Those Jews were lost for they did not obey, submit to God's righteous commands. Therefore obedience is necessary to being saved and not works of the OT law or works of merit.
Only faith in Jesus Christ is necessary; and a living faith will produce a practical righteousness every time if given the opportunity.
Again, how could Abraham be one who "worketh not" (Rom 4) when in fact he did do works (
Hebrews 11:8,17)?
Romans 4:5 is speaking of a generic reality that does not have to refer to Abraham.
To him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted to him for righteousness.
Idolatry is unrighteousness
Then why did God call Aaron "the saint of the LORD" (Psalms 106:16)?
One is not first righteous then goes about doing righteousness.
A person is made righteous by faith; and then, yes, he becomes a doer of the word.
There is not example of a person who was seen as righteous BEFORE they ever did any righteousness.
That may or may not be. However, Abraham was declared righteous by the LORD in Genesis 15:6, and then proceeded to pimp his wife to the Egyptian Pharaoh.
To call them unrighteous BEFORE they had done any evil is like calling a wall painted BEFORE any paint has been put on it.
It is more like calling the wall unpainted before any paint is applied. For righteousness is a covering among other things.
God has never declared any person as righteous BEFORE that person had ever done any righteousness.
In Romans 4:5, it is a general rule that the Lord justifies the ungodly. Thus your position is refuted by the verse.
There is no verse at all that says righteousness or unrighteousness is transferred from one person to another.
It is a basic Bible truth that the Lord gives us His righteousness when we believe on Him. And unrighteousness is indeed transferred to the animal in the OT as a type of what would happen later when Jesus died on the Cross for us.
There is no such thing as a righteous or unrighteous gene that is passed from one to another.
You are in denial of basic scriptural truth. Keep studying.
The only way a person can be righteous is by doing righteousness.
The only way a person can do righteousness is if he is first righteous.
If we can transfer our sins into an animal then there was no reason for Christ to died and shed His blood to wash away our sins.
There is. For it was impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. However, the picture of transferring sin to the animal as a type of what would happen with the crucifixion is very clear in scripture.
My position, as found in the Bible that salvation is by obedience to God's will, nothing has changed.
Again, my position is that we are saved by grace through faith and that not of ourselves, it is the gift of the Lord: not of works, lest any man should boast. Since obedience translates into works, the verse that I just quoted refutes your position. We are saved by grace; and obedience is the sure result. But the obedience doesn't save; for we are saved by grace through faith and not of works.
God saves, but who does He save and why? The obedient (
Hebrews 5:9).
Again, Hebrews 5:9 does not deny the concept that faith comes first and that the obedience is a sign of the righteousness of faith.
Therefore a faith that justifies (
Romans 5:1) is a faith that obeys.
No doubt. However, we are not saved by the obedience itself. But I will agree that we are saved through an obedient faith.
Faith only is void of obedience for is is just a mental assent of the mind, just simple acknowledge of some Biblical information and nothing more.
My position is that we are saved by a "living faith alone". What this means is that if someone places a living faith in Christ and never has an opportunity do any good works, they will still go to heaven.
The faith that God requires is spoken of in Romans 10:10...
Rom 10:10, For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
I do believe that the Lord is speaking of a practical righteousness here.
You post "I agree that mental assent will never cut it." But that all faith only is, a mental assent of the mind and that is why James says faith only is dead. Just having a mental assent that a hungry person will be fed without <fify> DOING anything is dead faith.
I'm in agreement.
1 John 1:8 agreed...yes we sin and yet we are saved.
We have sin and yet we are saved. But if we commit sin, we are children of the devil (1 John 3:8). Are we then going to heaven?
You say you are not against the doctrine of imputation, but you are.
I am not. For I have even taught the doctrine in other places in these boards.
You are against it <fify> as long as you add your 'impartation' to it.
I do believe that the two doctrines are compatible. You should ask the Lord to give you understanding on these issues.
The doctrine of imputation is very practical because it works.
It works? Does it work so powerfully that it puts unrighteous people in heaven?
A heaven with unrighteous people in it will be no heaven at all. Sin causes all kinds of suffering. A heaven that has sin in it will be a heaven that contains suffering; thus the promises of Revelation 21:4 and Psalms 16:11 would be null and void.
Whose obedience is required to make one righteous? (Rom. 5:19), one of your favorite verses. "by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous." Imputation
When Jesus died on the Cross, he said,
Father, into thy hands I commend my Spirit. The same Holy Spirit was later poured out on the church (on the day of Pentecost and has been in believers ever since). It is this Spirit who dwells within us and enables us to walk in freedom from and victory over sin. Therefore, Jesus' one righteous act resulted in us being made righteous in a very practical sense.
(Rom. 4:8) "Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin." Doesn't mean you are not a sinner. Means the Lord does not impute it to you.
I agree. However, it doesn't mean that you
are a sinner, either. Definitions. If a sinner is someone who commits sin, then every sinner is a child of the devil (1 John 3:8). If a sinner is someone who has sin dwelling within him, then the term applies to every last one of us.
Again I ask, will the imputation of Christ's righteousness still be necessary for you in Heaven? You will be sinless there. No danger of sinning there. My how your righteousness will glow. Will Christ's imputed righteousness still be necessary for you? Why?
What do you think? If we are without sin in heaven, why is imputation necessary, there?
Personally, I believe that it is the imputation that will keep us walking in righteousness once we get there.
So? We are talking about the doctrine of imputation. This verse speaks to Gentiles as opposed to Israel. The door being opened to the Gentiles at this time but will one day close and be opened to Israel. It has nothing to do with imputation.
A slightly different subject has also been brought up; and I was addressing that.
God imputed Adam's sin to the human race. God imputed the sin of the human race to Christ. God imputed the righteousness of Christ to those who believe.
I agree.