The Apostate Holy Laughter Movement

[marksman]

I have read the testimony of many ministers who went to Toronto and experienced what it had to offer, laughter and all. They all said they came dried up and without vision. They all left saying they had been revitalised and their church came alive. What you might call the proof of the pudding.

 

[marksman]

Let me ask all those who are criticising. Are you an armchair critic or have you been to the meetings and seen things for yourself?

 

[marksman]

Would someone call in an exorcist, please!
And this utter dementia and disgrace is in most charlatan churches, not just the 'giggles for god' movements. You see this erratic and 'possessed' behaviour in the Creflo Dollars and Benny Hinns too.
Despite the fact that these movements do, to some degree, defame Christianity, it is understandable to some extent, because we know that every good thing that is out there, will always be knocked-off, exploited and corrupted by deceptive, misguided and avaricious people.

Creflo Dollar and Benny Hinn are not the sum total of Christianity and they are not Jesus or the Holy Spirit. My Christianity was formed out of the testimony of hundreds of believers, not two.

 

[amadeus]

Christians with wisdom get to decide, amadeus, do you know of any?
For example, I will decide if you can't, and I have authoritatively decided that the Giggles for God movement is diabolical.
Would you care to question my judgement, or attempt to undermine my discernment, or do you maintain your 'hey, who am I to judge' pseudo-Christian attitude?
Paul fought apostasy day and night, was tortured, famished and mocked continuously. He fought heresies that were incessantly creeping into the Churches that he established, the minute that he left. And he was constantly dodging the murderous threats from his fellow Jews.
Do you think that he sat in his prison cell either, giggling to himself, or rolling on the floor in hysteria, in order to gain strength, wisdom, peace, edification or at oneness with God?

Why should we not, for others, leave it in God's hands? Don't you believe He is able to handle it for Himself? Yes, He may use a man, but how would we know that a man is not himself misled, unless we in the Spirit of God, as His sheep hear His voice? If we don't then it is time to remain silent for then we are women in the church!

For ourselves, if it makes a difference, we must decide, but again are we in touch with God even more especially regarding our own decisions and actions? Or are we trying to figure it all out, or are we simply following the lead of some man or some group's declaration?

 

[marksman]

I do point out that Paul was confronted by this iniquity also in his days for why he reminded believers of this tradition to reprove the lie that believers believe that they can receive the Holy Spirit "again" or "continually" after salvation moment.

2 Thessalonians 2:1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, ........

Can't see the point of the verses you posted as they do not refer to those who laugh in meetings.

Judging by your judgment on what God does, the Welsh revival was a sham. Men, in particular, would fall to the floor in the meetings because of the overwhelming sense of sin in their lives. Even men who were walking along the street would fall to the ground if they walked by the chapel where the revival was happening.

 

[marksman]

Sure makes a mockery of God's people. I have read about this spirit before and, I agree...it is NOT from our very ordered God! Nor is it biblical

Everything that brings anyone closer to God and gives him a greater understanding of his majesty and power is of God.

I was at a conference of 12,000 people and until then I did not really understand the verse that he inhabits the praises of his people. In the evening meeting, we started praising God and after a couple of songs, a physical presence descended on us. I felt the presence and after a few minutes, I realized that God was inhabiting the praises of his people.

It went on for about 20 minutes and it was not something that you could manufacture. It was God first and God last. A genuine supernatural experience that God wanted us to have because, at that moment of time, we made room for him.

 

[amadeus]

Amadeus, you win the prize, by scoring 100% on the 'who can take the most Bible passages out-of-context' contest!

It seems to me that you simply don't understand. You have learned or been taught or indoctrinated to a certain context as men see contexts and are unable to hear what the Spirit is saying. So not understanding you presume that I am in error. I do not claim infallibility for I also am a man, but I do know some things that I did not learn in school or from any man. There are times when God puts the words in my mouth. Doubt it if you think you must, but be careful about assuming your understanding is absolute!

 

[marksman]

Care to explain why? With scripture too?

Surely there are enough scripture to show my concern as valid.

How do you test the spirits from the real indwelling Holy Spirit?

Can you show me a scripture where it shows God approves of you driving a car?

 

[marksman]

Would someone call in an exorcist, please!
And this utter dementia and disgrace is in most charlatan churches, not just the 'giggles for god' movements. You see this erratic and 'possessed' behaviour in the Creflo Dollars and Benny Hinns too.
Despite the fact that these movements do, to some degree, defame Christianity, it is understandable to some extent, because we know that every good thing that is out there, will always be knocked-off, exploited and corrupted by deceptive, misguided and avaricious people.

Not true. I was in a church in the UK for 10 years that experienced revival for 30 years. At no time was it knocked off or exploited or corrupted by deceptive, misguided and avaricious people. It kept on the straight and narrow because it had seven Elders that were in touch with God and kept things in order. In the 10 years I was there it was only out of order five times. That is five times out of 1,500 meetings.

 

[Enow]

If we His sheep know His voice and follow Him, we will not miss Jesus and follow something false. People do because they either have never received the Holy Ghost or they have subsequently learned to quench the Spirit instead of to listen well and follow carefully!

