A WAR IS COMING, BUT IT WON’T BE FOUGHT ON EARTH.

[CrowCross]

Ussher's premise was that there were four days of the Lord which translates to a 4,000-year period and since he believed that Chrit was born in the year 4 BC, then the year should be 4,004 BC. Ussher was using Peter's statement that a day of the lord was equal to a 1,000 year period.

I've read nothing that said Ussher did it that way.

On the other hand Ussher might have understood what Barnabas wrote....though it never made it into the bible...

Reference.
Barnabas 15:3
Of the Sabbath He speaketh in the beginning of the creation; And
God made the works of His hands in six days, and He ended on the
seventh day, and rested on it, and He hallowed it.

Barnabas 15:4
Give heed, children, what this meaneth; He ended in six days. He
meaneth this, that in six thousand years the Lord shall bring all
things to an end; for the day with Him signifyeth a thousand years;
and this He himself beareth me witness, saying; Behold, the day of
the Lord shall be as a thousand years. Therefore, children, in six
days, that is in six thousand years, everything shall come to an end.

Barnabas 15:5
And He rested on the seventh day. this He meaneth; when His Son
shall come, and shall abolish the time of the Lawless One, and shall
judge the ungodly, and shall change the sun and the moon and the
stars, then shall he truly rest on the seventh day.

 

[Davy]

The people of the prince who is to come is the Roman Empire's army; the prince is the Little Horn around 300 years after the start of the fulfilment of the Daniel 8:8-17 2,300-year duration prophecy of the trampling of God's sanctuary/Temple and the trampling of God's earthly hosts, i.e. the nation of Israel. This 2,300-year trampling event start around the year 250 BC and it will end around the year, 2044-2045 AD. the Isaiah 24:21-22 judgement of the heavenly hosts and the kings of the earth will herald in the prophesied Peace Covenant in Ezekiel 34 and the saving of all of Israel as foretold by Paul in Romans 11:25b-26 after God begins gathering Israel to Himself to plant them in His fertile soil/field and teach them on the largest mountain in all of the world.

You are wrong, because even right now, this day, Islam has control of the Temple Mount in today's Jerusalem. And the U.N. controls the nation of Israel's borders. This is why Islamic radicals in Lebanon that fired missiles at Israel years ago, and Israel's army went across its border at them, that Israel had to give up the land they had conquered because of U.N. authority over them. Israeli tank general Dyan had to do the same thing at the end of the 1967 war, giving half of Jerusalem back to the Arabs, as it still is to this day.

The "people" of the prince are who represent the Roman general Titus and his Roman army that destroyed Jerusalem and the 2nd temple in 70 A.D. The actual "prince" (lower case) mentioned in that is about the Antichrist, especially the final Antichrist that is prophesied to come at the end of this present world.

Furthermore, the 2300 DAYS... of Daniel 8 is NOT GIVEN IN YEARS! That is Ellen White you are listening to with that false day-for-year idea applied to all Bible prophecies, when God only uses it where He mentions it in Bible Scripture. And He does NOT use it in that Daniel 8 Chapter...

Dan 8:9-14
9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.
11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.
12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.
13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
KJV

Verses 11-12 above refers to the Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15 "abomination of desolation" event Jesus gave as a Sign for the END of this world in the LAST generation which will see His future coming.

Verse 13 asks how long will it be until that "abomination of desolation" event and the temple and the host to be trodden under foot, pointing to a new 3rd stone temple today's Jews will build in Jerusalem for the END, as shown in Revelation 11.

The answer to that then is given in DAYS, not years, and the end point of the 2300 days is with the day of Christ's future return, for that is when the sanctuary will be cleansed. Therefore...


[.....................Daniel 9:27 "one week" or 7 years-----------][-Christ's 2nd coming]
[------1260 days------]AOD][------1260 days Trib--------]
[....................[-----------------2300 days--------------------]Cleansing (+30 days)
[220 days][---1040---]
[vision of daily sacf.--][AOD][-----Jerusalem trodden----]
[------------"one week" = total 2520 days----------------]


Revelation 11:1-2 says the Gentiles will tread the holy city (Jerusalem) for 42 months, which per lunar reckoning equals roughly 1260 days, and represents the future time of "great tribulation". It also says God's "two witnesses" will prophesy against the beast for that 1260 days period, and then the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will kill them, and leave their dead bodies laying in the street in Jerusalem. Per Revelation 13:4-8, the "dragon" is given power over all nations and peoples for 42 months at the end of this world, which also is given events that parallel the "little horn" working of the Book of Daniel.

