The saints of Israel

[bbyrd009]

Not according to my term.No

i'm not even going to bother quoting where you have contradicted yourself, its all on one page after all. Gotta run, have a good one ok

 

[bbyrd009]

Jerimiah says nothing about adoption.He is talking about decendents.
Do you have a family tree or was you born under a rock?

Jeremiah has an opinion on an aspect, but Jeremiah did not write the whole Bible bro, Which has a lot more to say on the matter? I mean read Jeremiah in a vacuum if you like, i dunno about epi but i doubt he maintains that Prots are going to inherit Israel, Incorporated anyway wadr

 

[shilohsfoal]

ya, thats what i figured. Come back with your this is that and that is this when you can back it up imo, and have a nice day ok

Im the only person background ng up anything in this thread.
You dont even know what a decendent is and you are unable to learn.

i'm not even going to bother quoting where you have contradicted yourself, its all on one page after all. Gotta run, have a good one ok

 

[bbyrd009]

Im the only person background ng up anything in this thread.
You dont even know what a decendent is and you are unable to learn.

well i know not all who are born Israel are of Israel anyway, huh?

 

[shilohsfoal]

Jeremiah has an opinion on an aspect, but Jeremiah did not write the whole Bible bro, Which has a lot more to say on the matter? I mean read Jeremiah in a vacuum if you like, i dunno about epi but i doubt he maintains that Prots are going to inherit Israel, Incorporated anyway wadr

No jerimiah did not write the whole bible nor didhe write about all the world.He is only writting what God told him about Israels decendents and how God would not reject them all.

Jeremiah 31:37 NIV: This is what the LORD says: "Only if the heavens above can be measured and the foundations of the earth below be searched out will I reject all the descendants of Israel because of all they have done,"

You are wanting to replace the word decendents with christians who are grafted in.
Then you would be infering that God would not reject all christians because of what they have done
Thats not what the text says.

 

[shilohsfoal]

Now Isaiah states that it is Israel who reigns with Christ in the land of Israel.

Isaiah 14:2 The nations will escort Israel and bring it to its homeland. Then the house of Israel will possess the nations as menservants and maidservants in the LORD's land. They will make captives of their captors and rule over their oppressors.


Now you could reject what the word of God says or you could go on to understand why God would say such a thing.
The facts may surprise you once you learn who the beast is.

Revelation 20:4 Then I saw the thrones, and those seated on them had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received its mark on their foreheads or hands. And they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Fact is,Isaiah is 100 percent correct and Israel shall reign over the nations.

Theres no reason for anyone to be offended in the word of God but im sure there are some on here who have decided that they shall reign over the nations themselves in the promised land.

 

[bbyrd009]

No jerimiah did not write the whole bible nor didhe write about all the world.He is only writting what God told him about Israels decendents and how God would not reject them all.

Jeremiah 31:37 NIV: This is what the LORD says: "Only if the heavens above can be measured and the foundations of the earth below be searched out will I reject all the descendants of Israel because of all they have done,"

You are wanting to replace the word decendents with christians who are grafted in.
Then you would be infering that God would not reject all christians because of what they have done
Thats not what the text says.

wadr i am not wanting to do anything of the sort, and i also believe that all of the literal descendants of Israel will not be rejected, surely only the many there, too?

 

[Enoch111]

So while these "christians"on this site claim they will in replace the descendants of Israel,God says this will not happen nor will Israel cease from being a nation

Any Christian who carefully studies the Word of God without any outside indoctrination will easily discern that (1) God has an eternal plan and purpose for the Church (all redeemed Jews and Gentiles in the Body of Christ until the Rapture), and (2) God has an eternal plan and purpose for redeemed and restored Israel under Christ AFTER His Second Coming.

Replacement Theology is TOTALLY FALSE and leads to spiritual confusion. The Catholic Church introduced it but the Protestant Reformers failed to reject it.

 

[bbyrd009]

but then again anyone who studies the Bible for long will quit calling It Word, too, i guess, and theyll stop with all the fruit of knowledge jazz too, yeh?

 

[Stan B]

Well...Israel did cease to be a nation. And God has rejected the national aspirations of the Jewish people...which do NOT coincide with God's will.

