If sealed with the HS, how does one become UNsealed ?

[GodsGrace]

Here's another good question:

30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. (Ephesians 4:30).

Why does Paul tell us not to grieve the Holy Spirit? What is the context of Ephesians 4:17-32 of which this verse a part?

I do hope @PeterAndroz sees the above.
Why would Paul warn us not to grieve the Holy Spirit
IF
the seal cannot be broken?

A question that must be answered.

 

[MatthewG]

We debate Matthew because some of us see changes in the Christian faith that should not be happening.
We see some ideas that took hold that were never taught either at the time of Jesus/Apostles or at the time of the early church...which is when the Apostles did what you've written about....

They went and taught others what Jesus taught them.

Some think life ended with Revelation.
These were real people, as you've stated, that gave their lives to teach the gospel and the message of jesus to others.

It's nice to know someone actually understands this.

The reason I post is to give some push-back on this nonsense we hear.
OSAS
FAITH ALONE
SEALS
CONFESSION NOT NECESSARY

And on it goes.

Godsgrace,

I hear what you’re saying, and I understand why you push back on certain teachings. A lot of ideas have developed over time that simply weren’t part of what Jesus taught or what the apostles passed on to the early believers. They were real people, living in a real historical moment, and they taught what they had received directly from Christ — nothing more, nothing less.

For me, the reason I speak up isn’t to argue for the sake of arguing. It’s because I care about staying close to what Jesus actually said and what the apostles actually taught in their own generation. When later doctrines drift away from that foundation, it’s fair to question them.

And you’re right — boundaries matter. Not every conversation is healthy, and not every person engages with good intentions. I wasn’t raised with a clear understanding of boundaries, so now at 35 I’m learning to set them where they’re needed. Ignoring someone isn’t un‑Christian; sometimes it’s simply protecting your peace when a discussion stops being productive.

I appreciate that you recognize the importance of going back to the source — the teachings of Jesus and the apostles — instead of letting later ideas overshadow them.

 

[MatthewG]

When you look at this historically and in its original context, the “sealed for the day of redemption” was tied directly to “the great and dreadful day of the LORD” (Malachi 4:5). It was not a universal, timeless sealing for every believer in every generation. It was a first‑century, end‑of‑the‑age event.

John the Baptist warned the Pharisees and Sadducees:

“Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?” — Matthew 3:7

That “wrath to come” was not about people dying today — it was about the impending judgment on Israel in that generation, the same judgment Jesus described in Matthew 23–24.

People in Israel — and Gentiles who believed the gospel — were being gathered out as the bride, the faithful remnant who would escape the coming destruction and be joined to the Lord (Matthew 24:31; Revelation 19:7–8). This is all covenantal, first‑century language.

There is no one today being sealed for that day, because that day already came. The sealing was an end‑of‑the‑age marking, identifying the first‑century bride who would pass safely through the transition from the Old Covenant world to the New.

Paul said:

“You were sealed unto the day of redemption.” — Ephesians 4:30

Not beyond it. Not after it. Not for every generation. You were sealed — because the day was near.

Once that day arrived (70 AD), the purpose of the seal was fulfilled.

We now live in the new heavens and new earth (Isaiah 65–66), the heavenly Jerusalem (Hebrews 12:22–24), where death, sin, Satan, and condemnation have been defeated by the Lord Yeshua (1 Corinthians 15:24–26; Romans 8:1–2; Hebrews 2:14–15).

We experience this reality by faith and by the Spirit, because the kingdom is spiritual, not physical (Luke 17:20–21).

So what remains for believers today?

The hope is simple: To go and be with God after this life (Philippians 1:23), and to walk with Him through this life — a life that still includes suffering, discipline, and the daily death of taking up the cross (Luke 9:23; Galatians 5:17).

The flesh still resists love. The Spirit still leads us into it. That conflict continues as long as we live.

But there is no “sealed for the day of redemption” today. That belonged to the first‑century transition.

What exists today is exactly what Scripture shows:

Faithful and unfaithful people. Those who walk in the Spirit and those who don’t. Those who believe and those who refuse.

That’s it.

 

[Taken]

Since 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13, Eph 4:30 teaches that the condition to be saved/sealed is believing & trusting the Gospel do you believe that if that trust stops then the believer remains saved even though they no longer believe ?

@GodsGrace

A “TASTER”…
* IS “WITH Christ.
* Christ IS “WITH” a “TASTER”.