 

[Jay Ross]

You are wrong, because even right now, this day, Islam has control of the Temple Mount in today's Jerusalem. And the U.N. controls the nation of Israel's borders. This is why Islamic radicals in Lebanon that fired missiles at Israel years ago, and Israel's army went across its border at them, that Israel had to give up the land they had conquered because of U.N. authority over them. Israeli tank general Dyan had to do the same thing at the end of the 1967 war, giving half of Jerusalem back to the Arabs, as it still is to this day.

If you say so, but the war in heaven started in the first century and it is continuing even now and from my study of the prophetic scriptures it will end with the gathering of the kings of the earth at Armageddon when the Isaiah 24:21-22 prophecy comes into effect.

The "people" of the prince are who represent the Roman general Titus and his Roman army that destroyed Jerusalem and the 2nd temple in 70 A.D. The actual "prince" (lower case) mentioned in that is about the Antichrist, especially the final Antichrist that is prophesied to come at the end of this present world.

The prince, who God stated would be given armies to trample God's Sanctuary and His earthly host, is still influencing armies from around the world to trample God's Sanctuary and His earthly host still, and when the Judgement of the Heavenly Hosts and the Kings of the earth takes place, this judgement will, I believe, occur in 2044/2045 AD and the Judged entities will be imprisoned for many dads to await the time of their punishment. In the OT the Little Horn is the key entity that has kept the trampling going from around 250 BC to this present time. After the Bottomless Pit is unlocked after the 1,000 years, the Little Horn is relabelled as the False Prophet. It is after the unlocking of the Bottomless pit and Satan, and the other heavenly hosts, are able to influence people once more and the period of the Great Tribulation will begin and continue over the little while period which will have a duraion of around 24 years.

Furthermore, the 2300 DAYS... of Daniel 8 is NOT GIVEN IN YEARS! That is Ellen White you are listening to with that false day-for-year idea applied to all Bible prophecies, when God only uses it where He mentions it in Bible Scripture. And He does NOT use it in that Daniel 8 Chapter...

Dan 8:9-14
9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.
11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.
12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.
13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
KJV

Verses 11-12 above refers to the Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15 "abomination of desolation" event Jesus gave as a Sign for the END of this world in the LAST generation which will see His future coming.

Verse 13 asks how long will it be until that "abomination of desolation" event and the temple and the host to be trodden under foot, pointing to a new 3rd stone temple today's Jews will build in Jerusalem for the END, as shown in Revelation 11.

The answer to that then is given in DAYS, not years, and the end point of the 2300 days is with the day of Christ's future return, for that is when the sanctuary will be cleansed. Therefore...

Perhaps you have called this right Davy but the historical evidence I have considered disagrees with you.

[.....................Daniel 9:27 "one week" or 7 years-----------][-Christ's 2nd coming]
[------1260 days------]AOD][------1260 days Trib--------]
[....................[-----------------2300 days--------------------]Cleansing (+30 days)
[220 days][---1040---]
[vision of daily sacf.--][AOD][-----Jerusalem trodden----]
[------------"one week" = total 2520 days----------------]


Revelation 11:1-2 says the Gentiles will tread the holy city (Jerusalem) for 42 months, which per lunar reckoning equals roughly 1260 days, and represents the future time of "great tribulation". It also says God's "two witnesses" will prophesy against the beast for that 1260 days period, and then the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit will kill them, and leave their dead bodies laying in the street in Jerusalem. Per Revelation 13:4-8, the "dragon" is given power over all nations and peoples for 42 months at the end of this world, which also is given events that parallel the "little horn" working of the Book of Daniel.

Oh well, Davy, we both have to be patient to see if our respective understandings is confirmed by the unfolding of the end Times/Last Days.

Shalom

 

[William Barton]

Satan and his angels are already on earth. It was Satan speaking through the serpent to Eve (Genesis 3:4, Revelation 20:2).

Satan had been thrown down from heaven (Ezekiel 28:14-17).

 

[Davy]

Satan and his angels are already on earth. It was Satan speaking through the serpent to Eve (Genesis 3:4, Revelation 20:2).

Satan had been thrown down from heaven (Ezekiel 28:14-17).

You don't know what Heaven is, nor do you know The Bible about angels appearing on earth with the image of men. It's because you've been taught to rely on your FLESH.

 

[rwb]

Revelation 12 reveals a stunning future battle in heaven: Michael and God’s angels will confront Satan and his forces, and Satan will be defeated and cast down to earth.

