Only one rapture of all the saints, and only one second coming of Christ

[Truth7t7]

That same Hebrew word (rab) is used elsewhere in Daniel 12, not just verse 2. Is it meaning 'all' in those verses too?

Better yet, let's look at every single instance of 'rab' in the book of Daniel then point out which verse or verses support your interpretation of that word in Daniel 12:2.


Dan 8:25, Dan 8:26, Dan 9:27, Dan 11:14, Dan 11:18, Dan 11:26, Dan 11:33, Dan 11:34, Dan 11:39, Dan 11:40, Dan 11:41, Dan 11:44, Dan 12:2, Dan 12:3, Dan 12:4, Dan 12:10

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many(rab): he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
26 And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many(rab)
days.

Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many(rab) for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Daniel 11:14 And in those times there shall many(rab) stand up against the king of the south: also the robbers of thy people shall exalt themselves to establish the vision; but they shall fall.

Daniel 11:18 After this shall he turn his face unto the isles, and shall take many(rab) : but a prince for his own behalf shall cause the reproach offered by him to cease; without his own reproach he shall cause it to turn upon him.

Daniel 11:26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow: and many(rab) shall fall down slain.

Daniel 11:33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many(rab): yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many(rab) days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many(rab) shall cleave to them with flatteries.

Daniel 11:39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many(rab), and shall divide the land for gain.

Daniel 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many(rab) ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many(rab) countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.

Daniel 12:2 And many(rab) of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many(rab) to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many(rab) shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Daniel 12:10 Many(rab) shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

Why do you disregard the fact that (The Book Of Life Is Open) in Daniel 12:1, this represents (The Final Judgement) as seen in Revelation 20:11-15 (The End), (The Book Of Life Is Open) once in the future at (Final Judgement)

Daniel 12:1-2KJV
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Revelation 20:11-15KJV
11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

 

[The Light]

If all is meant what Hebrew word, not English word, would likely have been used? I fully agree many(rab) isn't meaning all. So wondering if you might know what Hebrew word likely would have been used if all is meant?

Kol

 

[The Light]

Why do you disregard the fact that (The Book Of Life Is Open) in Daniel 12:1, this represents (The Final Judgement) as seen in Revelation 20:11-15 (The End), (The Book Of Life Is Open) once in the future at (Final Judgement)

Daniel 12:1-2KJV
1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Simple. Because those raised from the dead are those who SHALL shall be found written in the book.

It does not say that the book is opened. God knows who is in the book, and does not need to open the book to know what names are in the book.

 

[The Light]

That same Hebrew word (rab) is used elsewhere in Daniel 12, not just verse 2. Is it meaning 'all' in those verses too?

Better yet, let's look at every single instance of 'rab' in the book of Daniel then point out which verse or verses support your interpretation of that word in Daniel 12:2.


Dan 8:25, Dan 8:26, Dan 9:27, Dan 11:14, Dan 11:18, Dan 11:26, Dan 11:33, Dan 11:34, Dan 11:39, Dan 11:40, Dan 11:41, Dan 11:44, Dan 12:2, Dan 12:3, Dan 12:4, Dan 12:10

Daniel 8:25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many(rab): he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
26 And the vision of the evening and the morning which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be for many(rab)
days.

Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many(rab) for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Daniel 11:14 And in those times there shall many(rab) stand up against the king of the south: also the robbers of thy people shall exalt themselves to establish the vision; but they shall fall.

Daniel 11:18 After this shall he turn his face unto the isles, and shall take many(rab) : but a prince for his own behalf shall cause the reproach offered by him to cease; without his own reproach he shall cause it to turn upon him.

Daniel 11:26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow: and many(rab) shall fall down slain.

Daniel 11:33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many(rab): yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many(rab) days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many(rab) shall cleave to them with flatteries.

Daniel 11:39 Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many(rab), and shall divide the land for gain.

