Conversation with An Atheist

[Wrangler]

You know that the Bible makes claims that are not scientific

So? Is capital-S, Science, your god?

 

[Wrangler]

In an earlier post, you said you try to live a good, moral life.

1. How can you do this if morality is subjective and evolving?
2. Conversely, how can you fail to obtain this value?
3. And if you don’t objectively know if you’ve obtained what you claim to value, what good are your morals and the whole purpose of your atheist life?

I take it that these questions burn in the minds of any thoughtful person?

I'm not most atheists.... I'm asking you questions that you can't answer and you know it.

You are the one not answering questions! I just asked 4. In response, you invoke Appeal to Diversion, asking questions of your own.

What do you think that your eternal life will look like Wrangler?
Answer the question honestly... If you can.

I’ll be happy to answer, once you answer mine.

Honestly, you are all over the place. Previously, you said the main reason you’re not a Christian is because the Gospel’s don’t agree. When that was addressed, you just move on, a moving target.

Then you dove into Evolution. When that was addressed, you moved on, more moving targets.

Claiming deism is a compromise that better fits ‘the Science’. When that was addressed, you moved on, more moving targets. Now it’s life style after the resurrection.

Our we supposed to believe that once this question is addressed, then you’ll believe? (We know you won’t answer because you are like every Atheist, ask questions but refuse to answer any.)

 

[Matthias]

“I’ve told you countless times that I think Jesus was a good man…. Paul not so much.” - @Mancunian.

Post in thread 'Your thoughts on assisted dying?'
Your thoughts on assisted dying?

I was thinking about your comment this afternoon.

Jesus (a “good man”) likens you to a pig and Paul (something less than a “good man”) advises you / all unbelievers to “eat and drink, for tomorrow [you] die.”

***

You’re on a collision course with extinction. No one - not God, not Jesus, not Paul, not me, not anyone - is going to stop you.

If you could have it, what does the perfect life look like for you before you die?

 

[Mancunian]

“I’ve told you countless times that I think Jesus was a good man…. Paul not so much.” - @Mancunian.

Post in thread 'Your thoughts on assisted dying?'
Your thoughts on assisted dying?

I was thinking about your comment this afternoon.

Jesus (a “good man”) likens you to a pig and Paul (something less than a “good man”) advises you / all unbelievers to “eat and drink, for tomorrow [you] die.”

***

You’re on a collision course with extinction. No one - not God, not Jesus, not Paul, not me, not anyone - is going to stop you.

If you could have it, what does the perfect life look like for you before you die?

I'm ok with extinction, my life would have run it's course and it will be my time.
Death doesn't scare me, the run up to it does...
It's the same thing as when a plane that you're travelling on goes down, the impact isn't what you need to worry about, it's the five minutes beforehand.

 

[Matthias]

I'm ok with extinction, my life would have run it's course and it will be my time.

God doesn’t desire your extinction but he‘ll be okay that you’re okay with it. You’ll be done with one another; neither will give any more thought to the other.

Death doesn't scare me, the run up to it does...
It's the same thing as when a plane that you're travelling on goes down, the impact isn't what you need to worry about, it's the five minutes beforehand.

Don’t be scared. Don’t worry. Be happy.

Anything else - besides being unafraid, worry free and happy (except for the last five minutes) - does the perfect life look like for you before you die?

 

[Matthias]

“The atheist, who seems able to live with the prospect of the abyss for both her-or-himself and everyone else, has settled, nevertheless, on a tragic view of life. Death, indeed, casts a tragic shadow over human life; to pretend otherwise is to engage in denial. The good news of the kingdom of God, however, is that, in the final analysis, the tragedy of death is only partial and, ultimately, temporary, vanishing in the face of the fullness of life in the kingdom of God (see 1 Cor. 15:26; Rev. 20:14).”

(Robert Hach, Possession and Persuasion: The Rhetoric of Christian Faith, p. 149)

 

[Mancunian]

You are the one not answering questions! I just asked 4. In response, you invoke Appeal to Diversion, asking questions of your own.


I’ll be happy to answer, once you answer mine.

Honestly, you are all over the place. Previously, you said the main reason you’re not a Christian is because the Gospel’s don’t agree. When that was addressed, you just move on, a moving target.

Then you dove into Evolution. When that was addressed, you moved on, more moving targets.

Claiming deism is a compromise that better fits ‘the Science’. When that was addressed, you moved on, more moving targets. Now it’s life style after the resurrection.

Our we supposed to believe that once this question is addressed, then you’ll believe? (We know you won’t answer because you are like every Atheist, ask questions but refuse to answer any.)

Ask away. I think that I've answered your questions honestly.... I might of missed one or two (my bad).

 

[Mancunian]

Do you have anymore Noahs flood questions? Alleged contradictions...you need explaining?

The latest news about Noahs ark is amazing. What will the atheist say when it is all confirmed?

Is it confirmed?
Of course it isn't....

