What does it mean?

[faithhopecharity]

the solution: "initial the grace of justification"!

Jn 15:5 apart from Christ? nothing!

nothing of merit or value in God's eyes! nothing spiritual or supernatural, nothing meriting eternal salvation!

phil 4:13 with Christ? all things!

union

By the grace of justification received by faith and baptism we have union with God thru Christ, in the communion of saints, empowered by grace and life in the spirit to attain to eternal salvation on glory!

Our good works after we receive the grace of justification are transformed by grace and performed in grace united with Christ and given life of the spirit because of God's grace operating in us!

we do not possess eternal salvation in this life, but the grace of God that must be increased by good works (mt 7:7 mt 26:41 2 pet 3:18) and can be lost by deadly sin! (Eph 5:2-6
gal 5:1-4 gal 5:19-21 gal 6:7-8
1 cor 6:9-10 & 15-20)


mk 10:30
...in the world to come eternal life.

John 4:36
...gathereth fruit unto life eternal:

John 10:28
And I give unto them eternal life...

John 12:25
He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

Romans 5:21
That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Jude 1:21
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

thks

 

[ScottA]

not required?

how can you be a disciple without works?

Lk 14:26-27
If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple. And whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.

can someone who is not a disciple attain to eternal salvation?

thks

Yes, "someone who is not a disciple" can "attain to eternal salvation."

The only requirement is belief. This is evident with the thief on the cross, who simply believed at the last moment and then died.

Perhaps what you are referring to are the works that come [after] "eternal salvation"--which is to say, after one is born again of the spirit of God--which is salvation. Works even then can hardly be claimed by "we who are alive and remain" (1 Thessalonians 4:15 --alive in God, but remaining in this world yet in the flesh). Because technically it really "is no longer we who live but Christ who lives in us" (Galatians 2:20).

So, discipleship encompasses all who seek salvation, and also those "who are alive and remain" after salvation. Meaning, those still seeking salvation can join in good works, even the good works of Christ--but if during any of that time before salvation (Christ) comes into them they turn away from following him, they are no longer a disciple of Christ, thus cannot claim even those works they may have done in his name. Which, by definition, cannot rightfully be called discipline.

 

[faithhopecharity]

Like this:
1 Peter 2:5
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, TO OFFER UP "SPIRITUAL SACRIFICES." ACCEPTABLE TO GOD BY Jesus Christ.

Cuz, ya see? the "word" FAITH = "EFFORT!" Where many stop at the "word" BELIEVE? What is actually celebrated and rewarded is?: "BELIEEEEVEINNNNG!"
The meaning of "Spiritual Sacrifices" in the above verse, is indicative of "UNSEEN EFFORT/S"
Hebrews 7:11
If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that ANOTHER PRIEST should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

This comes after YEARS of "BEELEEEVEEENG!"
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection (COMPLETENESS); not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,
(an add on edit)
Believe it or not? Doing this "carries a lot of water" towards "Acts ATTRIBUTABLE towards RIGHTEOUSNESS!"
Or so I've been told!
Hope this helps.

why does 1 cor 13:13 say three things are eternal faith, hope, and charity

not belieeeeeeeeeving!

thks

 

[newnature]

When you understand the agony that Romans chapter 7 ended without resolving, but the division into chapters and verses did not exist in the original text, these divisions were introduced centuries later for practical reasons of study and reference. This means there was no dramatic pause between the end of chapter 7 and the beginning of chapter 8, it was the cry of anguish, wretched man that I am, who will deliver me from this body of death, Romans 7:24 and the declaration of liberation that follows in chapter 8 are part of the same movement, separating them creates an artificial rupture that distorts both the question and the answer.

Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, Romans 8:1. Most people hear this declaration as a kind of emotional absolution, a guarantee that God is not angry with you, that your mistakes have been erased and that you can move on in peace. The Greek word translated as condemnation in this verse is katakrima and it carries a very specific legal sense. Katakrima is not just about feelings of guilt or moral disapproval, Paul is using courtroom language, this word evoked divine judgment upon the violation of the law, not a vague shame, but a concrete and definitive consequence.

When Paul declares that there is no katakrima for those who are in Christ Jesus, he is saying the judicial process has been closed, that the verdict has already been pronounced and that the sentence that would have applied to the defendant has been executed elsewhere upon another body. The cross was not a symbolic gesture of divine affection, it was the fulfillment of a real sentence. Paul does not say that there is no condemnation for those who believe or for those who have repented or for those who are trying to live better, the condition is to be in Christ.

In Christ describes a reality of union, belonging, embodied identity, it is not a position that is earned by moral effort, it is a position that is received by faith and transforms the very nature of the relationship with God. In Christ is a profound understanding, no katakrima outside of this framework, is to transform a powerful theological declaration into a cheap consolation. The Greek word sarka, translated as flesh, does not mean the physical body itself, it means self-directed human existence, lived in its own strength, organized around autonomy in relation to God.

When Paul contrasts walking according to the flesh with walking according to the spirit, Romans 8:4-8, he is describing two organizing principles of human life, two fundamental orientations that determine how a person interprets reality, makes decisions and defines what matters. The mind of the flesh, according to verse 6, is death, not because the body is bad, but because a self-centered life closed to the influence of the spirit of God is operating outside the source from which all genuine life emanates. The mind of the spirit on the other hand, is life and peace, not as a reward for correct behavior, but as a natural consequence of being connected to that which sustains existence.