How can this battle in heaven be future since through this battle John writes, "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ:" (Rev 12:7-11)? According to the words Christ spoke to Zacchaeus, Christ came with salvation when He came to earth a man.

Lu 19:9 And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.
Lu 19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

Also, the Scripture tells us Christ through His cross and resurrection Satan is already a defeated foe.

Heb 2:14 ¶ Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
Heb 2:15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

 

[rwb]

Just because one war is in heaven does not mean a war on Earth isn't coming. The war in the last verse of Rev 12 is a reference to the Tribulation, found in Rev 13.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

I agree. This war between the dragon and the remnant of the seed (Christ) of the woman that brings "great tribulation" to those who keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ (gospel of the Kingdom of God through Christ) began with the first advent of Christ and will not end until the last/seventh trumpet sounds that there shall no longer be time given this earth whereby man must be born again (saved).

 

[Davy]

I agree. This war between the dragon and the remnant of the seed (Christ) of the woman that brings "great tribulation" to those who keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ (gospel of the Kingdom of God through Christ) began with the first advent of Christ and will not end until the last/seventh trumpet sounds that there shall no longer be time given this earth whereby man must be born again (saved).

You wish.

That war in Heaven has not happened yet today. But when it does, the whole world will know it, because they will see Satan as he is, in Jerusalem, playing Christ-Messiah.

 

[William Barton]

Satan has several epithets, such as:
o. dragon (Revelation 13:13)
o. serpent (Revelation 13:14, 20:2)
o. הילל (Hebrew helel, Isaiah 14:12) = "shining one."
o. Lucifer (Isaiah 14:12, Latin/English translation = "light bearer")

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

That is one way to look at it.

As I asked.....How do you now this war didn't happen when Jesus died on the cross....as John was re-capping.

This is a good point. But something else seems to contradict this sermon - Satan already took 1/3 of the angels with him when he rebelled against God. Rev. 12 sounds like the war that happened long ago, around the time shorty after creation. And demons have been roaming the earth even before Christ. Rev. 12 cannot be chronological, it is just an historical review. Satan already has gone after Israel and the child ( Jesus)..This pastor ... and many like him are confused.

 

[rwb]

You wish.

That war in Heaven has not happened yet today. But when it does, the whole world will know it, because they will see Satan as he is, in Jerusalem, playing Christ-Messiah.

If the war in heaven has not yet been fought, why would John hear a voice from heaven after the battle is won saying, NOW is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ?

Do you really imagine that salvation, strength, the Kingdom of our God, and the power of Christ have not yet come to man? The voice John hears, says Christians overcame (past tense) the dragon by the blood of the Lamb, and by the Word of their testimony (the gospel of the Kingdom of God) and kept the faith unto death.

Re 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
Re 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

I believe you are the one who might be wishing!

 

[rwb]

This is a good point. But something else seems to contradict this sermon - Satan already took 1/3 of the angels with him when he rebelled against God. Rev. 12 sounds like the war that happened long ago, around the time shorty after creation. And demons have been roaming the earth even before Christ. Rev. 12 cannot be chronological, it is just an historical review. Satan already has gone after Israel and the child ( Jesus)..This pastor ... and many like him are confused.

Can you please provide the verses telling us that Satan took 1/3 of the angels with him when he rebelled against God? Where within the creation account of six days can we find proof that Satan (serpent) rebelled against God?

 

[rwb]

That is one way to look at it.

As I asked.....How do you now this war didn't happen when Jesus died on the cross....as John was re-capping.

Good question! Reading Rev 12 indicates the war was fought and won by Michael and his angels when Christ came to earth a man! Because it is through Christ that man might be born again. That's why the dragon (Satan) fought against His birth, knowing from the moment Christ was born he became a defeated foe. Which is why Christ tells us, "I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it." (Mt 16:18)

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Can you please provide the verses telling us that Satan took 1/3 of the angels with him when he rebelled against God? Where within the creation account of six days can we find proof that Satan (serpent) rebelled against God?

