(The Beast) & (The Two Witnesses) Will Be On This Earth Together For 3.5 Years (Then Cometh The End)

[ewq1938]

Did Jesus say a war begins the great tribulation ?

No. The entire trib is a war against Christians as per the last verse of Rev 12.

Matthew 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand: )

Now look at my chart. See it what it says ? The AoD setup begins the Great Tribulation.

That is part of the war.

 

[Truth7t7]

No, that does not happen at the second coming. You can verify that by reading Rev 19-21, where we see the second coming, a battle, then a thousand years, then judgment and only AFTER that does John see a new Earth etc.

Jesus Returns In Fire Judgement, As The Scripture Below Clearly Teaches

Jesus Is The Lord

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus Returns In Fire Judgement, As The Scripture Below Clearly Teaches

Neither support what you say. The Earth is not destroyed and replaced with a new Earth until AFTER the GWTJ, which is after the 1000 years which is AFTER the second coming. Anyone can read it in Rev 19-21.

 

[Truth7t7]

Neither support what you say. The Earth is not destroyed and replaced with a new Earth until AFTER the GWTJ, which is after the 1000 years which is AFTER the second coming. Anyone can read it in Rev 19-21.

Does Jesus return with fire as seen in the scripture below, a direct answer of yes-no would be sufficient

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

 

[Douggg]

(Third Woe Not Identified Rev 12:12)

Revelation 12:12KJV
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

If not the third woe to the inhabiters of the earth - then what woe to the inhabiters of the earth is it ?

 

[ewq1938]

Does Jesus return with fire as seen in the scripture below, a direct answer of yes-no would be sufficient

No. It says IN.

I'll ask you something too. Does Jesus use fire to kill anyone in any part of Rev 19?

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

 

[Davy]

The great tribulation is a war of Satan and his armies v the 2 witnesses and believers. God will intervene to stop the great tribulation before everyone dies because of it. AC will still be alive passed this time, but God will have begun his reign. God intervenes or stops the great tribulation with his wrath. Although Satan's armies will gather to fight against God, they will all become bird food. There is no real fighting against God.

"Matthew 24:29 I believe includes the events of Satan and his angels being cast down prior to the trib, even though it does say after the trib.
Joel 2:30-31
30 And I will shew wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
31 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come."

We shouldn't pick which is true because they are both true. After the period of great tribulation, the end of Daniel's 7th week, comes the period of God's wrath. Probably the great and terrible day will be the last day of God's wrath.

Verses of great tribulation:
Rev 6:12 "And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake;
Verses of God's wrath:
The rest of Rev chapter 6.
Proof: The signs after the great earthquake are the signs that immediately follow the great tribulation in Matt 24.

Verses of great tribulation:
Rev 7:9 - 8:4 excluding 8:2 which belongs with the next story beginning with Rev 8:6.
Verses of God's wrath:
Rev 8:5
Proof: The multitude in heaven were all killed during the great tribulation. The noises, thunders, lightnings, and earthquake always end God's wrath.

Verses of great tribulation:
When the army of the 6th trumpet removes the daily sacrifice - Rev 11:14
Verses of God's wrath:
Rev 11:15-19

This is the pattern of chapters 6-19 of the Revelation. The great tribulation ends. God's wrath is then poured out.

The "Day of the Lord" refers to many different times, past and present. It was the Day of the Lord when Babylon defeated Egypt in the days of King Nebuchadnezzar. Jer 46:10,13 "10 For this is the day of the Lord God of hosts, a day of vengeance, that he may avenge him of his adversaries: and the sword shall devour, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood: for the Lord God of hosts hath a sacrifice in the north country by the river Euphrates. 13 The word that the Lord spake to Jeremiah the prophet, how Nebuchadrezzar king of Babylon should come and smite the land of Egypt."

In regard to your Hebrews reference: The first shaking of the earth was at Mt Sinai. It will be like that when Jesus returns. Again, notice the lightning, thunder, voices, and earthquake. Ex 19:16,18 "16 And it came to pass on the third day in the morning, that there were thunders and lightnings, and a thick cloud upon the mount, and the voice of the trumpet exceeding loud; so that all the people that was in the camp trembled. 18 And mount Sinai was altogether on a smoke, because the Lord descended upon it in fire: and the smoke thereof ascended as the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mount quaked greatly."

Well, you're still missing the point about the "untimely figs", which changes the order of some of what you have said.

 

[Davy]

You believe that Christ's coming takes place during the great tribulation.

No, I don't. And you have never read me having said such a thing. Jesus comes to end... the "great tribulation", on the "last day" of this world when the resurrection happens.

You also believe that the signs of Christ's coming take place immediately after the great tribulation.

No, I do not. Again, you've never read me saying that.

You are making false assumptions. Signs appear just prior to Christ's coming. You need to read what I actually wrote.

 

[Davy]

1.) Satan was cast out of heaven long ago, as he tempted both Job and Jesus on this earth

That is... the tradition of men that some use for the Revelation 12:7-17 Scripture, but it is false. The casting out of Revelation 12:7 forward involves Jesus Christ, Israel and Christians. If you instead thought for yourself by The Holy Spirit instead of heeding idiotic men's doctrines designed by the devil, then you should have known that Christ had not come yet at Satan's original fall, nor did Israel yet exist back then, which are topics in that Rev.12:7-17 Scripture.

Likewise for your listening to idiotic doctrines of men that refuse to accept the future "thousand years" reign by Lord Jesus and His elect when He returns, as written in Revelation 20.

