Self-Indulgence

[marks]

Didn't have an answer fully until this morning. How can “loving others” be self-indulgence? 1 Corinthians 13:1-3 Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal. [2] And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing. [3] And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

OK, I understand.

We can perform acts of love, but not with love. This is what it is that I think people don't understand about, "Why would this man go to hell, look at all the good he's done?" Yet outside of Christ and love for others, what people do they do for themselves, including the self-indulgence of giving, a very "feel good" pastime for those who can!

Much love!

 

[Waiting on him]

Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. Jesus put on OUR flesh to perfect a walk in holiness IN OUR flesh. Otherwise why would He come all the way here?

So then they who walk in sin deny the resurrection of Christ...not in word...but in power. These also deny that Jesus was fully human. (Again not in word....but in a lacking faith)

Jesus was fully human as well as fully God. When we put on Christ we put on HIS perfected humanity. They who say they abide in Him ought to walk EXACTLY as He did.

How do I know what is sin?

 

[marks]

To escape and cover up guilt and shame with deeds of love. For glory and the praise of men. Giving the homeless man on the street corner your last five bucks because it makes you feel like a better person. Those He told to depart from Him ask “when did we not minster unto you?” (imo) love should bring a person down in seeing they are no better or no different than anyone else. Not inflate the ego of well-doing. If love brings with it superiority, then something is amiss?

I read your later answer first, I think both are good!

Doing good works to "prove" one's righteousness because one does not "feel" righteous.

This is why faith is what we need.

Much love!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. Jesus put on OUR flesh to perfect a walk in holiness IN OUR flesh. Otherwise why would He come all the way here?

So then they who walk in sin deny the resurrection of Christ...not in word...but in power. These also deny that Jesus was fully human. (Again not in word....but in a lacking faith)

Jesus was fully human as well as fully God. When we put on Christ we put on HIS perfected humanity. They who say they abide in Him ought to walk EXACTLY as He did.

God would not remove the thorn(stake) in Paul’s flesh. 2 Corinthians 12:7-9
[7] And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. [8] For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. [9] And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

“...for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” What is His strength made perfect in weakness. 1 Corinthians 1:25-29 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. [26] For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called : [27] But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; [28] And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: [29] That no flesh should glory in his presence.

 

[Episkopos]

How do I know what is sin?

Anything done outside of God's presence really. All that is not of faith...or in faith...is sin.

Jesus Christ came to reconcile us to the Father so as to restore that intimacy with God...but at a higher level. This is accomplished by becoming a disciple of Christ and entering INTO Him....taking on HIS life. Since Jesus is ALWAYS in the presence of th Father...so are we when we abide in Him.

Sin is anything that is not in God's will. We seek to establish our own righteousness (if we admit it or not) when we do anything from ourselves. We were not created to be independent and autonomous beings that do as we please. We were created for HIS pleasure...not our own. The flesh is rebellious against this notion and demands personal freedom...just like the devil does.

 

[Waiting on him]

God would not remove the thorn(stake) in Paul’s flesh. 2 Corinthians 12:7-9
[7] And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. [8] For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. [9] And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

“...for My strength is made perfect in weakness.” What is His strength made perfect in weakness. 1 Corinthians 1:25-29 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. [26] For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called : [27] But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; [28] And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: [29] That no flesh should glory in his presence.

What??? Paul was great full for being allowed to see how weak and pathetic his flesh was? Are you saying that his weakness allowed him to see the righteousness of Christ?

 

[Waiting on him]

Anything done outside of God's presence really. All that is not of faith...or in faith...is sin.

Jesus Christ came to reconcile us to the Father so as to restore that intimacy with God...but at a higher level. This is accomplished by becoming a disciple of Christ and entering INTO Him....taking on HIS life. Since Jesus is ALWAYS in the presence of th Father...so are we when we abide in Him.

Sin is anything that is not in God's will. We seek to establish our own righteousness (if we admit it or not) when we do anything from ourselves. We were not created to be independent and autonomous beings that do as we please. We were created for HIS pleasure...not our own. The flesh is rebellious against this notion and demands personal freedom...just like the devil does.

I didn’t realize that you think God comes and goes based on our behavior.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

What??? Paul was great full for being allowed to see how weak and pathetic his flesh was? Are you saying that his weakness allowed him to see the righteousness of Christ?

Philippians 1:11-12
[11] Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God. [12] But I would ye should understand, brethren, that the things which happened unto me have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel;

 

[VictoryinJesus]

What??? Paul was great full for being allowed to see how weak and pathetic his flesh was? Are you saying that his weakness allowed him to see the righteousness of Christ?