And if you were careful, you would see how many Gentiles are in the lineage of king David...and by extension...Jesus.

God can graft in whom He wishes to. No need for any permission from us. I hope you are able to see that.

Was Rahab Jewish? What of Ruth? Bathsheba? Tamar?

The whole race thing is a non-starter. Judaism was a religion...not an ethnicity. A religion becomes an ethnicity when if no longer is alive and spreading.

But Jesus came to remove all religions...to connect us with God....apart from religion. So please cease from promoting religion in general and Judaism in particular.

Episkopos said: >> "And if you were careful, you would see how many Gentiles are in the lineage of king David...and by extension...Jesus. Was Rahab Jewish? What of Ruth? Bathsheba? Tamar?"

You are SO wrong in just about everything you have said, but I will address the first error.

First of all, you mention Gentiles in the line of David. This is totally false. The lineage of women you mention is not at all significant, since lineage is passed on only patrilineality, i.e. through the male line. If you read the genealogy of Jesus in Luke 3:23 that only the male line is mentioned. David was the 100% pure Jewish and uncompromised offspring of Abraham. Jewish genealogy is passed on ONLY through the male line.

This is all confirmed with modern science, which states that only the male Y chromosone is passed on fully intact without alteration from generation to generation through the male line. Females have no Y chromosomes, they have only XX chromosomes which are malleable to modification. Y chromosomes cannot be modified.

Episkopos said: >> "The whole race thing is a non-starter. Judaism was a religion...not an ethnicity."

Well of course Judaism is a religion, whereas "Jew" is a race, the descendants of the Tribe of Judah. I don't understand the point to were trying to make.

 

[Enoch111]

You are SO wrong in just about everything you have said, but I will address the first error.

Episkopos has manufactured his own theology (as you may already have noted).

 

[Episkopos]

Episkopos said: >> "And if you were careful, you would see how many Gentiles are in the lineage of king David...and by extension...Jesus. Was Rahab Jewish? What of Ruth? Bathsheba? Tamar?"

You are SO wrong in just about everything you have said, but I will address the first error.

First of all, you mention Gentiles in the line of David. This is totally false. The lineage of women you mention is not at all significant, since lineage is passed on only patrilineality, i.e. through the male line. If you read the genealogy of Jesus in Luke 3:23 that only the male line is mentioned. David was the 100% pure Jewish and uncompromised offspring of Abraham. Jewish genealogy is passed on ONLY through the male line.

This is all confirmed with modern science, which states that only the male Y chromosone is passed on fully intact without alteration from generation to generation through the male line. Females have no Y chromosomes, they have only XX chromosomes which are malleable to modification. Y chromosomes cannot be modified.

Episkopos said: >> "The whole race thing is a non-starter. Judaism was a religion...not an ethnicity."

Well of course Judaism is a religion, whereas "Jew" is a race, the descendants of the Tribe of Judah. I don't understand the point to were trying to make.

I sense a certain reaction from you. Are you saying that women are not Gentiles? Thanks for all the medical info BTW.

So women don't count in your life? Do you have (had) a mother? A wife? Any daughters? Human beings are made up of BOTH male and female...and Israel is made up of BOTH men AND women & Jews and Gentiles. But only the Israel of God.

And it is Judaism that is obsolete...not Jews. So then Jews are just as eligible for the kingdom as Lithuanians. Israel is NOT an ethnicity...it is they who are in relationship with God.

Not all are of Israel (of God) who are of Israel (human extraction).

These points are so basic that your ignoring these with obfuscation is really a waste of time.

I wasn't speaking about the nature of genealogy...that is a deflection on your part. You are obscuring the fact that there are Gentiles even in the genealogy of Jesus Christ.

 

[Episkopos]

Episkopos has manufactured his own theology (as you may already have noted).

This is of course gratuitous ...but then your understand of grace leads you to this. Gratuitous is related humanly to a flawed human understanding of grace. (they are related linguistically)

God has a completely different kind of grace available...if you were at all interested.

 

[Stan B]

I sense a certain reaction from you. Are you saying that women are not Gentiles? Thanks for all the medical info BTW.

