUDDER IN HOLY TERROR at his answer . They believe
a fat lie my friend .
YOU ASK HIM about this so called THIRD ressurection given unto the damned at the end .
ASK HIM .
AND SHUDDER IN HOLY TERROR at his answer , IF HE so answers the way he has before
JESUS IS BEING DENIED and ye shall not die has now become
IN THE VERY END ALL IS WELL .

 

[shepherdsword]

You need to Google "social skills" so you can learn to get along with others.

I get along fine with most people. Just not false teachers that promote doctrines of devils.

 

[amigo de christo]

It would be nice if you were right....unfortunately you are not.

Over the days
over the weeks
over the months
and now over the years ........
WHAT has b een REPLACED .
The answer to that is
GO and behold what JESUS taught
GO and behold the book of acts and see the very dire and grave warnings given
and WHO they preached with the dire reminder of YE NEEDS TO BELEIVE .
and what has replaced it . A fable of , oh in the very end it dont matter
eventually ALL WILL BE WELL .
Kinda odd . THAT AINT what JESUS said
Kinda odd , THAT AINT what the apostels said either
THE TRUE MESSAGE can easily be summed up with
THERE IS A LOVELY LOVELY WONDERFUL PLACE
THERE IS a horrenedous place .
THE FIRST ENTIALS THE ABSOLUTE DIRE NEED TO BLEIEVE ON JESUS to be IN SUCH LOVELY PLACE at ones end .
The other is UNBELIEF . just c ontinue to not believe on HIM ,
KINDA SIMPLE if you ask me .
I dont see st steven , NOR HAVE I EVER ONCE SEEN HIM
even bother to preach the dire necessity to BELIEVE ON JESUS
but i darn sure have seen him preach a fab le which by all means IS UNBELEIF .
You have done v ery well to expose him .
For by grace i have come to the understanding of one simple thing .
ALL have sinned , ALL have fallen far short of the glory of GOD ,
ALL are trapped in bondage and are under death .
BUT THAT GOD did something ABOUT THAT . HE SENT the SON
SO that all who do BELIEVE , let it b e said again , ALL WHO DO BELEIVE BLEIEVE and BELEIVE IN HIM
shall not perish but have EVERLASTING LIFE .
IN fact , may i be so bold as to say , THERE IS NONE WHO IS GOOD BUT GOD
and thus ALL NEED THE SAVOIR , TO BLEIEVE ON THE SAVOIR , WHICH GIVES THE GLORY TO GOD and TO THE SON
IN ORDER TO BE SAVED .
KINDA SIMPLE if ya ask me . And b efore you think you are hearing f rom
a good man who was born good and proper , JUST KNOW I WAS THE WORST OF MANY
and IT TOOK GOD to save and to change my vile wicked heart , to give ME eternal life .
OH YEAH , ITS JESUS PREACHING TIME IN THE BUILDING .
FOR THIS MAN has b een FORGIVEN OF MUCH , and thus LOVETH the ONE WHO SAVED AND FORGAVE HIM .
WE gots problems in the house my friend . Keep on doing the good work my fr iend . but do know
YOU WILL be falsely accused of being a hat er , and who knows what else .

 

[amigo de christo]

I get along fine with most people. Just not false teachers that promote doctrines of devils.

and now a word .
THIS i have against YOU , said THE ALLMIGHTY
YE allow that false one to teach and to seduce my people .
BELIEVE me , sheep aint gonna get along with THOSE WHO DO TEACH AND SEDUCE this people WITH DOCTRINES of devils .
And that GOD is not okay WITH THOSE WHO DO SO .
steven aint got the doctrine to expose you , for DOCTRINE SUPPORTS what you are saying .
SO HE runs to google and men and does as many do , ACCUSES and does so falsey
and tries and plays the victim card .
As in OH you need to GOOGLE SOCIAL SKILLS
WHEN ITS HE who needs TO BIBLE JESUS SKILLS and actually learn .

 

[amigo de christo]

I get along fine with most people. Just not false teachers that promote doctrines of devils.

in other words His words that said to you
that you need to google social skills so you can learn to get Along with others
IS really saying
HEY you need google social skills so you can learn to GO WITH THE FLOW and HEED ME . he aint fooling me
my friend . He is however fooling the very one who appears
in the mirror that he himself would see if he stuck his face in front of said mirror . HE FOOLING HIMSELF .