How does God lead?

[1stCenturyLady]

No, it's the Revelation of Jesus Christ in Greek.

What you keep failing to understand is that the "Book" of the Revelation of Christ, is ABOUT the Revelation of Christ, not the Revelation, itself! The Revelation of Christ is the day of our Lord Jesus Christ, THE SECOND COMING. It is the END of the COVENANT. You repeating yourself doesn't make your understanding any better, just makes you stubborn.

7 so that you come short in no gift, eagerly waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ, 8 who will also confirm you to the end, that you may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is a parallelism used by Jews to amplify meaning that two phrases mean the same thing. Therefore, Paul is not referring to the vision of the future event, but the reality.

I'm going to save this and copy and paste if every time you keep making this mistake, until you "get it."

 

[Dave L]

What you keep failing to understand is that the "Book" of the Revelation of Christ, is ABOUT the Revelation of Christ, not the Revelation, itself! The Revelation of Christ is the day of our Lord Jesus Christ, THE SECOND COMING. It is the END of the COVENANT. You repeating yourself doesn't make your understanding any better, just makes you stubborn.

7 so that you come short in no gift, eagerly waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ, 8 who will also confirm you to the end, that you may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is a parallelism used by Jews to amplify meaning that two phrases mean the same thing. Therefore, Paul is not referring to the vision of the future event, but the reality.

I'm going to save this and copy and paste if every time you keep making this mistake, until you "get it."

The Revelation of Jesus Christ preserves us until the Day of the Lord.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

The Revelation of Jesus Christ isn't "about" the Revelation of Jesus Christ. It is the Revelation of Jesus Christ.

Paul used a parallelism so people wouldn't make that silly mistake. You just want the gifts to end. You really don't care what Paul MEANT by his parallelism. You are satisfied in twisting his words against him.

 

[Dave L]

Paul used a parallelism so people wouldn't make that silly mistake. You just want the gifts to end. You really don't care what Paul MEANT by his parallelism. You are satisfied in twisting his words against him.

If you knew what the real gifts consisted of, we would not be discussing this. Scripture is far better and far more reliable than the originals, not to mention those people try to conjure up today.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

The Revelation of Jesus Christ preserves us until the Day of the Lord.

Same thing. I believe what Paul meant. If you are ever going to grow, you are going to have to accept what the apostles mean over your own wishes.

 

[Dave L]

Same thing. I believe what Paul meant. If you are ever going to grow, you are going to have to accept what the apostles mean over your own wishes.

We both think we are doing this. But I know better from experiencing it both ways.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

If you knew what the real gifts consisted of, we would not be discussing this. Scripture is far better and far more reliable than the originals, not to mention those people try to conjure up today.

So now you are an authority on the gifts? Not! Start a new topic and let's see.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

We both think we are doing this. But I know better from experiencing it both ways.

When God first spoke to me, only 41 years ago, not 2000 years ago, He spoke 8 sentences that seared right through me. I still can repeat them verbatim. I suppose you will say that was the devil.

 

[Dave L]

When God first spoke to me, only 41 years ago, not 2000 years ago, He spoke 8 sentences that seared right through me. I still can repeat them verbatim. I suppose you will say that was the devil.

I would not trust any voices in the head. Only scripture.

 

[Dave L]

So now you are an authority on the gifts? Not! Start a new topic and let's see.

The original gifts were far different from today's claims to the gifts.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I would not trust any voices in the head. Only scripture.

That is because you don't have any gifts, therefore, nobody else can either. I've heard that before by Cessationist writers. God is not going to give you something you abhor.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

The original gifts were far different from today's claims to the gifts.

Like what? Tongues were for preaching to foreigners?

 

[Dave L]

Like what? Tongues were for preaching to foreigners?

I'm not familiar with that claim.

 

[Dave L]

That is because you don't have any gifts, therefore, nobody else can either. I've heard that before by Cessationist writers. God is not going to give you something you abhor.

Thankfully, I'm challenged enough without hearing voices on top of it.

 

[Nancy]

In the Book of Revelation it mentions the beast's number is 666, and that it is the number of a man. Don't you think when the Antichrist/beast comes he will be revealed by revelation to today's prophets? I do. Illumination is not adding to scripture.

I can't say as I agree I believe He gave us all the information as to who and what to look for...I do not believe modern day prophets should add anything to the Revelation of Jesus as it is complete. All is already revealed. "Revealed" information will not contradict what God has already revealed about Himself in the Bible. I see the prophets (true prophets) as edifying the Church "1Co 14:29 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge." and speaking Gods truth boldly.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I can't say as I agree I believe He gave us all the information as to who and what to look for...I do not believe modern day prophets should add anything to the Revelation of Jesus as it is complete. All is already revealed. "Revealed" information will not contradict what God has already revealed about Himself in the Bible. I see the prophets (true prophets) as edifying the Church "1Co 14:29 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge." and speaking Gods truth boldly.

If we don't know WHO the Antichrist actually is, we may inadvertently take His mark to buy and sell.

 

[ScottA]

We've already shown from scripture the gifts expired with the apostles. But scripture also says they expired with the coming (revelation) of Jesus in the ad 90s.


Paul says; “so that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ; who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye be unreproveable in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. God is faithful, through whom ye were called into the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.” (1 Corinthians 1:7–9)


Notice, when Jesus is revealed he will also confirm us to the end, placing his revelation before the end. So this Revelation is not at the end of the world as charismatics say.


The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John;” (Revelation 1:1)


John uses the same greek word as Paul speaking of the Revelation of Jesus Christ.


602. ἀποκάλυψις apŏkalupsis, ap-ok-al´-oop-sis; from 601; disclosure:—appearing, coming, lighten, manifestation, be revealed, revelation.


Strong, J. (2009). A Concise Dictionary of the Words in the Greek Testament and The Hebrew Bible (Vol. 1, p. 14).


So John's book of Revelation is the same revelation Paul spoke of. Telling believers to come behind in any gift until then.

None of that says (as you claim) that the gifts end.

John simply warns those who might add or take away from that particular revelation. I say "that particular revelation", because you yourself are convinced that Paul and John are speaking of that same particular revelation. But it does not say that there are no other revelations. In fact, you are adding to it by saying so - meaning that you are under the curse!

On the contrary, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and revelations is not limited to the apostles and the book of Revelation by John, but specified as pertaining to "all flesh."

You have proven nothing.

 

[Dave L]

None of that says (as you claim) that the gifts end.

John simply warns those who might add or take away from that particular revelation. I say "that particular revelation", because you yourself are convinced that Paul and John are speaking of that same particular revelation. But it does not say that there are no other revelations. In fact, you are adding to it by saying so!

On the contrary, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit and revelations is not limited to the apostles and the book of Revelation by John, but specified as pertaining to "all flesh."

You have proven nothing.

I have proven that the gifts came only through the two outpourings and through the hands of an apostle. Simply because scripture mentions no other way. You must prove from scripture another means of distribution exists before you can stake your claim for their continuance.

 

[ScottA]

I have proven that the gifts came only through the two outpourings and through the hands of an apostle. Simply because scripture mentions no other way. You must prove from scripture another means of distribution exists before you can stake your claim for their continuance.

Like I said before...No I do not have to prove anything.

Because God Himself has already proven it Himself. But me quoting Him, saying "upon all flesh" rather than the limits you have placed on Him, you have not acknowledged.

 

[Dave L]

Like I said before...No I do not have to prove anything.

Because God Himself has already proven it Himself. But me quoting Him, saying "upon all flesh" rather than the limits you have placed on Him, you have not acknowledged.

If you cannot find support for your claim of a third means of distribution, you add tho scripture.