How does God lead?

[1stCenturyLady]

But we are not the perfect. His word is.

But that is not what 1 Corinthians 13 is talking about. The context tells you it is the second coming.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Revelation must conform to Jesus' teaching about the kingdom and Israel. We add to the book if we side step Jesus in these matters.

Peter, himself, confirmed that the day of Pentecost was a fulfillment of Joel.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Jesus is the perfect Word of God in person and written.

I agree, but the Bible is not what 1 Corinthians 13 is referring to. Paul knew what he was referring to. And he wasn't even looking forward to the time when his writings would all be bound up and distributed. You can twist it any way you want to, but I prefer to believe what the apostle meant.

 

[ScottA]

2 Peter 1:3 "We have everything we need to live a life that pleases God. It was all given to us by God's own power, when we learned he had invited us to share in his wonderful goodness."

I think what is in question here is that yes, God does still speak to us He commands that NOTHING ever be added or taken away from the foretelling of what will come to pass. He already gave us all we need to know. Prophesying about things to come that are outside the Word of God go against His command to add or take away anything concerning "things to come".

You are assuming that His words are only written, or that what is written about what is on tablets also applies to what is written in our hearts. This distinction is scriptural. Why would you mix the two when He does not? That is a grievous error eliminating any receptiveness to His knocking on the door within...literally to the kingdom. An error akin to:

Matthew 13:57
"So they were offended at Him. But Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor except in his own country and in his own house.”

 

[1stCenturyLady]

2 Peter 1:3 "We have everything we need to live a life that pleases God. It was all given to us by God's own power, when we learned he had invited us to share in his wonderful goodness."

I think what is in question here is that yes, God does still speak to us He commands that NOTHING ever be added or taken away from the foretelling of what will come to pass. He already gave us all we need to know. Prophesying about things to come that are outside the Word of God go against His command to add or take away anything concerning "things to come".

In the Book of Revelation it mentions the beast's number is 666, and that it is the number of a man. Don't you think when the Antichrist/beast comes he will be revealed by revelation to today's prophets? I do. Illumination is not adding to scripture.

 

[Episkopos]

You are assuming that His words are only written, or that what is written about what is on tablets also applies to what is written in our hearts. This distinction is scriptural. Why would you mix the two when He does not? That is a grievous error eliminating any receptiveness to His knocking on the door within...literally to the kingdom. An error akin to:

Matthew 13:57
"So they were offended at Him. But Jesus said to them, “A prophet is not without honor except in his own country and in his own house.”

It may be of interest to note that when a person is deaf they need to see a communication in writing. People who can't, don't or won't hear from the Lord directly are limited to the written word. Of course they will defend this way of communication vigourously, as this is all they have to go on.

 

[Dave L]

I agree, but the Bible is not what 1 Corinthians 13 is referring to. Paul knew what he was referring to. And he wasn't even looking forward to the time when his writings would all be bound up and distributed. You can twist it any way you want to, but I prefer to believe what the apostle meant.

But you ignore the plain truth of scripture saying this. Both Paul and John spoke of the Revelation of Jesus Christ in the same words. That Paul said would also confirm us until the end. = The book of Revelation is their subject and not the second coming of Christ.

 

[Dave L]

But that is not what 1 Corinthians 13 is talking about. The context tells you it is the second coming.

No, it's the Revelation of Jesus Christ in Greek.

 

[Dave L]

What help could it possibly be...since you do not believe in God's present spiritual interaction with His children?

This is not true. His Spirit bears witness with our spirit and faith when present predicts the future for us. But wild extra biblical experiences claimed to be God are not found in scripture.

 

[Dave L]

Says you who does not believe that God pours out His spirit upon all flesh or spiritual gifts including prophecy and even tongues. Your credibility is bankrupt.

No scripture exists endorsing your view. The gifts came through the two outpourings or through an apostle's hands. Scripture is silent on any other means.

 

[ScottA]

It may be of interest to note that when a person is deaf they need to see a communication in writing. People who can't, don't or won't hear from the Lord directly are limited to the written word. Of course they will defend this way of communication vigourously, as this is all they have to go on.

Unfortunately, most of this comes under those who "won't hear", because they do not believe in "prophets in there own area and in their own house."

 

[ScottA]

This is not true. His Spirit bears witness with our spirit and faith when present predicts the future for us. But wild extra biblical experiences claimed to be God are not found in scripture.

You are contradicting yourself. First you say there is no revelations since the 12 apostles died, then you say "our spirit and faith...predict the future."

So now you have presented two possibilities, rather than the simple "No/None" you have been saying...which is revealing. You seem to have an issue with "made up...wild extra biblical experience claims." Well, so do I. But what if they are not made up, what if they are God doing exactly as He has said He would do during these times? Until now you have denied that God would...obviously, because you have some emotional issue with such things.