So women don't count in your life? Do you have (had) a mother? A wife? Any daughters? Human beings are made up of BOTH male and female...and Israel is made up of BOTH men AND women & Jews and Gentiles. But only the Israel of God.

And it is Judaism that is obsolete...not Jews. So then Jews are just as eligible for the kingdom as Lithuanians. Israel is NOT an ethnicity...it is they who are in relationship with God.

Not all are of Israel (of God) who are of Israel (human extraction).

These points are so basic that your ignoring these with obfuscation is really a waste of time.

I wasn't speaking about the nature of genealogy...that is a deflection on your part. You are obscuring the fact that there are Gentiles even in the genealogy of Jesus Christ.

I didn't think it was all that difficult to understand. Women have nothing whatsover to do with lineage. Lineage is passed on from generation to generation solely by the male.

Mothers, wives and daughters don't matter, because they can never pass on their lineage to the next generation because they do not have the Y Chromosome necessary for doing that. You seem to have a problem with reality, and have created your own fairy tale fantasy. Enjoy.

 

[shilohsfoal]

wadr i am not wanting to do anything of the sort, and i also believe that all of the literal descendants of Israel will not be rejected, surely only the many there, too?

Jerimiah speaking more of the saints of Israel calling them Israel says Israel shall dwell safely after the Lord comes.(Remember revelation call them saints who dwell in Jerusalem after the Lord comes).
Jeremiah 23:5 NIV: "The days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will raise up for David a righteous Branch, a King who will reign wisely and do what is just and right in the land.
Jeremiah 23:6 NIV: In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The LORD Our Righteous Savior.
Jeremiah 23:7 NIV: "So then, the days are coming," declares the LORD, "when people will no longer say, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt,'
Jeremiah 23:8 NIV: but they will say, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the descendants of Israel up out of the land of the north and out of all the countries where he had banished them.' Then they will live in their own land."

See here Jerimiah is speaking of the decendents of Israel who had been banished from,thier land is brought back.
Its not talking about the gentile nations whos ancesters never lived there.

Also I would like to make note of Jerimiah 23:6

Jeremiah 23:6 NIV: In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The LORD Our Righteous Savior.

Many scriptures show,as this one,that Israel shall live safely after the Lord comes but never before.Israel will be safe after the Lord comes as in Ezejiel 38:14.

Ezekiel 38:14 NIV: "Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say to Gog: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: In that day, when my people Israel are living in safety, will you not take notice of it?

 

[Stan B]

Jerimiah speaking more of the saints of Israel calling them Israel says Israel shall dwell safely after the Lord comes.(Remember revelation call them saints who dwell in Jerusalem after the Lord comes).
Jeremiah 23:5 NIV: "The days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will raise up for David a righteous Branch, a King who will reign wisely and do what is just and right in the land.
Jeremiah 23:6 NIV: In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The LORD Our Righteous Savior.
Jeremiah 23:7 NIV: "So then, the days are coming," declares the LORD, "when people will no longer say, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the Israelites up out of Egypt,'
Jeremiah 23:8 NIV: but they will say, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the descendants of Israel up out of the land of the north and out of all the countries where he had banished them.' Then they will live in their own land."

See here Jerimiah is speaking of the decendents of Israel who had been banished from,thier land is brought back.
Its not talking about the gentile nations whos ancesters never lived there.

Also I would like to make note of Jerimiah 23:6

Jeremiah 23:6 NIV: In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the name by which he will be called: The LORD Our Righteous Savior.

Many scriptures show,as this one,that Israel shall live safely after the Lord comes but never before.Israel will be safe after the Lord comes as in Ezejiel 38:14.

Ezekiel 38:14 NIV: "Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say to Gog: 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: In that day, when my people Israel are living in safety, will you not take notice of it?

And thus, as the Bible says “ALL Israel will be saved”

 

[Keraz]

See here Jerimiah is speaking of the decendents of Israel who had been banished from,thier land is brought back.
Its not talking about the gentile nations whos ancesters never lived there.

