I only read yours and the first responses. I doubt I will get involved as what I see is just arguing over semantics, making both parties right about the atonement.
I do not believe the debate is about semantics and nor, I imagine, does
@John Caldwell. Otherwise we would both have given up on it by now. The reason I see this discussion as important is that unless the Lord Jesus Christ has taken your sins and mine upon Himself and paid the penalty for them in full, we shall have to pay that penalty in full ourselves.
But there was one question I would have for them. I'm curious if I'll get an answer.
If you believe what you wrote, quoting Scriptures or not, what's not to agree with? I agree with all of it,
I agree with all the Scriptures as well. The problem is that John does not believe that they mean what I believe they mean.
but there was one part I wonder if they will agree with.
You said:
He made our sins His own and freed us from the bondage of sin and death that has held mankind in slavery by defeating the powers of evil.
Or if they will think it a lie to not call themselves a "sinner." How many of them will agree that Jesus took away our sin, and in Him there is no sin. Or if they will instead say they are sinners and only have imputed righteousness, not actual righteousness, and that the blood of Jesus merely covers our sin, while it remains underneath His covering.
Let's see:
cc: @Steve Owen; @David Taylor; @Enoch111
We are absolutely free from the bondage of sin, but that does not make us sinless. We are no longer slaves to sin, but there remains in all of us a relic of sin, which keeps pulling us back. This 'relic' is not in us, but in our 'flesh' (Romans 7:18; Galatians 5:16-17), our 'members' or our 'mortal bodies' (Romans 6:12-13; 7:22-23) and we have constantly to be resisting it and putting it to death (Colossians 3:5) walking in the Spirit and not grieving Him or quenching Him with our petty sins or worldliness, all of which is a life-long battle.
'If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us,' but
'if anyone [that is, any Christian]
sins, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.'
If you want to discuss this further, please start a new thread and quote this post. Otherwise this thread will end up being hi-jacked.