 

[Dave L]

You are contradicting yourself. First you say there is no revelations since the 12 apostles died, then you say "our spirit and faith...predict the future."

So now you have presented two possibilities, rather than the simple "No/None" you have been saying...which is revealing. You seem to have an issue with "made up...wild extra biblical experience claims." Well, so do I. But what if they are not made up, what if they are God doing exactly as He has said He would do during these times? Until now you have denied that God would...obviously, because you have some emotional issue with such things.

The gifts ceased. Faith and the witness of the Spirit remain.

 

[ScottA]

No scripture exists endorsing your view. The gifts came through the two outpourings or through an apostle's hands. Scripture is silent on any other means.

No...I just gave you the scriptures (again for the upteenth time).

"Pouring out His spirit upon all flesh" is scriptural and biblical, but your limited interpretation is not scriptural or biblical. You cannot even quote the scriptures. Instead of this tug-a-war of you making claims that do not line up with scripture...why don't you quote the scriptures?

 

[ScottA]

The gifts ceased. Faith and the witness of the Spirit remain.

That is not what the scriptures say. You can't even quote anything to support your claim - that is just you talking your own dogma.

On the contrary, I have given you the scriptural evidence proving what you say is not true.

 

[Dave L]

No...I just gave you the scriptures (again for the upteenth time).

"Pouring out His spirit upon all flesh" is scriptural and biblical, but your limited interpretation is not scriptural or biblical. You cannot even quote the scriptures. Instead of this tug-a-war of you making claims that do not line up with scripture...why don't you quote the scriptures?

We all have the baptism of the Holy Spirit. The Charismatic Gifts are not for today. Scripture, the perfect complete word of God, replaced them.

 

[ScottA]

We all have the baptism of the Holy Spirit. The Charismatic Gifts are not for today. Scripture, the perfect complete word of God, replaced them.

That is just you talking again. Give exact scriptures, or you have no business claiming it.

But, that is just me being kind. I know you cannot produce the scriptures...and really, you are just speaking against God's own word with your own dogma.

 

[Dave L]

That is just you talking again. Give exact scriptures, or you have no business claiming it.

But, that is just me being kind. I know you cannot produce the scriptures...and really, you are just speaking against God's own word with your own dogma.

We've already shown from scripture the gifts expired with the apostles. But scripture also says they expired with the coming (revelation) of Jesus in the ad 90s.


Paul says; “so that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ; who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye be unreproveable in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ. God is faithful, through whom ye were called into the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.” (1 Corinthians 1:7–9)


Notice, when Jesus is revealed he will also confirm us to the end, placing his revelation before the end. So this Revelation is not at the end of the world as charismatics say.


The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John;” (Revelation 1:1)


John uses the same greek word as Paul speaking of the Revelation of Jesus Christ.


602. ἀποκάλυψις apŏkalupsis, ap-ok-al´-oop-sis; from 601; disclosure:—appearing, coming, lighten, manifestation, be revealed, revelation.


Strong, J. (2009). A Concise Dictionary of the Words in the Greek Testament and The Hebrew Bible (Vol. 1, p. 14).


So John's book of Revelation is the same revelation Paul spoke of. Telling believers to come behind in any gift until then.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

But you ignore the plain truth of scripture saying this. Both Paul and John spoke of the Revelation of Jesus Christ in the same words. That Paul said would also confirm us until the end. = The book of Revelation is their subject and not the second coming of Christ.

What you keep failing to understand is that the "Book" of the Revelation of Christ, is ABOUT the Revelation of Christ, not the Revelation, itself! The Revelation of Christ is the day of our Lord Jesus Christ, THE SECOND COMING. It is the END of the COVENANT. You repeating yourself doesn't make your understanding any better, just makes you stubborn.

7 so that you come short in no gift, eagerly waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ, 8 who will also confirm you to the end, that you may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is a parallelism used by Jews to amplify meaning that two phrases mean the same thing. Therefore, Paul is not referring to the vision of the future event, but the reality.

I'm going to save this and copy and paste it every time you keep making this mistake, until you "get it."

 

[Dave L]

What you keep failing to understand is that the "Book" of the Revelation of Christ, is ABOUT the Revelation of Christ, not the Revelation, itself! The Revelation of Christ is the day of our Lord Jesus Christ, THE SECOND COMING. It is the END of the COVENANT. You repeating yourself doesn't make your understanding any better, just makes you stubborn.

7 so that you come short in no gift, eagerly waiting for the revelation of our Lord Jesus Christ, 8 who will also confirm you to the end, that you may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.

That is a parallelism used by Jews to amplify meaning that two phrases mean the same thing.

I'm going to save this and copy and paste if every time you keep making this mistake, until you "get it."

The Revelation of Jesus Christ isn't "about" the Revelation of Jesus Christ. It is the Revelation of Jesus Christ.