Sinless Perfection. Why do so many teach against what Jesus taught?

[MostlyConfused]

You are sadly preaching against having faith in the GOSPEL Episkopos. I will leave it to the Lord to judge who the monkeys are around here.

I am going to ask you to consider something. Just as you used to be unable to see or divide when the righteousness that God accepts versus when the righteousness where holiness is being spoken of, is it possible that you were also unable to see which one Episkopos was speaking of?

 

[Lizbeth]

The gospel is the power of God. Power to be what?

It is the power of God unto salvation. The power to be sons of God. Having received the Spirit of adoption. We are His children and His Spirit testifies that to our spirit.

 

[Lizbeth]

I am going to ask you to consider something. Just as you used to be unable to see or divide when the righteousness that God accepts versus when the righteousness where holiness is being spoken of, is it possible that you were also unable to see which one Episkopos was speaking of?

The problem I have with Epi's holiness is that it has no foundation..........he has dug out the foundation of the gospel. I'm not in disagreement in principle with holiness......that is why I came to his threads originally, but after finding out about other things he believes, I've been trying to sort out the chaff from the wheat ever since. I have doubts that he is in spirit with that subject of holiness, since he is so wrong about foundational things. Now I am back to waiting on the Lord. I can't keep up around here lately. Really is past time to leave this in God's hands as far as I'm concerned.

 

[MostlyConfused]

Romans 12 says that by having your mind renewed you can “prove“ what is the good, acceptable and perfect will of God. At first I thought it odd that there were three but I’m thinking the good are unbelievers who prove they have Gods’ law written on their heart and are meek, the acceptable are us who are led by the Spirit and learning to do righteousness and to be meek, and then of course the perfect are those who God sweeps up into actually walking IN the Spirit.

 

[Episkopos]

I want to hear it too

In the Spirit I saw light through my eyes...basically the helmet of salvation...an anointing in the eyes so that I saw light glowing from the outside of my eyes. It affected my perception of this world as I was seeing in 2 dimensions at once...which is what walking in the Spirit is. There was a light over the city that was glowing upward. And I could see darkness on people and things over their heads...that were waiting to be received. I couldn't tell is they were always good or bad things.

That was the first time.

After that I asked the Lord what I had been seeing in the light. Was it the city I was living in (Winnipeg at the time) or was it Zion. He answered me a few months later by appearing to me as I sat outside a Catholic building. He was on a balcony....very tall...very loving, but He said nothing just pointed down the street. The street was transformed into a row of block-like houses like we see in Greece or Tunisia...except both the road and the houses were shiny...like a reflective smooth surface. I looked back to see Jesus again and He was gone. The whole vision lasted for maybe 15 seconds or so. And it answered my question. Zion is superimposed on this realm. Like a realm in a realm. To walk in the Spirit means we are walking in BOTH with a perception of both. Normal vision AND spiritual vision. Unless we are born from above we cannot SEE or enter the kingdom realm.

Now I have had many dozens of such experiences and visions and such. But the second time I was translated into the Spirit (in ZIon) it began with the light coming from my eyes but more faintly than the first time. And as I stayed there over the next few weeks the light got dimmer...but I was still in the Spirit. No sin at all....just a glorious rest in the Lord. Even my dreams were either visions or just nothing. The community at the time was waiting until I got out of bed to ask me if the Lord had shown me anything. So there was a palpable presence of God during that revival. This second revival lasted for over 2 years..and I was in the Spirit at varying depths the whole time.

I have never both seen and heard at the same time. I have heard the Lord's voice many times directing me. But I only ever saw Him one on one with me once...the balcony vision. I have seen Him from a distance in other visions...but I was a mere spectator.

More recently a few years ago now, I was cycling with my wife and she went far ahead of me (which is unusual) when I was surrounded with heaven...but saw nothing. The same eternal peace and presence as when in Zion. This lasted for a full 10 minutes or so. I really felt that I was being inspected by a cloud of witnesses....and you are NOT going to believe this (and I shudder to think what the mockers will say) but I specifically felt the presence of Paul and David watching me. Don't ask me how I know.

 

[MostlyConfused]

The problem I have with Epi's holiness is that it has no foundation..........he has dug out the foundation of the gospel. I'm not in disagreement in principle with holiness......that is why I came to his threads originally, but after finding out about other things he believes, I've been trying to sort out the chaff from the wheat ever since. I have doubts that he is in spirit with that subject of holiness, since he is so wrong about foundational things. Now I am back to waiting on the Lord. I can't keep up around here lately. Really is past time to leave this in God's hands as far as I'm concerned.

Episkopos quite clearly says he is not currently walking in the Spirit. The light faded from Moses’ face. But he did come back with something from God for us. So Moses went in and out and even said God told him he would not go in and out any more before he died.
But God chose Moses to go in and come back out to bring His words to us. In the same way God chose Episkopos to bring this lost understanding back to us and to explain it. No other man was given it or someone else somewhere would have taught it. I have searched - no one else has taught and explained it. It was lost knowledge after Paul.
Be careful not to rail against a man God chose to go in and out for the benefit of all of us as they did with Moses and the ground swallowed them up.