 

[William Barton]

IMO:
The three sets of judgments (trumpet, scroll, bowl) describe:
o. The coronation of Jesus in heaven (giving him authority over the land)
o. His return to the land with his mighty angels

o. Trumpets are call to order.
o. Scroll is reading of the decree giving Jesus authority.
o. Bowl (hot oil torture) is return of Jesus with his mighty angels.

The saved dead have been going to heaven all these years, beautiful place, much like earth, so they have no worries. Jesus will bring them with him from heaven when he returns (1Thessalonians 4:14).

 

[David Lamb]

o. Bowl (hot oil torture) is return of Jesus with his mighty angels.

Where do you find that the bowl(s) are hot oil torture? Here are the verses in Revelation that mention the word "bowl" (from the NKJV):

Rev_16:2 So the first went and poured out his bowl upon the earth, and a foul and loathsome sore came upon the men who had the mark of the beast and those who worshiped his image.
Rev_16:3 Then the second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it became blood as of a dead man; and every living creature in the sea died.
Rev_16:4 Then the third angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of water, and they became blood.
Rev_16:8 Then the fourth angel poured out his bowl on the sun, and power was given to him to scorch men with fire.
Rev_16:10 Then the fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and his kingdom became full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues because of the pain.
Rev_16:12 Then the sixth angel poured out his bowl on the great river Euphrates, and its water was dried up, so that the way of the kings from the east might be prepared.
Rev_16:17 Then the seventh angel poured out his bowl into the air, and a loud voice came out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, "It is done!"

No mention of any of the seven bowls containing hot oil. Perhaps you were thinking of a different Bible book.

 

[Douggg]

Since the war mentioned atr trhe end of chp 12 is the start of the trib, which is the 6th trump/2nd woe, the woe in Rev 12 at best could only be the 1st woe since oit is before the 2nd woe/trib/6th trump war against the church.

When Satan is cast down to earth, he will be the star that John saw falling to earth, who will open the bottomless pit and release the locust creatures.

 

[William Barton]

IMO:
o Two witnesses are Enoch and Elijah
o Antichrist will establish a peace accord and rebuild the temple
o Then sit in it proclaiming to be God (2Thessalonians 2:4)

 

[William Barton]

No mention of any of the seven bowls containing hot oil. Perhaps you were thinking of a different Bible book.

This is apocalyptic language. Hot oil was an ancient method of torture, and it is agonizing.

 

[Truth7t7]

If not the third woe to the inhabiters of the earth - then what woe to the inhabiters of the earth is it ?

Once Again:

Is the (Third Woe) named and identified below (100% Yes) and it's associated with the (7th Trump/Angel) sounding and the (Final Judgement) simple, clear, easy to understand and before your eyes

The "Third Woe" is seen in Rev 11:14 below and is clearly described as "Third Woe", you have "Added" your private interpretation to scripture in a claim that the 3rd woe is seen in Rev 12:12 below "False"

Merriam-Webster: Woe
1: a condition of deep suffering from misfortune, affliction, or grief
2: ruinous trouble : calamity, affliction

(Third Woe Not Identified Rev 12:12)

Revelation 12:12KJV
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

(Third Woe Directly Identified Rev 11:14)

Revelation 11:15-18KJV
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

The saved dead have been going to heaven all these years, beautiful place, much like earth, so they have no worries.

Hard to believe your claim made, "Heaven Is Much Like This Earth"? WOW!

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[Douggg]

(Third Woe Not Identified Rev 12:12)

Revelation 12:12KJV
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

You did not answer the question.

If the the Woe to the inhabiters of the earth in Revelation 12:12 is not the third woe to the ihabiters of the earth - then what woe number to the inhabiterrs of the earth in Revelation 12:12 is it ?

 

[6 Stories]

Revelation 8:13 says"woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth.

Now go to Revelation 12:12.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

That is the third woe. The third woe will last a time/times/half time. Revelation 12:14.

Rev 8:13 "And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!"

Why did you ignore trumpets 5, the first woe and trumpet 6, the second woe when you went to Revelation 12:12? The Devil was cast to the earth to create the first woe as well as the third woe.

I do agree with you that the trumpets align with Rev 12:7 and following.
Trumpet 1 War breaks out on earth. Rev 12:7 War breaks out in heaven.
Trumpet 2 The causer of the war is defeated. Rev 12:8 Satan and his angels are defeated.
Trumpet 3 A great star falls from heaven. Rev 12:9 Satan is the great star that is cast from heaven.
Trumpet 4 1/3 of heaven is darkened. Rev 12:9 1/3 of the angels of heaven are cast out with Satan.
Trumpet 5 The great star or Satan is on earth and has the key to the bottomless pit. Rev 12:12 Satan is on earth bringing woe. Woe 1.
Trumpet 6 The rise of the 200 million. Rev 12:13-13:18 Satan persecutes Israel and then Christians. 3.5 year great trib during 2nd woe.
Trumpet 7 God reigns and destroys the destroyers. Rev 14:1-20 God reigns and destroys the destroyers. 3rd woe.

These are the only 2 parallel stories that align so completely. Stories 3 and 4 on my chart.

 

[Douggg]

Third Woe Directly Identified Rev 11:14)

Revelation 11:15-18KJV
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Revelation11:16-18 is the reaction by them in heaven to Satan being cast down to earth in Revelation 12:12.

Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

 

[Douggg]

Why did you ignore trumpets 5, the first woe and trumpet 6, the second woe when you went to Revelation 12:12? The Devil was cast to the earth to create the first woe as well as the third woe.

No, I did ignore anything. When Satan is cast down to earth (in Revelation 12:12), he will be the star that John saw in Revelation 9:1 fall from (the second) heaven that will open the bottomless pit and releases the flesh tormenting locust creatures.