Preacher Deception Faith and no works? Video

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Rockerduck

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The Apostle Paul's Gospel is simple, For by Grace you are saved through Faith in Jesus Christ, plus nothing. Eph. 2:8. Now stay at your job, raise the family and go to church on Sunday. Billions of people do this. Want more? Volunteer for a position in your church. Most people aren't theologians and cannot quote scripture. Most go to church and read their bible at home. If God calls you teach, or preach, you will do it, without a doubt, but most only go to church on Sunday's.
 

Justified

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It's unfortunate that he is conflating different meanings of justification--something he doesn't even define--which results in wrong teaching on the topic. He doesn't even seem to even know exactly what "faith alone" typically refers to, resulting in a straw man.
Just to go more in-depth. The title and description of the video set up a straw man of what "faith alone" actually means, unless there are fringe people out there who actually think that it means never having to do good works. As his description states:

"I had a preacher, who wanted to argue with me about works of faith. He said that if he had to do any work in order to make it to Heaven, then he would have something to boast about. He obviously didn’t know Romans 3:27, and many other scriptures, that he unknowingly spoke against.

He repeated "Faith Alone" several times as if that would make it come true, but the only time faith is alone is if we have a dead faith, because if we don’t abide in Jesus Christ, by obeying His command to love one another (John 15:9-12), then we will not be able to do anything spiritually (John 15:4)."

Then around the 6:40 mark, he starts going off the rails, teaching false doctrine because he doesn't seem to understand that "justification" has different meanings. He appeals to Rom. 4:2 to show that "Abraham was not justified by works initially . . . but he was justified by works afterwards," appealing at that point to James 2:21. But that is to conflate the two different meanings of justification being used by Paul and James. That is a serious mistake. Paul is using it to refer to being declared righteous; James is referring to Abraham's works being evidence of his being declared righteous.

He then goes on to give proof-texts that supposedly show "we were justified initially," when they actually show believers are justified.

Another error is around the 7:47 mark, where he states we are required to live by faith. He appeals to Rom. 3:26, saying that "God is the justifier of the one who lives by faith." But that is not what that verse says:

Rom 3:26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. (ESV)

He then appeals to verses 21-22, but verse 22 also is only about "the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe." That is, when we have faith in Christ, we receive the righteousness of God. These verses are not about living by faith.

Around the 8:13 mark, he further conflates the meanings of justification. Clearly, the context of Matt. 12:37 shows that "justified" is referring to the evidence of what is in one's heart:

Mat 12:33 “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or make the tree bad and its fruit bad, for the tree is known by its fruit.
Mat 12:34 You brood of vipers! How can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
Mat 12:35 The good person out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil person out of his evil treasure brings forth evil.
Mat 12:36 I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak,
Mat 12:37 for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

The worst is around the 11:12 mark, where he begins his discussion on James 2:24. Once again, he doesn't explain what "justified" means in that context and so conflates meanings, teaching something that James does not teach. He is pitting James against Paul.

However, at 12:22, he does get something important correct--that James 2:18 is teaching that "our faith in Jesus Christ is seen by what we do." But, he fails to link that to the meaning of justified in verses 21 and 24--our works are evidence of our faith in Christ.

Around the 14:30 mark, he brings out the straw man, stating that "if our faith in Jesus Christ is not making us do good works, then we have a dead faith; that's the only time faith would be alone, if we had a dead faith." But, again, that is not what faith alone is referring to.

However, he then contradicts everything he has stated by stating what actually is meant by faith alone--"if we're not justified by faith in Jesus Christ, we do not have peace with God and we do not have access to grace;" appealing to Rom. 5:1-2. That is what faith alone means: we are justified (declared righteous) by grace alone, through faith alone. Good works are the evidence (justification) that one has been justified (declared righteous).

Although I stopped at the 15:18 mark, overall it's a poor video. It begins by setting up a straw man of "faith alone" and then fails to make very important distinctions in the meanings of justified, all while refuting his straw man. And in it all, he can't even see he proved the doctrine of faith alone, contradicting his straw man claims.
 

TitusTwoWife

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Just to go more in-depth. The title and description of the video set up a straw man of what "faith alone" actually means, unless there are fringe people out there who actually think that it means never having to do good works. As his description states:

"I had a preacher, who wanted to argue with me about works of faith. He said that if he had to do any work in order to make it to Heaven, then he would have something to boast about. He obviously didn’t know Romans 3:27, and many other scriptures, that he unknowingly spoke against.

He repeated "Faith Alone" several times as if that would make it come true, but the only time faith is alone is if we have a dead faith, because if we don’t abide in Jesus Christ, by obeying His command to love one another (John 15:9-12), then we will not be able to do anything spiritually (John 15:4)."

Then around the 6:40 mark, he starts going off the rails, teaching false doctrine because he doesn't seem to understand that "justification" has different meanings. He appeals to Rom. 4:2 to show that "Abraham was not justified by works initially . . . but he was justified by works afterwards," appealing at that point to James 2:21. But that is to conflate the two different meanings of justification being used by Paul and James. That is a serious mistake. Paul is using it to refer to being declared righteous; James is referring to Abraham's works being evidence of his being declared righteous.