* “WARNING”;
* “IF” a TASTER, continues Believing…
he “SHALL be MADE Saved, “At the time of his bodily death.”
* “IF” a TASTER, stops believing, walks away…
He SHALL “LOSE his Salvation that was, Bought, Paid For, Offered to him…
But…
he Never TOOK.

*By his “freewill, By his “own power…”
he “chose to Forfeit, his Gift of Salvation”.

An “EATER”…Believes, Takes his Bought, Paid For, Offered Gift of Salvation…
AND Forever, by Agreement, of Gods Terms, of Gods Promise…
“By Gods Will, Gods Power, Gods Promise…Gods Power “KEEPS” that man “saved”.

The security of God “keeping a man saved”…
Is revealed in Scripture…
That No power is Greater than Gods.

A “Taster Believer”…REMAINS under his own power, to keep Believing, or Not.

An “Eater Believer”…SURRENDERS his power, unto the Lord God, to keep that man Faithful Forever.

EATER;

John 6:
[47] Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
[48] I am that bread of life.
[49] Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
[50] This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
[52] The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
[53] Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
[54] Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
[55] For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
[56] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
[57] As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

1 John 4:
[4] Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

TASTER;

Heb 4:
[4] For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
[5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
[6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Eater, surrenders his Power, for Gods power to Keep the man Saved.

Taster, keeps his own power, to keep believing until his death.

The WARNING…”to Tasters”…
IS…
Throughout a mans natural life/time, there ARE…
Powerful, Demons, kings, parents, teachers, celebrities, philosophers, friends, scientists and NOW even Strangers on social medias, that can, will, “influence” the “tasters”…To Reject God, stop believing, Walk away…

And, by opening your “ears”, you can “hear”… the “Influencers” ploys, works… you can “hear” the testimonies of they who claim, they once Heard, (were enlightened), Believed…were “WITH” The Lord God…
and Walked Away.


Glory to God,
Taken

 

[GodsGrace]

Godsgrace,

I hear what you’re saying, and I understand why you push back on certain teachings. A lot of ideas have developed over time that simply weren’t part of what Jesus taught or what the apostles passed on to the early believers. They were real people, living in a real historical moment, and they taught what they had received directly from Christ — nothing more, nothing less.

For me, the reason I speak up isn’t to argue for the sake of arguing. It’s because I care about staying close to what Jesus actually said and what the apostles actually taught in their own generation. When later doctrines drift away from that foundation, it’s fair to question them.

And you’re right — boundaries matter. Not every conversation is healthy, and not every person engages with good intentions. I wasn’t raised with a clear understanding of boundaries, so now at 35 I’m learning to set them where they’re needed. Ignoring someone isn’t un‑Christian; sometimes it’s simply protecting your peace when a discussion stops being productive.

I appreciate that you recognize the importance of going back to the source — the teachings of Jesus and the apostles — instead of letting later ideas overshadow them.

I'm sure some come on to these forums to argue.
I believe that most do not and just want to discuss.
However, yes, sometimes it gets tiring hearing the same
incorrect teachings and sometimes a person can get
a little frustrated and maybe their behavior is left wanting.
I add myself as this happens to me too.
But that should be the exception and not the rule.
I find that this Forum is well-moderated and we can feel safe here.

 

[GodsGrace]

New Christians, or baby Christians.........all believe this..

= "as long as i hold unto my faith, i keep myself saved".

But that is not God's Salvation..........as God's Salvation is Jesus on The Cross, and once we give God our Faith in Christ one time......just once is all God asks.. = Then our "faith is ACCEPTED by God, as (Christ's) imputed Righteousness".

So, this means that the initial faith we had, on that day of our Salvation..... = Holy God has accepted forever.
And this is proven by the fact that because God has already Accepted it, ONCE.......we are born again ONCE.

See that Reader?

Now the diaper baby Hebrews 6:1 Christian, does not understand that God accpeted their faith and gave them "the Gift of Salvation", and they now have it forever.
They dont understand, (the baby Christians), that once they have received what Jesus has finished on The Cross, 2000 yrs ago....then they now have it.
They dont BELIEVE that they have it..........and that is because they have no real faith yet......that is the understanding of What Christ has done for them, that God has GIVEN THEM< that is ETERNAL.
So, instead they are trying to continue to get it, or keep it........and that is the problem that baby believers have regarding their ZERO understanding of God's "Gift of Salvation."" who is JESUS on The Cross.