ISAIAH 14:12-15
12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
O [d]Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!
13 For you have said in your heart:
‘I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.’
15 Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol,
To the [e]lowest depths of the Pit.




from Hebrew ,halal, transliterated helel, in Greek, lucifer
Morning star, day star, shining one
God is speaking to angel, a person and calls him morning star, Halal or Lucifer in the Greek.
Lucifer's name was changed to Satan. He was no longer a bright morning star.
These are English translations that use Lucifer:

DRA Douay-Rheims 1899
GNV 1599 Geneva
JUB Jubilee Bible
TLB. Living Bible
MEV Modern English
KJV
NKJV
WYC Wycliffe

LUCIFER SINS AND IS CAST OUT OF HEAVEN AND IS DESTROYED, stripped of his position as a Cherub, stripped of his beauty, transformed into a serpent, dragon, Satan.

"Son of man, take up a lamentation for the Son of man, take up a lamentation for the king of Tyre, and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord God:
“You were the seal of perfection,
Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of God;
Every precious stone was your covering:
The sardius, topaz, and diamond,
Beryl, onyx, and jasper,
Sapphire, turquoise, and emerald with gold.
The workmanship of your timbrels and pipes
Was prepared for you on the day you were created.
14 “You were the anointed cherub who covers;
I established you;
You were on the holy mountain of God;
You walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones.
15 You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created,
Till iniquity was found in you.
16 “By the abundance of your trading
You became filled with violence within,
And you sinned;
Therefore I cast you as a profane thing
Out of the mountain of God;
And I destroyed you, O covering cherub,
From the midst of the fiery stones.
17 “Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor;
I cast you to the ground,
I laid you before kings,
That they might gaze at you.
18 “You defiled your sanctuaries
By the multitude of your iniquities,
By the iniquity of your trading;
Therefore I brought fire from your midst;
It devoured you,
And I turned you to ashes upon the earth
In the sight of all who saw you.
19 All who knew you among the peoples are astonished at you;
You have become a horror,
And shall be no more forever.” ’ ”
Ezek. 28:12-19
These verses also support this event:
• Revelation 12:7-9:
This passage describes a war in heaven where a dragon, identified as Satan and the Devil, is cast out of heaven along with his angels. (1/3 of them)
• Matthew 25:41:
This verse mentions Satan being cast out of heaven with his angels, reinforcing the idea of a fallen angel.

We only see a few verses in Scripture where Satan is talking: (Gen. 3; Job 1; John 8:44; John 10:10; Matthew 4); but many verses tell us what his purpose is, to accuse, to tempt, lie and deceive, devour and destroy mankind. In Job 1, we also see that He can do nothing without God's permission.

 

[rwb]

ISAIAH 14:12-15
12 “How you are fallen from heaven,
O [d]Lucifer, son of the morning!
How you are cut down to the ground,
You who weakened the nations!
13 For you have said in your heart:
‘I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.’
15 Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol,
To the [e]lowest depths of the Pit.




from Hebrew ,halal, transliterated helel, in Greek, lucifer
Morning star, day star, shining one
God is speaking to angel, a person and calls him morning star, Halal or Lucifer in the Greek.
Lucifer's name was changed to Satan. He was no longer a bright morning star.
These are English translations that use Lucifer:

DRA Douay-Rheims 1899
GNV 1599 Geneva
JUB Jubilee Bible
TLB. Living Bible
MEV Modern English
KJV
NKJV
WYC Wycliffe

LUCIFER SINS AND IS CAST OUT OF HEAVEN AND IS DESTROYED, stripped of his position as a Cherub, stripped of his beauty, transformed into a serpent, dragon, Satan.

"Son of man, take up a lamentation for the Son of man, take up a lamentation for the king of Tyre, and say to him, ‘Thus says the Lord God:
“You were the seal of perfection,
Full of wisdom and perfect in beauty.
13 You were in Eden, the garden of God;
Every precious stone was your covering:
The sardius, topaz, and diamond,
Beryl, onyx, and jasper,
Sapphire, turquoise, and emerald with gold.
The workmanship of your timbrels and pipes
Was prepared for you on the day you were created.
14 “You were the anointed cherub who covers;
I established you;
You were on the holy mountain of God;
You walked back and forth in the midst of fiery stones.
15 You were perfect in your ways from the day you were created,
Till iniquity was found in you.
16 “By the abundance of your trading
You became filled with violence within,
And you sinned;
Therefore I cast you as a profane thing
Out of the mountain of God;
And I destroyed you, O covering cherub,
From the midst of the fiery stones.
17 “Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty;
You corrupted your wisdom for the sake of your splendor;
I cast you to the ground,
I laid you before kings,
That they might gaze at you.
18 “You defiled your sanctuaries
By the multitude of your iniquities,
By the iniquity of your trading;
Therefore I brought fire from your midst;
It devoured you,
And I turned you to ashes upon the earth
In the sight of all who saw you.
19 All who knew you among the peoples are astonished at you;
You have become a horror,
And shall be no more forever.” ’ ”
Ezek. 28:12-19
These verses also support this event:
• Revelation 12:7-9:
This passage describes a war in heaven where a dragon, identified as Satan and the Devil, is cast out of heaven along with his angels. (1/3 of them)
• Matthew 25:41:
This verse mentions Satan being cast out of heaven with his angels, reinforcing the idea of a fallen angel.