How do we know who anyones ancestor was after 100+ generations? But scripture says that God does; Amos 9:9

You seem to be determined to have the citizens of the Jewish Sate of Israel as the only Israel. That this is wrong, is proved by how the Jewish world population is about 20 million. They are not an uncountable number, 'as the sands of the sea', as the Israel of God is prophesied to be.
Plainly and in truth; The Christian peoples are the Israelites of God, from every tribe, race, nation and language. Revelation 5:10, Galatians 3:26-29

 

[shilohsfoal]

How do we know who anyones ancestor was after 100+ generations? But scripture says that God does; Amos 9:9

You seem to be determined to have the citizens of the Jewish Sate of Israel as the only Israel. That this is wrong, is proved by how the Jewish world population is about 20 million. They are not an uncountable number, 'as the sands of the sea', as the Israel of God is prophesied to be.
Plainly and in truth; The Christian peoples are the Israelites of God, from every tribe, race, nation and language. Revelation 5:10, Galatians 3:26-29

You dont know who is in Israeland whos ancestors they were.God does and God says the decendents of Israel would be brought back to the land from where they had been banished and they shall reign over the nations.
These are Gods words, not mine.I trust God knows what he is talking about whereas You dont.

Jeremiah 23:8 NIV: but they will say, 'As surely as the LORD lives, who brought the descendants of Israel up out of the land of the north and out of all the countries where he had banished them.' Then they will live in their own land."

You have claimed Israel will not exist and that the land of Israel will be given to you.


Isaiah 14:2 The nations will escort Israel and bring it to its homeland. Then the house of Israel will possess the nations as menservants and maidservants in the LORD's land. They will make captives of their captors and rule over their oppressors.

It is the saints of Israel who will reign with Christ in the land of Israel.

 

[bbyrd009]

And thus, as the Bible says “ALL Israel will be saved”

not all who are born Israel are of Israel
though?

 

[Davy]

....
Well of course Judaism is a religion, whereas "Jew" is a race, the descendants of the Tribe of Judah. I don't understand the point to were trying to make.

The reality is that the title of 'Jew' does not... mean a race. Sammy Davis Jr. was a Jew (he converted to Judaism).

The Jewish historian Josephus (100 A.D.) said the title of 'Jew' is the name the small remnant that returned to Jerusalem after the Babylon captivity took for themselves, and comes from the tribal name Judah. He also said all that lived in the land (foreigners included) took that name (and thus their religion).

The only ones who went captive to Babylon for 70 years was the "house of Judah", the three tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi, and the strangers with them. Only a remnant of those returned. The majority of Israel, the ten tribes, had already been removed from the holy lands about 130 years prior to Judah's captivity to Babylon.

Abraham was a Hebrew, not a Jew. Nor were the ten scattered tribes known as Jews. Only the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, and a small remnant of the ten tribes that left the north when Jeroboam setup the golden calf idols became the Jews.

All of the 12 tribes are Hebrews, their ancestor being Eber, where the name Hebrew is derived.

Later on in history, the nation of Khazaria adopted Judaism as their religion, and they became religious Jews. There are 2 main branches of Jews, the Sephardic which claim heritage from the bloodlines of old Israel from the Middle East, and then the Ashkenazim of Eastern Europe which were mostly converts, like from Khazar. Then there are Ethiopian Jew converts that are of the Black race that have existed for centuries.

So in most ways today, the title of 'Jew' is very much like the word 'Christian', regarding who can be one. Convert to Judaism, and boom, you're a Jew. Convert to faith on Jesus Christ and boom, you're a Christian.

Another reality is that the majority of Israelites NEVER WERE JEWS. The tribes in the north that made up the "kingdom of Israel" were not known as Jews. They were scattered first to the lands of Assyria and the Medes, never to return to the holy lands. They lost knowledge of their heritage as Israelites. They became as Gentiles scattered among the Gentiles, as God had promised He would do to them if they rebelled against Him (Deut.4 & 28). But Judah (Jews) kept their heritage as Israelites.

However, too many deceived get sucked into the lie that false Jews put forth today about heritage from old Israel. Because God has hidden the majority of the seed of Israel today through the scattered lost ten tribes, today's Jews like to get all puffed up and claim sole ownership as God's chosen seed. In reality that is a LIE. And it is even stealing.