Reader there is initial faith that Christ is your Savior......but then there is the revelation of God's Grace, that is the understanding that im teaching you right now.......and on quite a few Threads ive posted recently for you.

And until they come to the REVELATION that they are "in Christ".. "one with God", and in the "KOG" already and forever......which meand they are now eternally God's.....then they keep trying to get there....They keep trying to PERFORM to KEEP.......= what is already established "through CHRIST">.. as their Salvation, forever.

So, the diaper baby believer, is always trying to ignorantly complete for God, what Christ finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago, already for the World. (John 3:16).
And until they understand this, they have not "worked out their salvation".. They are not walking in the spirit, and they have not put on the Helmet of Salvation, and they are easy MENTAL prey for Cross Denying Heretics who look for you on Forums and on the Internet and from behind pulpits.
They look for you, Readers, because they know you dont have real faith in Christ. You only have it in your doing and working and this is SELF SAVING..... And until you stop that carnal mindk and get out of it... by trusting in Christ alone to keep you saved, then Hebrews 13:9 (KJV) is going to find you using them, and they will keep you self righteously trying to do for yourself = what Christ already completed for you 2000 yrs ago on The Cross, when He told you from The Cross......."it is finished".

So, the baby Christian, is always trying to finish, (keep yourself saved) what Christ told you He has already "FINISHED" for you as your "Gift of SALVATION"" that is His Sacrifice for you...... already completed , already FINISHED 2000 yrs ago.

Too bad there's no scripture to back up your heretical teaching.

Am waiting for your reply to MY post.

With scripture please.

Word salads don't belong in the teachings about what Jesus taught so that we could be with Him in Heaven.

Thanks.

 

[Lizbeth]

I don’t see myself as part of that “many are called, but few chosen” group Jesus spoke to (Matthew 22:14). That statement was directed to the people of His own generation — the ones invited to the wedding feast, yet refusing to come (Matthew 22:1–7). I’m simply Matthew, a believer in the Lord Jesus who was raised from the dead by the Spirit of God (Romans 8:11). My faith is in the risen Christ, not in being part of that first‑century remnant.

I don’t carry the same concerns they were commanded to carry. The warnings about being “sealed” (Revelation 7:3–4), the “great and dreadful day of Yahavah” (Malachi 4:5–6), and the call to flee from the wrath that was “about to come” (1 Thessalonians 1:10) were spoken to them, not to me. Jesus Himself said all those things would come upon that generation (Matthew 23:36; Matthew 24:34).

I’m not part of the first‑century Bride of Christ. Scripture shows that they were the ones betrothed as a pure virgin to Christ (2 Corinthians 11:2). They were the ones told that the marriage supper of the Lamb was “at hand” (Revelation 19:7). They were the ones instructed to “watch,” “wait,” and “look for His appearing” because He was coming in their lifetime (Luke 21:28–32; Hebrews 10:37).

Jesus repeatedly told them:

• “Watch therefore” (Matthew 24:42)
• “When you see these things… know that it is near” (Luke 21:31)
• “This generation shall not pass till all these things be fulfilled” (Matthew 24:34)

Paul confirmed the same urgency:

• “The night is far spent, the day is at hand” (Romans 13:11–12)
• “The Lord is near” (Philippians 4:5)
• “We who are alive and remain” (1 Thessalonians 4:15)

Those were their instructions, their warnings, and their promises. They were the ones living in the final days of the old covenant age (Hebrews 8:13). They were the ones who would see the Son of Man “coming on the clouds” in judgment, just as Daniel 7:13–14 foretold and Jesus affirmed (Matthew 26:64).

So I have no reason to believe I’m part of that original Bride. They were the ones called to watch for His return, and they were the ones who experienced the unique tribulation Jesus said would “never happen again” (Matthew 24:21).

I’m simply a believer today — living by faith in the risen Lord, not under the covenant expectations, warnings, or prophetic timetable that belonged to that first‑century people.

I agree that these things were fulfilled in the first century, God dealing with Israel first, fulfilling prophecy and wrapping up the old covenant. The way into the holiest of holies was not really made manifest while as the first tabernacle was yet standing (Heb. 9). But could it all also be a pattern/template and lessons for the church age as well? Since Israel is said to be our example....scripture says that all these things happened unto Israel (called the "church in the wilderness") and were written for our admonition. God will take a bride from out of the church age too, I believe. Jacob had both Rachel and Leah.