We only see a few verses in Scripture where Satan is talking: (Gen. 3; Job 1; John 8:44; John 10:10; Matthew 4); but many verses tell us what his purpose is, to accuse, to tempt, lie and deceive, devour and destroy mankind. In Job 1, we also see that He can do nothing without God's permission.

Isaiah 14 is a proverb directed to be spoken to the King of Babylon. It is not directed to Satan.

Yes, Lucifer does mean son of the morning or bright and morning star. Which is why Lucifer is not a name given to Satan, because Christ alone is the Son of the morning and bright and shining star.

Re 2:27 And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
Re 2:28 And I will give him the morning star.

Revelation 22:16 (KJV) I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Satan, OTOH is never said to be good. Scripture depicts this spirit being as darkness and evil, calling him a liar and murderer from the beginning. This is proven when we read of how he, depicted as a serpent in the creation accounting deceived the woman and cast the whole of creation into chaos introducing mankind to sin and death.

John 8:44 (KJV) Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Nowhere in Scripture is Satan ever identified as a "cherub" that sinned against God. Cherub is defined "an imaginary figure". That does not describe Satan who as the serpent is said to be more subtil (cunning & crafty in a bad way) than any of the beasts of the field God created. Which is how he was able to deceive the woman.

Genesis 3:1 (KJV) Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

There is nothing written in Scripture indicating the angels of God fell with Satan. The passage found in Rev 12 says with his tail, the great red dragon cast to earth the third part of the stars in heaven, casting them to earth. The passage speaks of sons of Jacob that became the nation of Israel, likening back to Joseph's dream. They can be called human sons of God, but not angels, that are spirit beings.

Re 12:1 ¶ And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

Ge 37:7 For, behold, we were binding sheaves in the field, and, lo, my sheaf arose, and also stood upright; and, behold, your sheaves stood round about, and made obeisance to my sheaf.
Ge 37:8 And his brethren said to him, Shalt thou indeed reign over us? or shalt thou indeed have dominion over us? And they hated him yet the more for his dreams, and for his words.
Ge 37:9 And he dreamed yet another dream, and told it his brethren, and said, Behold, I have dreamed a dream more; and, behold, the sun and the moon and the eleven stars made obeisance to me.

Angels of God have not rebelled against God and fallen. Because Scripture tells us that God says His angels are spirits sent to minister to heirs of salvation. His angels always do the will of their Creator.

Hebrews 1:7 (KJV) And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.

Heb 1:13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Heb 1:14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

As you've shown, the lamentation of Ezekiel upon the King of Tyrus, not the evil spirit called Satan.

 

[CrowCross]

Satan, OTOH is never said to be good. Scripture depicts this spirit being as darkness and evil, calling him a liar and murderer from the beginning. This is proven when we read of how he, depicted as a serpent in the creation accounting deceived the woman and cast the whole of creation into chaos introducing mankind to sin and death.


Nowhere in Scripture is Satan ever identified as a "cherub" that sinned against God. Cherub is defined "an imaginary figure". That does not describe Satan who as the serpent is said to be more subtil (cunning & crafty in a bad way) than any of the beasts of the field God created. Which is how he was able to deceive the woman.

I found your position above somewhat problematic.

Ezekiel 28 has this to say about Satan...It speaks of Satan in a pre-fallen state.

‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty......so much for saying Satan, OTOH is never said to be good.
13You were in Eden,
the garden of God.
Every kind of precious stone adorned you:
ruby, topaz, and diamond,
beryl, onyx, and jasper,
sapphire, turquoise, and emerald.
Your mountings and settings were crafted in gold,
prepared on the day of your creation.
14You were anointed as a guardian cherub, .....so much for saying"Nowhere in Scripture is Satan ever identified as a "cherub" that sinned against God."
for I had ordained you.
You were on the holy mountain of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15From the day you were created ....again, so much for saying Satan, OTOH is never said to be good.
you were blameless in your ways—
until wickedness was found in you.

