Forgive yet punish, what ?

[rmb60]

Wronged, forgiven yet punished for the wrong.
What am I not understanding ?

 

[rmb60]

When we forgive someone this is what we are to do

In the teachings of Jesus Christ, forgiveness (aphiemi in Greek, meaning to release, send away, or cancel a debt) is the deliberate, grace-driven choice to cancel a moral or relational debt, relinquish the right to personal vengeance, and extend mercy just as God has canceled humanity's unpayable debt

Yet if we require someone to be punished who has sinned against us how can we claim that we have forgiven them ?

 

[Lambano]

One of the explanations I read was this: "Forgiveness" means the offense will not break the relationship between offender and offended. It does NOT mean that actions do not have consequences. When a child breaks a rule, there may be punishment, but the child is still part of the family. He does not get tossed out on the street. Or killed.

Not sure if that works in all cases, but we can use it as a starting point.

 

[rmb60]

One of the explanations I read was this: "Forgiveness" means the offense will not break the relationship between offender and offended. It does NOT mean that actions do not have consequences. When a child breaks a rule, there may be punishment, but the child is still part of the family. He does not get tossed out on the street. Or killed.

Not sure if that works in all cases, but we can use it as a starting point.

Thnx Lamb.
As a forgiven sinner, what is your punishment in eternity for the sins you have committed here ?

 

[Lambano]

Thnx Lamb.
As a forgiven sinner, what is your punishment in eternity for the sins you have committed here ?

I'll have to listen to Amigo preaching about ecumenicalism for at least a millenium.

 

[rmb60]

I'll have to listen to Amigo preaching about ecumenicalism for at least a millenium.

???
Not sure what you mean

 

[Lambano]

???
Not sure what you mean

That joke failed miserably.

 

[rmb60]

That joke failed miserably.

All good Lamb, I thought it was says PhD in hindsight he :)
Back to that question though, do you believe or understand you will be punished in eternity for the forgiven sins you have committed while here ?

 

[Sel@h]

All good Lamb, I thought it was says PhD in hindsight he :)
Back to that question though, do you believe or understand you will be punished in eternity for the forgiven sins you have committed while here ?

My answer is “absolutely No.”

 

[Lambano]

All good Lamb, I thought it was says PhD in hindsight he :)
Back to that question though, do you believe or understand you will be punished in eternity for the forgiven sins you have committed while here ?

I am aware that actions do have consequences, and that thing about reaping and sowing (Galatians 6:7) doesn't go away. What makes all the difference in the world is trusting that I am a child of God and He will not break that relationship.

Do you think your actions in this life, both good and bad, will have consequences in the next? (I obviously picked up on the vibe regarding "forgiveness". I'm not going to get into that "Oh, you think you can sin all you want" and OSAS, and all that other crap this subject always degenerates into.) If you believed your actions had consequences in the World to Come, would you live your life any differently? Looking at it from the other pole, if I believed there would be no negative consequences for my actions, should I live this life any differently? Maybe take more risks?

 

[rmb60]

My answer is “absolutely No.”

Thnx Sel, that too is my understanding.
Yet here is a quandary for you and I :-
If we forgive someone for a wrong they have done us yet we still desire or agree that they are penalized for their wrong are we truly forgiving them as we eternally are ?

 

[rmb60]

I am aware that actions do have consequences, and that thing about reaping and sowing (Galatians 6:7) doesn't go away. What makes all the difference in the world is trusting that I am a child of God and He will not break that relationship.

Do you think your actions in this life, both good and bad, will have consequences in the next? (I obviously picked up on the vibe regarding "forgiveness". I'm not going to get into that "Oh, you think you can sin all you want" and OSAS, and all that other crap this subject always degenerates into.) If you believed your actions had consequences in the World to Come, would you live your life any differently? Looking at it from the other pole, if I believed there would be no negative consequences for my actions, should I live this life any differently? Maybe take more risks?

Some may say that though saved, limited eternal rewards is punishment for sin today
My understanding (for those saved) is that poor performance (not sin) today results in limited or no eternal rewards tomorrow.
So yes, there are eternal consequences for poor performance today but these consequences are not punishment for sin.

 

[ScottA]

When we forgive someone this is what we are to do

In the teachings of Jesus Christ, forgiveness (aphiemi in Greek, meaning to release, send away, or cancel a debt) is the deliberate, grace-driven choice to cancel a moral or relational debt, relinquish the right to personal vengeance, and extend mercy just as God has canceled humanity's unpayable debt

Yet if we require someone to be punished who has sinned against us how can we claim that we have forgiven them ?

Perhaps you assume that the forgiveness of Christ is a bypass making void the Law. However, that is not the case.

Punishment is according to--part and parcel--of the Law (or law) among those who are perishing. Meaning, we here in the flesh--this body of flesh--still suffers under the law of sin and death until the end. To the contrary, forgiveness is of the Spirit by the Spirit, against whom there is no Law, for the Spirit is God in whom their is no sin.

In other words, the man of sin (which is all of us in the flesh) is under the law and serving the punishment of the law outwardly, which includes all manner of punishments experienced in this fallen world. While the Spirit is freedom from the law and this world.

 

[rmb60]

Perhaps you assume that the forgiveness of Christ is a bypass making void the Law. However, that is not the case.

Punishment is according to--part and parcel--of the Law (or law) among those who are perishing. Meaning, we here in the flesh--this body of flesh--still suffers under the law of sin and death until the end. To the contrary, forgiveness is of the Spirit by the Spirit, against whom there is no Law, for the Spirit is God in whom their is no sin.

In other words, the man of sin (which is all of us in the flesh) is under the law and serving the punishment of the law outwardly, which includes all manner of punishments experienced in this fallen world. While the Spirit is freedom from the law and this world.

If you forgive a stranger for grievously harming you yet still desire or agree to their imprisonment, have you truly forgiven them ?