 

[Behold]

Reader,


Let me show you how to put on "the helmet of Salvation".

New Christians, or baby Christians.........all wrongly believe this.. = "as long as i hold unto my faith, i keep myself saved".

But that is not God's "GIFT of Salvation""......as God's Salvation is Jesus on The Cross, and once we give God our Faith in Christ one time......just once is all God asks.. = Then our "faith is ACCEPTED by God, as (Christ's) imputed Righteousness".

So, this means that the initial faith we had, on that blessed day of our Salvation..... = Holy God has accepted forever.
And this is proven by the fact that because God has already Accepted our Faith, ONCE and for all......= .we are born again ONCE.

Reader, the only eternal proof that someone is a Christian, is that they are born......again.........and that is not water baptism, so, be ye not deceived.

Listen,

The carnal baby Hebrews 6:1 Christian, who is "" fallen from(God's) Grace"" does not understand that God eternally accepted their faith in Christ and gave them "the Gift of Salvation", and they now have it forever.
They dont understand, (the baby Christians), that once they have received what Jesus has finished on The Cross, 2000 yrs ago....then they now have it as God offers it which is....= .ETERNAL LIFE.
They dont BELIEVE that they have it..........and that is because they have no real faith yet.
Real Faith, subsequent to Salvation, the walk of Faith, is the understanding regarding What Christ has done for them on the Cross, that God has GIVEN THEM as a GIFT< that is ETERNAL.
Its what God has done for YOU if you are truly born again, and not just water baptized and very religious.
So, instead of understanding this revelation, they are trying to continue to get it, or keep it. And that is the problem that baby believers have regarding their ZERO understanding of God's "Gift of Salvation."" who is JESUS on The Cross.

Jesus is Salvation, and that is not something you can do for yourself by trying to "abide" or "endure to the end" or "confess sin", or "try to be like Christ".. or "live in a state of repentance", or do "Pennance".

Listen......."its not by works of righteousness but according to God's MERCY that He saved us.

""SAVED US"..... = Completed.........Finished.

Reader there is initial faith that Christ is your Savior......but then there is the revelation of God's Grace, that is the subsequent understanding that im teaching you right now.......and on quite a few Threads ive posted recently for you.

And until these baby believers come to the REVELATION that they are "in Christ".. "one with God", and in the "KOG" already and forever......which means they are now eternally God's.."blood bought" and "sealed unto the day of (our) redemption" by the Holy Spirit...then they keep trying to get there....They keep trying to uselessly PERFORM to KEEP or Confess to Keep....= what is already eternally established "through CHRIST">.. as their eternal "Gift of Salvation", forever.

They dont believe this, because they dont really have REAL Faith in Christ yet.....the kind that sustains you because its centered in God's MERCY and not their Self Saving LIST......of "i must do this and not do that, and if i get all my do's and dont dos right every day till i die, then i might just end up in heaven".

See that one?
They have no real faith in Christ. They are "fallen from Grace"... "Bewitched" and "IN the Flesh" (Carnally minded).

Reader, the Hebrews 6:1 baby believer, is always trying to ignorantly complete for God, what Christ finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago already for the World. (John 3:16-17).
And until they understand this revelation, they have not worked out their salvation, they are not walking in the spirit, and they have not put on the Helmet of Salvation. This means they are easy MENTAL prey for Cross Denying Heretics who look for you on Forums and on the Internet and from behind pulpits.
They look for you, Readers, because they know you dont have real faith in Christ. You only have it in = your doing and working and this is SELF SAVING (Self Righteousness)...... And until you stop that carnal mind and get completely out of it... by trusting in Christ alone to keep you saved, then the > 2nd Part < of Hebrews 13:9 (KJV) is going to find you and keep you deceived.

Reader, the Heretics will be aggressively trying to keep you self righteously deceived into trying to do for yourself = what Christ already completed for you 2000 yrs ago on The Cross, when He told you from The Cross....."it is finished". ="The Gift of Salvation".

So, the baby Christian, is always trying to finish that by themselves, (keep yourself saved). Yet Jesus The Christ told you 2000 yrs ago that He has already "FINISHED IT" for you as your "Gift of SALVATION"" = that is His Literal Sacrifice of Himself on The Cross for you.