 

[Davy]

If the war in heaven has not yet been fought, why would John hear a voice from heaven after the battle is won saying, NOW is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ?

You mean you cannot distinguish the difference between Christ's Salvation being 100% established in HEAVEN, when Satan and his angels once they are cast down to earth that it creates another WAR, on earth, a spiritual war against Christ's elect, with those in Christ killed per that 5th Seal link?

Is this really a proof that the Power of Christ has come upon the earth when that "dragon" is cast down with his angels?

Rev 13:7-8
7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
KJV

Do you not recall the 5th Seal about the souls of the dead under God's Altar in Heaven asking, "How Long?"...

Rev 6:9-11
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost Thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?"

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
KJV

So how can you NOT understand that in relation to those Revelation 12 verses?...

Rev 12:10-12
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night."

11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
KJV

 

[William Barton]

Can you please provide the verses telling us that Satan took 1/3 of the angels with him when he rebelled against God? Where within the creation account of six days can we find proof that Satan (serpent) rebelled against God?

Isaiah 14:12 compares Satan to the morning star (i.e. the planet Venus, which has a beautiful red/orange glow in the early morning, search your internet for a picture of Venus).

Satan is a resplendent cherub, who served in the throne room in the true temple in heaven. Search your internet, "description of the throne room in heaven." He got arrogant and was thrown down to earth.

"Third of the angels" is Revelation 12:3-4 ("third of the stars"), comparing angels to stars.

It's hard to imagine a cherub and angels being that stupid:
"Woe to those who quarrel with their Creator." (Isaiah 45:9)

Isaiah 14:12-16 is a dirge against the King of Babylon, along with Lucifer/Satan who supported him.

God's angels are on earth too, and they protect us (Matthew 18:10).

 

[William Barton]

Satan was cast down to earth long ago (Ezekiel 28:14-16).

 

[rwb]

I found your position above somewhat problematic.

Ezekiel 28 has this to say about Satan...It speaks of Satan in a pre-fallen state.

‘You were the seal of perfection,
full of wisdom and perfect in beauty......so much for saying Satan, OTOH is never said to be good.
13You were in Eden,
the garden of God.
Every kind of precious stone adorned you:
ruby, topaz, and diamond,
beryl, onyx, and jasper,
sapphire, turquoise, and emerald.
Your mountings and settings were crafted in gold,
prepared on the day of your creation.
14You were anointed as a guardian cherub, .....so much for saying"Nowhere in Scripture is Satan ever identified as a "cherub" that sinned against God."
for I had ordained you.
You were on the holy mountain of God;
you walked among the fiery stones.
15From the day you were created ....again, so much for saying Satan, OTOH is never said to be good.
you were blameless in your ways—
until wickedness was found in you.

Ezekiel is NOT addressing Satan in a pre-fallen state! How can we absolutely know this is FACT? Because nowhere in Scripture can we find Satan defined as a pre-fallen cherub or angel. Ezekiel 28 is a lamentation spoken upon King Tryrus, a human, not a spirit being. Man was at creation in the garden of Eden in a pre-fallen state, not the spirit being called Satan. Adam, representative of all mankind was full of wisdom and perfect in beauty in the garden of Eden before choosing to disobey God. It was he/Adam as representative of the whole human race who walked among the stones, and he/Adam as representative of all mankind who was to have been guardian who God calls cherub, not the spirit being called Satan.

Because man, not Satan was created in the image of God and told to multiply and subdue (conquer/subjugate) the earth, and have dominion over all that God had created. As the anointed cherub, in the same manner after the fall that God placed cherubims and a flaming sword to guard the way of the tree of life, less man should eat of the tree of life and live forever.

Ge 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
Ge 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

Ge 3:22 ¶ And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
Ge 3:23 Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
Ge 3:24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.

What would be the purpose of God to tell His prophet to take up a lamentation upon King Tyrus, telling him what shall become of this spirit foe called Satan? The lamentation is not directed at or for Satan, but to King Tyrus who was being used by Satan and through Satan Tyrus had become pompous and arrogant, thinking himself having greater wisdom even than Daniel. The heart of Tyrus was lifted up, and corrupted, so God instructs Ezekiel to say to him (not to Satan), "I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee." Why? Because Tyrus had defiled the sanctuaries of God through his many iniquities, so God says He will, "bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee."

None of this is spoken to Satan! Rather God sent His prophet Ezekiel to warn not only the king, but that we too might understand how the heart of man can be turned to wickedness when prideful sin rules over us.