He then goes on to give proof-texts that supposedly show "we were justified initially," when they actually show believers are justified.

Another error is around the 7:47 mark, where he states we are required to live by faith. He appeals to Rom. 3:26, saying that "God is the justifier of the one who lives by faith." But that is not what that verse says:

Rom 3:26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. (ESV)

He then appeals to verses 21-22, but verse 22 also is only about "the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe." That is, when we have faith in Christ, we receive the righteousness of God. These verses are not about living by faith.

Around the 8:13 mark, he further conflates the meanings of justification. Clearly, the context of Matt. 12:37 shows that "justified" is referring to the evidence of what is in one's heart:

Mat 12:33 “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or make the tree bad and its fruit bad, for the tree is known by its fruit.
Mat 12:34 You brood of vipers! How can you speak good, when you are evil? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
Mat 12:35 The good person out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil person out of his evil treasure brings forth evil.
Mat 12:36 I tell you, on the day of judgment people will give account for every careless word they speak,
Mat 12:37 for by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

The worst is around the 11:12 mark, where he begins his discussion on James 2:24. Once again, he doesn't explain what "justified" means in that context and so conflates meanings, teaching something that James does not teach. He is pitting James against Paul.

However, at 12:22, he does get something important correct--that James 2:18 is teaching that "our faith in Jesus Christ is seen by what we do." But, he fails to link that to the meaning of justified in verses 21 and 24--our works are evidence of our faith in Christ.

Around the 14:30 mark, he brings out the straw man, stating that "if our faith in Jesus Christ is not making us do good works, then we have a dead faith; that's the only time faith would be alone, if we had a dead faith." But, again, that is not what faith alone is referring to.

However, he then contradicts everything he has stated by stating what actually is meant by faith alone--"if we're not justified by faith in Jesus Christ, we do not have peace with God and we do not have access to grace;" appealing to Rom. 5:1-2. That is what faith alone means: we are justified (declared righteous) by grace alone, through faith alone. Good works are the evidence (justification) that one has been justified (declared righteous).

Although I stopped at the 15:18 mark, overall it's a poor video. It begins by setting up a straw man of "faith alone" and then fails to make very important distinctions in the meanings of justified, all while refuting his straw man. And in it all, he can't even see he proved the doctrine of faith alone, contradicting his straw man claims.
I may disagree but I appreciate that you actually watched most of the video and have an in depth response.
 
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Armour of God

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I have faith and I choose to follow Christ's footsteps and live a life with good deeds and repent for my sins.

Some people don't like hearing that and act as if I'm doing something wrong or bad.
I don't understand that.

If you believe that only faith saves you then I will be saved.
I believe we will be judged, as it says this many times in the bible, therefore I choose to do good deeds and repent.

There is nothing wrong with that.
I will be saved whichever way you view it.
It's better than having bad deeds and unrepentant sin.
 
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David Lamb

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I have faith and I choose to follow Christ's footsteps and live a life with good deeds and repent for my sins.

Some people don't like hearing that and act as if I'm doing something wrong or bad.
I don't understand that.

If you believe that only faith saves you then I will be saved.
I believe we will be judged, as it says this many times in the bible, therefore I choose to do good deeds and repent.

There is nothing wrong with that.
I will be saved whichever way you view it.
It's better than having bad deeds and unrepentant sin.
But surely nobody here is saying that saved people shouldn't repent or do good deeds. Some of us, including me, believe that salvation is by God's grace alone, but that doesn't mean that repentance and good works aren't needed. Paul, writing to the Ephesians, said that we are saved by grace for good works (see Ephesians 2:8-10).
 
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Armour of God

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But surely nobody here is saying that saved people shouldn't repent or do good deeds. Some of us, including me, believe that salvation is by God's grace alone, but that doesn't mean that repentance and good works aren't needed. Paul, writing to the Ephesians, said that we are saved by grace for good works (see Ephesians 2:8-10).

Yea well I had an extended debate with someone on another thread who was making it seem like I was doing something wrong. Wouldn't answer any of my questions and just kept repeating his favourite bible verses while rejecting the ones I provided.
Eventually he admitted there is nothing wrong with having good deeds. It was all just a frustrating waste of time in the end
 

David Lamb

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Yea well I had an extended debate with someone on another thread who was making it seem like I was doing something wrong. Wouldn't answer any of my questions and just kept repeating his favourite bible verses while rejecting the ones I provided.
Eventually he admitted there is nothing wrong with having good deeds. It was all just a frustrating waste of time in the end
That is clearer. Thanks.
 
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Nancy

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2 Peter 1:5-11

"5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; 6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; 7
And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. 8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9
But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. 10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ."

It seems to me that the above verses pretty much say what we must do (on our own) to so, it seems it is faith plus works that is pleasing to God. JMHO.
 
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