 

[Taken]

Here are some more....
The seal can be broken

No.

Believers can fall away....

Yes.
BECAUSE…All Believers ARE NOT Sealed.
BECAUSE…All Believers DO NOT “Commit, Surrender, their Life TO Gods ONCE and Forever “Power and Sealing and Keeping”!

Were YOU “Sealed”, when you First heard and learned About God?

Highly doubtful.

When “someone told you there IS a God…”
Did you agree? Wonder? Learn About Him? Believe some things? Doubt some things?
Did you Imagine, Ponder, Be Curious?
* That is how it Begins… For EVERY “ TASTER !!

* Some, walk away doubting.
* Some, continue believing, without being SURE.
* Some, Decide, Trust, Freely Choose, TO Believe EVERY Word, Promise, of God is Absolute TRUTH…
And
Freely Choose, TO Call OUT TO the Lords Name, AND CONFESS Their True Heartful Belief IN God…AND BECOME MADE THEN, ONCE and Forever…SEALED…AND KEPT SEALED…BY the POWER OF God….
WHO…
Not “ONLY” is With such man… BUT enters and DEWELLS “IN” that man, KEEPING that man, BY Gods Power, Once and Forever…SAVED!

Now WHY, do you think, such a man, being Kept in belief, BY Gods Power “IN” him, can EVER, become “UNSEALED”?

How does, such a man’s “own power in him”… EVER supersede Gods power IN the man, that such a man CAN /Could Stop believing, walk away?

Belief is A beginning!
True Heartful Confession, Surrender of Control of one’s Body/ Life, TO the Lord…
is The “KEY” that forever Separates…
A Believer From the Assured Once and Forever Saved.

Different Scriptures IN Context Speak to:
The unbelievers…
^ no concern…
The Believers “without Commitment”…
^ hoping, but unsure…
The Believers “with Commitment”…
^ Assured OSAS

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[GodsGrace]

No.



Yes.
BECAUSE…All Believers ARE NOT Sealed.
BECAUSE…All Believers DO NOT “Commit, Surrender, their Life TO Gods ONCE and Forever “Power and Sealing and Keeping”!

Were YOU “Sealed”, when you First heard and learned About God?

Highly doubtful.

When “someone told you there IS a God…”
Did you agree? Wonder? Learn About Him? Believe some things? Doubt some things?
Did you Imagine, Ponder, Be Curious?
* That is how it Begins… For EVERY “ TASTER !!

* Some, walk away doubting.
* Some, continue believing, without being SURE.
* Some, Decide, Trust, Freely Choose, TO Believe EVERY Word, Promise, of God is Absolute TRUTH…
And
Freely Choose, TO Call OUT TO the Lords Name, AND CONFESS Their True Heartful Belief IN God…AND BECOME MADE THEN, ONCE and Forever…SEALED…AND KEPT SEALED…BY the POWER OF God….
WHO…
Not “ONLY” is With such man… BUT enters and DEWELLS “IN” that man, KEEPING that man, BY Gods Power, Once and Forever…SAVED!

Now WHY, do you think, such a man, being Kept in belief, BY Gods Power “IN” him, can EVER, become “UNSEALED”?

How does, such a man’s “own power in him”… EVER supersede Gods power IN the man, that such a man CAN /Could Stop believing, walk away?

Belief is A beginning!
True Heartful Confession, Surrender of Control of one’s Body/ Life, TO the Lord…
is The “KEY” that forever Separates…
A Believer From the Assured Once and Forever Saved.

Different Scriptures IN Context Speak to:
The unbelievers…
^ no concern…
The Believers “without Commitment”…
^ hoping, but unsure…
The Believers “with Commitment”…
^ Assured OSAS

Glory to God,
Taken

I'm tired of non-biblical teachings Taken.
I refer you to the New Testament.
Learn what Jesus taught.

 

[GodsGrace]

Reader,


Let me show you how to put on "the helmet of Salvation".

New Christians, or baby Christians.........all wrongly believe this.. = "as long as i hold unto my faith, i keep myself saved".

But that is not God's "GIFT of Salvation""......as God's Salvation is Jesus on The Cross, and once we give God our Faith in Christ one time......just once is all God asks.. = Then our "faith is ACCEPTED by God, as (Christ's) imputed Righteousness".

So, this means that the initial faith we had, on that blessed day of our Salvation..... = Holy God has accepted forever.
And this is proven by the fact that because God has already Accepted our Faith, ONCE and for all......= .we are born again ONCE.