Daniel 11:40 And at the time of the end shall the king of the south push at him: and the king of the north shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, and with horsemen, and with many(rab) ships; and he shall enter into the countries, and shall overflow and pass over.
41 He shall enter also into the glorious land, and many(rab) countries shall be overthrown: but these shall escape out of his hand, even Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon.

Daniel 12:2 And many(rab) of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many(rab) to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many(rab) shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

Daniel 12:10 Many(rab) shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

This is an excellent post. This is mic drop.

This post shuts down the nonsense that many (rab) is all in Daniel 12:2.

Not only does it shut down the many is all nonsense, it is one of many proofs that prove the post trib view is incorrect.

But the doctrine MUST be protected at all costs. Truth is not the goal.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

This is what I beleive

View attachment 91264

So, you believe things that are not taught in the Bible. I see.

 

[ewq1938]

I grasp your logic except I'm not convinced that those that awake to everlasting shame don't awake when the ones that awake to everlasting life do. But I'm only meaning in Daniel 12:2. Not meaning John 5 as well. IOW, some of the lost rise in order to appear at the sheep and goats judgment involving the saved and the lost within the church. The remainder of the lost rise after the millennium in order to be judged at the GWTJ. I guess you would have to interpret the sheep and goats judgment in the manner I do in order to see why I conclude this.

All I can say is all the passage about the resurrections of the end times show two, with the saved always first and the wicked second. Only one passage says how much time happens inbetween. I don't see one passage speaking of a different set of two resurrection than the others.

 

[ewq1938]

My Bible is in English.

Mine is Hebrew and Greek and a small amount or Aramaic.

It would have to be worded...........All of them that sleep in dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Does not have to be worded that way, especially something written thousands of years ago in a different language.

 

[ewq1938]

You falsely have the righteous saved being resurrected 1,000 years before (The Last Day)

It comes from the bible, Rev 20

and you remove the words (Then Cometh The End) as if they don't exist, then you falsely teach that mortals on this earth live for 1,000 years beyond the words described? "100% "False"

No, that is also found in Rev 2 and 19. Rev 2 also discusses what happens after "the end".

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite (Aorist tense verb with PRESENT tense meaning) the nations: and he shall rule (FUTURE tense verb) them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth (PRESENT tense verb) the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

https://www.blueletterbible .org/kjv/rev/19/15/t_conc_1186015

https://biblehub .com/interlinear/revelation/19-15.htm

(remove the spaces before .com and .org in the two links)


Here rule/poimaino is in the FUTURE tense meaning it will happen at some point AFTER the second coming and battle of Armageddon while treadeth/pateo is written in the PRESENT tense meaning it is happening during this second coming. The treading and smiting are happening at Armageddon but not the ruling which proves some mortals will be alive after Armageddon is over. This proves the Premill position because indeed there is a future rule of people who were not slain during the second coming that Christ and his saints will rule over.

A second witness to this:

Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.

That is the second coming. Everything we read of next comes after the second coming:

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers. They will be given power over the mortal unsaved nations after Christ has returned not before it.

 

[ewq1938]

This is an excellent post. This is mic drop.

This post shuts down the nonsense that many (rab) is all in Daniel 12:2.

Not only does it shut down the many is all nonsense, it is one of many proofs that prove the post trib view is incorrect.

But the doctrine MUST be protected at all costs. Truth is not the goal.

The other doctrines must also be protected, in a different sense, since they are key in how the end times play out..

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

100% Yes

2 different explanations of the Lord's second coming that contain different details

There is one future second coming of Jesus Christ, this takes place on the last day, on the day of the Lord

Yes the poster falsely believes and teaches of two future comings of Jesus Christ, and we both know well that's a bogus claim not found in scripture "Fact"!

I agree. I asked him that question because he concludes that two passages are not referring to the same event just because one doesn't mention angels gathering the elect. Well, Revelation 19:11-21 doesn't mention angels gathering the elect, either, but I doubt that leads him to conclude that Revlation 19:11-21 is a different event than Matthew 24:30-31. So, what I'm showing is that pretribs are not consistent with their logic.