 

[Episkopos]

Episkopos quite clearly says he is not currently walking in the Spirit. The light faded from Moses’ face. But he did come back with something from God for us. So Moses went in and out and even said God told him he would not go in and out any more before he died.
But God chose Moses to go in and come back out to bring His words to us. In the same way God chose Episkopos to bring this lost understanding back to us and to explain it. No other man was given it or someone else somewhere would have taught it. I have searched - no one else has taught and explained it. It was lost knowledge after Paul.
Be careful not to rail against a man God chose to go in and out for the benefit of all of us as they did with Moses and the ground swallowed them up.

This goes way too far for people who are not intimate with God and His ways to understand or hear without a great incredulity. I said I always speak in understatements because the truth is too hard to hear. My understatements are usually met with opinions and overstatements that they believe cancel out my testimony..and for them that is the case.

 

[MostlyConfused]

This goes way too far for people who are not intimate with God and His ways to understand or hear without a great incredulity. I said I always speak in understatements because the truth is too hard to hear. My understatements are usually met with opinions and overstatements that they believe cancel out my testimony..and for them that is the case.

Some will see and will refuse to mess with it. Some listen but don’t respond out of a caution that realizes it doesn’t know and doesn’t see as far as God permitted you to see so they just don’t know so they keep silent.
Your heart aches for the mud people as you give what God gave you to give. Don’t faint. Remember that movie that affected you so deeply? One more Lord. Just one more.

 

[Lizbeth]

The problem is he says the righteousness of faith is living faithfully. That's only part of the picture.

The righteousness that comes by faith means being declared righteous by having faith in God's forgiveness that wipes your record clean of the guilt of your unrighteousness. That's the important meaning he discards as 'self-justification'. He is free to elaborate on, or correct my understanding of his argument as he sees fit.

Believing what GOD has said about His begotten children is self-justification to Epi. The same as he equates believing what GOD has said about unbelievers to judgment/condemnation of them by us.

 

[Episkopos]

Believing what GOD has said about His begotten children is self-justification to Epi. The same as he equates believing what GOD has said about unbelievers to judgment/condemnation of them by us.

Because there is a source of true judgment you know nothing about. God Himself.

 

[MostlyConfused]

More recently a few years ago now, I was cycling with my wife and she went far ahead of me (which is unusual) when I was surrounded with heaven...but saw nothing. The same eternal peace and presence as when in Zion. This lasted for a full 10 minutes or so. I really felt that I was being inspected by a cloud of witnesses....and you are NOT going to believe this (and I shudder to think what the mockers will say) but I specifically felt the presence of Paul and David watching me. Don't ask me how I know.

Well no wonder you have determined and vowed to go on as many bike rides with your wife as possible! :)

 

[Episkopos]

Well no wonder you have determined and vowed to go on as many bike rides with your wife as possible! :)

LOL You remember that! :) Yes. I love to go down that road...not that the same thing will happen again...but I feel a human peace in remembering what happened. And a human peace is also a good thing. I think we are meant to ponder in our hearts what God gives to us.

 

[MostlyConfused]

LOL You remember that! :) Yes. I love to go down that road...not that the same thing will happen again...but I feel a human peace in remembering what happened. And a human peace is also a good thing. I think we are meant to ponder in our hearts what God gives to us.

You posted it in here as being on your bucket list, to go on as many bike rides as possible with your wife.

 

[ProDeo]

That is why 1 John 3:9 does not have the word "practice" in it, that was added. Once we are born again of the Spirit, all we have to do is follow our super-sensitized conscience. It is the power in "power steering."

If that is the true meaning of the KJV and YLT translations then I can understand. Once the Holy Sprit reveals a sin in your life then you have work to do. I also believe (with reference to 1 Cor 10:13) He will give you the power to overcome.

 

[ProDeo]

This goes way too far for people who are not intimate with God and His ways to understand or hear without a great incredulity. I said I always speak in understatements because the truth is too hard to hear. My understatements are usually met with opinions and overstatements that they believe cancel out my testimony..and for them that is the case.

Maybe you should correct MC, she said you are not walking in the Spirit, if so, how can you tell others to walk in the Spirit ?

 

[MostlyConfused]

Believing what GOD has said about His begotten children is self-justification to Epi.

No. Writing yourself into every thing that is gracious and pleasant to your ears and pushing the rebukes and hard to hear things and warnings off a cliff is self justification.

 

[Episkopos]

Maybe you should correct MC, she said you are not walking in the Spirit, if so, how can you tell others to walk in the Spirit ?

I'm not walking presently in the Spirit. I am LED by the Spirit at times. But I have a learned a lot about God's ways over the years. I am amazed at how little people know about God.

I warn others to remain humble and fear the Lord in order that they might survive God's judgment. I encourage human righteousness at least if not being translated into the kingdom realm. I explain the cost of being translated....it costs us ALL. We pay ALL to get the FULL measure of grace. Although the initial sample is free. Otherwise how would we know what we are investing our whole life into?

I have bought instruments without trying them first to many regrets. But with God we are to "taste and see that the Lord is good". From there we can BUY the Lord's fullness by selling all to have it.

 

[MostlyConfused]

Maybe you should correct MC, she said you are not walking in the Spirit, if so, how can you tell others to walk in the Spirit ?

The spies went into the land promised to them all. How could they then tell others to go take it when they were no longer in it but had come back out of it and into the desert…?.

 

[Episkopos]

Tsk. The spies went into the land promised to them all. How could they then tell others to go take it when they were no longer in it but had come back out of it and into the desert…?.

A theoretical bible knowledge does not explain how things work in reality.

 

[MostlyConfused]

I need a nap. But I’ll back to read this thread again and make sure I didn’t miss anything!