Reader, the only eternal proof that someone is a Christian, is that they are born......again.........and that is not water baptism, so, be ye not deceived.

Listen,

The carnal diaper baby Hebrews 6:1 Christian, who is "" fallen from(God's) Grace"" does not understand that God eternally accepted their faith in Christ and gave them "the Gift of Salvation", and they now have it forever.
They dont understand, (the baby Christians), that once they have received what Jesus has finished on The Cross, 2000 yrs ago....then they now have it.
They dont BELIEVE that they have it..........and that is because they have no real faith yet.
Real Faith, subsequent to Salvation, the walk of Faith, is the understanding regarding What Christ has done for them on the Cross, that God has GIVEN THEM as a GIFT< that is ETERNAL.
So, instead of understanding this revelation, they are trying to continue to get it, or keep it. And that is the problem that baby believers have regarding their ZERO understanding of God's "Gift of Salvation."" who is JESUS on The Cross.

Reader there is initial faith that Christ is your Savior......but then there is the revelation of God's Grace, that is the subsequent understanding that im teaching you right now.......and on quite a few Threads ive posted recently for you.

And until these baby believer comes to the REVELATION that they are "in Christ".. "one with God", and in the "KOG" already and forever......which means they are now eternally God's.."blood bought" and "sealed unto the day of (our) redemption" by the Holy Spirit...then they keep trying to get there....They keep trying to uselessly PERFORM to KEEP....= what is already established "through CHRIST">.. as their eternal "Gift of Salvation", forever.

So, the diaper baby believer, is always trying to ignorantly complete for God, what Christ finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago, already for the World. (John 3:16-17).
And until they understand this revelation, they have not worked out their salvation, they are not walking in the spirit, and they have not put on the Helmet of Salvation. This means they are easy MENTAL prey for Cross Denying Heretics who look for you on Forums and on the Internet and from behind pulpits.
They look for you, Readers, because they know you dont have real faith in Christ. You only have it in = your doing and working and this is SELF SAVING (Self Righteousness)...... And until you stop that carnal mind and get completely out of it... by trusting in Christ alone to keep you saved, then then the 2nd part of Hebrews 13:9 (KJV) is going to find you and keep you.

Reader, the Heretics will be aggressively trying keep you self righteously trying to do for yourself = what Christ already completed for you 2000 yrs ago on The Cross, when He told you from The Cross......."it is finished". ="The Gift of Salvation".

So, the baby Christian, is always trying to finish that by themselves, (keep yourself saved). Yet Jesus The Christ told you 2000 yrs ago that He has already "FINISHED IT" for you as your "Gift of SALVATION"" = that is His Literal Sacrifice of Himself on The Cross for you.

Still no scripture.
Still no reply to my post to you.

 

[PeterAndroz]

@GodsGrace

A “TASTER”…
* IS “WITH Christ.
* Christ IS “WITH” a “TASTER”.

* “WARNING”;
* “IF” a TASTER, continues Believing…
he “SHALL be MADE Saved, “At the time of his bodily death.”
* “IF” a TASTER, stops believing, walks away…
He SHALL “LOSE his Salvation that was, Bought, Paid For, Offered to him…
But…
he Never TOOK.

*By his “freewill, By his “own power…”
he “chose to Forfeit, his Gift of Salvation”.

An “EATER”…Believes, Takes his Bought, Paid For, Offered Gift of Salvation…
AND Forever, by Agreement, of Gods Terms, of Gods Promise…
“By Gods Will, Gods Power, Gods Promise…Gods Power “KEEPS” that man “saved”.

The security of God “keeping a man saved”…
Is revealed in Scripture…
That No power is Greater than Gods.

A “Taster Believer”…REMAINS under his own power, to keep Believing, or Not.

An “Eater Believer”…SURRENDERS his power, unto the Lord God, to keep that man Faithful Forever.

EATER;

John 6:
[47] Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
[48] I am that bread of life.
[49] Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
[50] This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
[52] The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
[53] Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
[54] Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
[55] For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
[56] He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
[57] As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

1 John 4:
[4] Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

TASTER;

Heb 4:
[4] For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
[5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
[6] If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

Eater, surrenders his Power, for Gods power to Keep the man Saved.

Taster, keeps his own power, to keep believing until his death.