 

[faithhopecharity]

Galatians 5:13, if you are free from the law and you are saved only by grace, why not just sin as much as you want, if God’s job is to forgive and my job is to have fun, let us get to it, this is the most common objection to the message of grace. People are terrified that freedom will lead to chaos, but Paul crushes this idea, freedom is not the right to do whatever you want, that is actually a different kind of slavery. If you do whatever your impulses tell you to do, you are a slave to your impulses, true freedom is the power to do what you ought to do, it is the power to choose love over selfishness.

but does sin cause spiritual death, and loss of God's grace?

thks

 

[faithhopecharity]

When you understand the agony that Romans chapter 7 ended without resolving, but the division into chapters and verses did not exist in the original text, these divisions were introduced centuries later for practical reasons of study and reference. This means there was no dramatic pause between the end of chapter 7 and the beginning of chapter 8, it was the cry of anguish, wretched man that I am, who will deliver me from this body of death, Romans 7:24 and the declaration of liberation that follows in chapter 8 are part of the same movement, separating them creates an artificial rupture that distorts both the question and the answer.

Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, Romans 8:1. Most people hear this declaration as a kind of emotional absolution, a guarantee that God is not angry with you, that your mistakes have been erased and that you can move on in peace. The Greek word translated as condemnation in this verse is katakrima and it carries a very specific legal sense. Katakrima is not just about feelings of guilt or moral disapproval, Paul is using courtroom language, this word evoked divine judgment upon the violation of the law, not a vague shame, but a concrete and definitive consequence.

When Paul declares that there is no katakrima for those who are in Christ Jesus, he is saying the judicial process has been closed, that the verdict has already been pronounced and that the sentence that would have applied to the defendant has been executed elsewhere upon another body. The cross was not a symbolic gesture of divine affection, it was the fulfillment of a real sentence. Paul does not say that there is no condemnation for those who believe or for those who have repented or for those who are trying to live better, the condition is to be in Christ.

In Christ describes a reality of union, belonging, embodied identity, it is not a position that is earned by moral effort, it is a position that is received by faith and transforms the very nature of the relationship with God. In Christ is a profound understanding, no katakrima outside of this framework, is to transform a powerful theological declaration into a cheap consolation. The Greek word sarka, translated as flesh, does not mean the physical body itself, it means self-directed human existence, lived in its own strength, organized around autonomy in relation to God.

When Paul contrasts walking according to the flesh with walking according to the spirit, Romans 8:4-8, he is describing two organizing principles of human life, two fundamental orientations that determine how a person interprets reality, makes decisions and defines what matters. The mind of the flesh, according to verse 6, is death, not because the body is bad, but because a self-centered life closed to the influence of the spirit of God is operating outside the source from which all genuine life emanates. The mind of the spirit on the other hand, is life and peace, not as a reward for correct behavior, but as a natural consequence of being connected to that which sustains existence.

Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, Romans 8:1.

thats not rom 8:1 thats tradition!

this is rom 8:1

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

"WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH (gal 5:19-21 list)

gal 5:19-21
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

gal 6:7-8

7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

thks

 

[newnature]

but does sin cause spiritual death, and loss of God's grace?

thks

Matthew 22:12, now the text gives the man’s reaction and he was speechless, but the Greek verb behind speechless is not silence, it is not embarrassment, it is not the loss of words, it is something far more violent. The English language says speechless, the Greek word Matthew chose is the same word Jesus used to silence a storm on the sea of Galilee and it changes everything about what is happening in this room. Every English translation reads the same way, the man was speechless, that sounds like he had nothing to say, like he froze, like the awkward silence of someone caught at a party wearing the wrong thing, a social mishap, an embarrassment.

The Greek word is ephimothe, it comes from the Greek verb phimoo and phimoo does not mean to be silent, it does not mean to be at a loss for words, it means to muzzle, to close the mouth with a physical restraint, to gag, every major Greek lexicon confirms the primary definition, to shut the mouth the way you would muzzle an animal. This is the same verb used in Mark 4:39, Jesus stands in the boat during the storm on the sea, he speaks to the wind and the waves, the Greek verb is pephimoso, be muzzled and stay muzzled, a permanent gag order spoken to a raging sea. This is the same verb used in Mark 1:25, Jesus confronts a demon in the synagogue at Capernaum, phimotheti, be muzzled, same force.

The authority that closes the mouth of an unclean spirit is the same authority that closes the mouth of the garment-less man at the wedding feast and the form of the word matters. Ephimothe tells you the action was done TO him, he WAS muzzled, something outside him imposed the silence, he did not choose humility, he did not voluntarily go quiet, he did not run out of arguments, an authority above him shut his mouth the way a hand shuts the mouth of a storm. You know this moment, when something is so true about you that your jaw physically will not form the defense, not because you chose humility, because the truth arrived with a force that closed your mouth for you, that is phimoo, the muzzle, and the passage uses the same one on this man that Jesus uses on the sea.

 

[newnature]

Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, Romans 8:1.

thats not rom 8:1 thats tradition!

this is rom 8:1

There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

"WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH (gal 5:19-21 list)

gal 5:19-21
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

gal 6:7-8

7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.

8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

thks

The problem is not resolved with rules about what to eat, wear or physically avoid, because it is in the orientation of the mind, in the direction of thoughts, in the center of gravity of inner life. Paul is calling for a reorientation from the inside out, a change in what governs decisions and desires and this reorientation, Romans 8:9, is already possible for those who have the Holy Spirit of God dwelling in them, not as a future achievement, but as a present reality that needs to be lived. Paul was not doing abstract philosophy, when he described the carnal mind and the spiritual mind, he was mapping two concrete ways of inhabiting the world. Two ways of processing the human experience that produce radically different results.