Pretty clear God wouldn’t remove the stake in the flesh...not even for someone who had been given revelations but because of those revelations...in preventing anything other than Christ from being exalted.

 

[Waiting on him]

by Jesus Christ

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I didn’t realize that you think God comes and goes based on our behavior.

given a thorn in the flesh...

Psalm 118:11-22 They compassed me about; yea, they compassed me about: but in the name of the Lord I will destroy them. [12] They compassed me about like bees; they are quenched as the fire of thorns: for in the name of the Lord I will destroy them. [13] Thou hast thrust sore at me that I might fall: but the Lord helped me. [14] The Lord is my strength and song, and is become my salvation. [15] The voice of rejoicing and salvation is in the tabernacles of the righteous: the right hand of the Lord doeth valiantly. [16] The right hand of the Lord is exalted: the right hand of the Lord doeth valiantly. [17] I shall not die, but live, and declare the works of the Lord. [18] The Lord hath chastened me sore: but he hath not given me over unto death. [19] Open to me the gates of righteousness: I will go into them, and I will praise the Lord : [20] This gate of the Lord, into which the righteous shall enter. [21] I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation. [22] The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.

 

[Episkopos]

I didn’t realize that you think God comes and goes based on our behavior.

Actually we are the ones that come and go as WE please based on our desires and lusts. But they that are Christ's....and remain in Him...do so because their own lusts and desires have been crucified away from us (we become dead to them by the working of His power on us).

 

[marks]

Actually we are the ones that come and go as WE please based on our desires and lusts.

You have a very different view of God and salvation than I do, that's for sure!

The God Who never leaves me, never forsakes me, never actually will!

Our relationship with God is based on Jesus' righteousness, not some idea of our own righteousness.

Maybe you can swim accross a pool, but you cannot swim across the ocean.

 

[marks]

Anything done outside of God's presence really.

Again, He will never leave me nor forsake me.

It's so sad those who don't know God's continued presence with them. Nothing can ever separate us from His love. He will never leave us.

But in your other words you were correct, that which is not of faith is sin, that is, that which I do that does not derive from Jesus' life in me, from the faith He gives, is sin.

Much love!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Anything done outside of God's presence really. All that is not of faith...or in faith...is sin.

Jesus Christ came to reconcile us to the Father so as to restore that intimacy with God...but at a higher level. This is accomplished by becoming a disciple of Christ and entering INTO Him....taking on HIS life. Since Jesus is ALWAYS in the presence of th Father...so are we when we abide in Him.

Ephesians 2:5-6 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Matthew 18:10-11 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. [11] For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

 

[marks]

Ecclesiastes 5
18 Behold that which I have seen: it is good and comely for one to eat and to drink, and to enjoy the good of all his labour that he taketh under the sun all the days of his life, which God giveth him: for it is his portion.

19 Every man also to whom God hath given riches and wealth, and hath given him power to eat thereof, and to take his portion, and to rejoice in his labour; this is the gift of God.

20 For he shall not much remember the days of his life; because God answereth him in the joy of his heart.

Because God answers him in the joy of his heart . . .

This is that joyful and personal relationship with a living and faithful Creator.

So much love!

 

[marks]

Ephesians 2:5-6 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Very important passage to keep in mind with looking at this doctrine of "coming and going from God", not just in some "I feel far from God" sense, but actually leaving God?

This passage tells us truth.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Actually we are the ones that come and go as WE please based on our desires and lusts. But they that are Christ's....and remain in Him...do so because their own lusts and desires have been crucified away from us (we become dead to them by the working of His power on us).

Upon reflection, your words of "we are the ones that come and go", fit neither the redeemed, nor the unredeemed. The unredeemed only come near to be saved. They do not come and go. And only faith is received for righteousness, not their behavior. And the redeemed are united with God, born from Him, by Him. And what God has joined together, let not man separate. Do you really think you even could?

Much love!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Very important passage to keep in mind with looking at this doctrine of "coming and going from God", not just in some "I feel far from God" sense, but actually leaving God?

This passage tells us truth.

Much love!

Understood but only agreeing there is a change in desires. Romans 7:16-17 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good. [17] Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Upon reflection, your words of "we are the ones that come and go", fit neither the redeemed, nor the unredeemed. The unredeemed only come near to be saved. They do not come and go. And only faith is received for righteousness, not their behavior. And the redeemed are united with God, born from Him, by Him. And what God has joined together, let not man separate. Do you really think you even could?

Much love!

Revelation 3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.