The WARNING…”to Tasters”…
IS…
Throughout a mans natural life/time, there ARE…
Powerful, Demons, kings, parents, teachers, celebrities, philosophers, friends, scientists and NOW even Strangers on social medias, that can, will, “influence” the “tasters”…To Reject God, stop believing, Walk away…

And, by opening your “ears”, you can “hear”… the “Influencers” ploys, works… you can “hear” the testimonies of they who claim, they once Heard, (were enlightened), Believed…were “WITH” The Lord God…
and Walked Away.


Glory to God,
Taken

So was that YES you believe a believer remains saved if they stop believing or NO ?

 

[PeterAndroz]

Here's another good question:

30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. (Ephesians 4:30).

Why does Paul tell us not to grieve the Holy Spirit? What is the context of Ephesians 4:17-32 of which this verse a part?

So you were Eph 4:30 HS SEALED by your ACTIONS as well as faith ?
Interesting, were again are the verses where Paul teaches ACTIONS are ALSO a requirement to be Eph 4:30 sealed ?

 

[Lambano]

Interesting, w(h)ere again are the verses where Paul teaches ACTIONS are ALSO a requirement to be Eph 4:30 sealed ?

Here's some more good questions to ponder:

• What happens when the Holy Spirit is grieved?
• What did Paul mean by the phrase, "the works of Torah"?

 

[PeterAndroz]

Here's some more good questions to ponder:

• What happens when the Holy Spirit is grieved?
• What did Paul mean by the phrase, "the works of Torah"?

What did Paul teach were the ACTION requirements to be saved/sealed/justified/made righteous ?
Let's see :_
Titus 3:
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Gal 2:
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
Gal 3:
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster
Rom 3:
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Eph 2:
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Rom 4:
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Rom 5:
1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Rom 11:
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

 

[gpresdo]

You misunderstand those many passages.

U cant change them. ......Long established application.

 

[gpresdo]

Then list the actual Scripture that teaches how someone today is saved & sealed
..
Who did Christ select as the Apostle & Minister to the Gentiles ?
Acts 9:15
But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, ...
Rom 11:13
For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles...
Rom 15:16
That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God...
+++
The other Apostles agreed & knew who taught who
Gal 2:2
And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles,....
Gal 2:7
But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
Gal 2:9
And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
++++
What is the role of an Apostle/Minister ?
To teach THEIR audience.
BUT NOW there are NO SEPARATE audiences ALL are equal :-
Gal 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 6:15
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
1 Cor 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Col 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
++++
How are believers 'today' saved, sealed, justified, made righteous ?
By the SAVING Gospel that applies today.
Gal 1:11-12
11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
1 Cor 15:1-4
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Eph 1:13
13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 4:30
30And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
++++
The PERFORMANCE conditions :-
Titus 3:
5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Gal 2:
16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Rom 3:
28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Eph 2:
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Rom 4:
5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Rom 5:
1Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
Rom 11:
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
++++
Your 'deeds'/works/behavior/performance only decide your eternal rewards/loss
Rom 14:10
10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
1 Cor 3:10-15
10According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
2 Cor 5:10
10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

Your general references does not validate your argument. Show me scriptures. Like this;
Maintain until the end. Matt.24...13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Allow no man to steal your crowns.
Only Christ provides Grace for forgiveness.(..."in Jesus' name Amen").

 

[PeterAndroz]

Your general references does not validate your argument. Show me scriptures. Like this;
Maintain until the end. Matt.24...13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Allow no man to steal your crowns.
Only Christ provides Grace for forgiveness.(..."in Jesus' name Amen").

and the comprehensive list of verses that support your opinions are ?
Take your time, no rush :)

 

[PeterAndroz]

U cant change them. ......Long established application.

U can't quote a comprehensive list of verses to support your claims so you just make short ignorant comments

 

[Gray_Joy]

U cant change them. ......Long established application.

I wouldn't dream of changing them.

Eternal irrevocable Salvation,and the seal of the holy Spirit with and upon the redeemed, until the day of redemption,is everything God said it is,and eternally guaranteed and sealed as such by the pure holy blood of Christ.

I can't believe anyone who has the spirit within them would insist it is only as lasting as its critics say it is. Because Jesus didn't mean it when he gives us Eternal Life after we were first otherwise forever dead in our trespasses and sins.

Nope,I can't,won't, believe it.

Because anyone who knows,knows the old is passed away. And the new is alive in them.