 

[CrowCross]

Is it confirmed?
Of course it isn't....

All I can do is...

What will you say when it's "confirmed"?

What would it take to confirm it for you? (I doubt you'll answer that question)

 

[Mancunian]

All I can do is...

What will you say when it's "confirmed"?

What would it take to confirm it for you? (I doubt you'll answer that question)

If it's confirmed that there was an ark full of animals and just one family that survived a global flood...
Erm, I'd have to eat my hat. But as you well know that's not going to happen.

 

[CrowCross]

If it's confirmed that there was an ark full of animals and just one family that survived a global flood...
Erm, I'd have to eat my hat. But as you well know that's not going to happen.

What would you take as confirmation?

 

[Mancunian]

What would you take as confirmation?

If it was confirmed scientificly, having the evidence been thouroghly examined and independently peer reviewed, I would be happy.
I would like the evidence to include the dating of the ark, the materials used for fixings, examinable artifacts, evidence of human inhabitants, evidence of animal inhabitants and so on.
Let's wait and see what evidence is presented.....

 

[Mancunian]

It is pending Independent Verification: Scientists emphasize that the latest findings have not been peer-reviewed or independently confirmed, and past claims regarding the site over the last several decades have repeatedly fallen short of scientific substantiation.

The group NAS who are drilling at the site have made claims that have not been independently verified and therefore are just claims.

 

[Mancunian]

“The atheist, who seems able to live with the prospect of the abyss for both her-or-himself and everyone else, has settled, nevertheless, on a tragic view of life. Death, indeed, casts a tragic shadow over human life; to pretend otherwise is to engage in denial. The good news of the kingdom of God, however, is that, in the final analysis, the tragedy of death is only partial and, ultimately, temporary, vanishing in the face of the fullness of life in the kingdom of God (see 1 Cor. 15:26; Rev. 20:14).”

(Robert Hach, Possession and Persuasion: The Rhetoric of Christian Faith, p. 149)

Yeah, just because the thought of nonexistence isn't very nice, that doesn't mean it's not true.

 

[Wrangler]

Ask away. I think that I've answered your questions honestly.... I might of missed one or two (my bad).

I know there are other questions you haven't answered and I'm glad you're willing to answer them. Let's start with these questions from post #343 and go from there.

In an earlier post, you said you try to live a good, moral life.

1. How can you do this if morality is subjective and evolving?
2. Conversely, how can you fail to obtain this value?
3. And if you don’t objectively know if you’ve obtained what you claim to value, what good are your morals and the whole purpose of your atheist life?

I take it that these questions burn in the minds of any thoughtful person?

That’s a bold claim after saying morality is subjective; here you are making an objective moral claim!

And by the way, doesn’t that answer my question; that you DO recognize people make immoral choices?! You’re just being shy about it. LOL

One other point I want to re-iterate; I am proof God exists (the God of Jesus). I stand by my testimony, my witness - as do literally billions of others.

We don't have to show how every verse is reconciled with every other verse of Scripture. And we don't have to reconcile every verse of Scripture to what "Science" discovers. We have encountered the Living God. Objective proof of this is our transformed lives. Being an Atheist, intent on using a standard designed to fail us, you may not have eyes to see or ears to hear. Yet, there it is.

 

[Wrangler]

It is pending Independent Verification: Scientists

There's the problem with science in using it as a standard to judge religion; it relies on external verification. The Kingdom of God is Within You. Luke 17:21. Do you know this verse?

Please tell me as an Atheist, you recognize that everything that exists is limited and there are limits to what Science can tell us.

 

[Mancunian]

I know there are other questions you haven't answered and I'm glad you're willing to answer them. Let's start with these questions from post #343 and go from there.




One other point I want to re-iterate; I am proof God exists (the God of Jesus). I stand by my testimony, my witness - as do literally billions of others.

We don't have to show how every verse is reconciled with every other verse of Scripture. And we don't have to reconcile every verse of Scripture to what "Science" discovers. We have encountered the Living God. Objective proof of this is our transformed lives. Being an Atheist, intent on using a standard designed to fail us, you may not have eyes to see or ears to hear. Yet, there it is.

Firstly, I don't remember saying that I live a good moral life, I remember saying that I try to live a good life.
I can easily live a good life even though morality is subjective and evolving, I'll give you an example.
I along with many people used to think that homosexuality was wrong and immoral, that was my view at the time, my views didn't stop me from living a good life.
I no longer hold the view that homosexuality is wrong and immoral, and I'm still living a good life.
Morality is evolving, popular morality is the standard that people live by.

It's no longer moral to stone people to death,
It's no longer moral to deny women's rights, it's no longer moral to own slaves.
All of the above were socially acceptable and were not viewed as being immoral.

 

[Matthias]

Yeah, just because the thought of nonexistence isn't very nice, that doesn't mean it's not true.

It is true.

 

[Mancunian]

It is true.

Correct for everyone.

 

[Matthias]

Correct for everyone.

Yes. That’s what death is.