It is by heeding His words is how we build on the rock and not sand so that we will not fall to these seducing spirits. Matthew 7:24-27 Jesus is the only way to come to God the Father by in worship, prayer, & fellowship. John 14:6 By climbing up another way is a work of iniquity ( John 10:1 ) for why God would permit strong delusion to occur for believing the lie that you can receive the Holy Ghost again ( 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 ) when He is in you since your salvation at the calling of the gospel as Spirit-filled so you can testify that Jesus is the Savior for He has saved us. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15

A leaky vessel does not testify to such an effect. Matthew 9:17

I pray in English, German and Spanish regularly along with praying daily in a prayer language which God gave to me more than 40 years ago. God hears me and I hear Him!

As long as you know what you are praying for, so you KNOW you are can giving the Father thanks in Jesus's name, then that is the will of God for you, BUT if you do not know what you had prayed for, and you think the Holy Spirit is praying, then you need to test that spirit and that tongue ( 1 John 4:1-6 ) because that kind of tongue was in the world before Pentecost had come.

Sometimes people really do not know what to pray and pray amiss in their ignorance or even in their pain. Does anyone ever pray like David did for the life of his own child and the child died. That child died in spite of David's heart felt prayers because it was time. Everyone, for whatever reason has a time.

John 16:13 in all Bibles say the Holy Spirit cannot use tongues for uttering His own intercessions. KJV Romans 8:26-27 is the one that lines up with John 16:13 because not even His groanings can be uttered hence silent intercessions. It is Christ Jesus that searches our hearts as per Hebrews 4:12-16 and so it is "he" that "knows" the mind of the Spirit to give His silent intercessions to the Father because this is the will of God that there be only One Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. This is how the Holy Spirit makes intercessions for everybody silently and how the Father knonws before we, ourselves, ask anything in prayer.

Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

It is a lie to believe that the Holy Spirit needs a covert language so the devil cannot do anything to undermine the prayer, but we all know the Book of Job has the devil limited for he is the one that cannot do anything without God's permission.

So don't believe every spirit but test them; and tongues for private use is not of Him at all, brother. Shun it today and don't chase any more after the spirits for s sign in receiving when He has been dwelling in you since salvation.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

 

[Enow]

My friend, the anti-Christ is working in you in spite of the fact that you may have received the gift of the Holy Spirit. You started this thread to divide instead of to unite believers. You insist that you know God's mind on things when you do not. Sometimes you may, but your actions indicate you believe that you always know His mind better than anyone who might dare to oppose you and then you speak as if what they are espousing is an anti-Christ spirit.

When you decide for another believer that he is in error and tell him so without a revelation from God, what spirit do you think that is? Doesn't Jesus makes it clear where such judgments belong?

Have I not been using scripture citing warnings and discernments regarding spirits of the antichrist and about the real indwelling Holy Ghost in this thread for judgment to come on the "holy laughter" movement & others like it where they preach receiving what they assume is another "Holy Spirit" to get that sign or wonder by??

You can only defend it by explaining why the scripture does not apply and explain what that scripture is actually warning us about as well as why that is not the spirit of the antichrist, but you can't do that, can you, because scripture reproves it.

 

[Enow]

I've watched such videos before. I know what they show and say. Do you really believe that there is anything new under the sun? Solomon wrote about that 3,000 years ago:

"The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us." Ecc 1:9-10

You delve into too much garbage. The world is full of garbage. I really try to avoid it and seek the "very good" that is as God made it in the beginning.

So basically anything before Pentecost that was evil, it doesn't count when you find it in Christianity? I have to disagree strongly with what you are trying to rationalize from your quote. You can't call what was evil before Pentecost "good".

 

[Enow]

Sometimes you say reasonably good things and even cite the scriptures correctly. Others times you speak very foolishly. Should we prove something first before listening to God? When you are one of His sheep you know His voice and no those of strangers. All of this other garbage you are concerned about is the "voice of strangers":

"And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers." John 10:4-5

Why you need to learn or know their voices when you know and follow His voice? What does it mean to know?
Consider what Jesus meant here?

"Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:22-23

How do you know that tongues for private use is not a stranger's voice you are following since you know not what it is saying?

 

[Enow]

You are still doing it: deciding for God what and how He will or will not do things according your humanly reasoned understanding of scripture mixed with the things of man. Consider again this which I am certain you have heard before:

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9

They could not get there in the OT. So one reason Jesus was sent to make the impossible possible for each of us. But.. He did not send Jesus and the Holy Ghost so we could use our brains to figure it out. That failed in the OT but now it is possible for whosoever will [not many are really willing] , but only by the power of God working in individual being prepared to perfectly into the Body of Christ. Don't presume to say what God can or cannot do; or what God will or will not do!

Why did David dance before the Lord with all of his might when his own wife was embarrassed and ashamed of his seemingly very worldly display? But David in spite of his failures was called the apple of His eye and a man after God's own heart. He did not do that by following the impossible to keep laws [in which he failed miserably], but by always admitting his own frailty and always being ready to pay the price of death which law would have required. For murder or adultery the law prescribed death, but God forgave David because of David's heart which God was watching all of the time. He wasn't watching His adultery and murder, saying, Oh now I am going to get him. No, He was watching the heart of man, like we are men, who was willing to die because he loved God and he knew he had been disobedient. Are we willing to do as much? We cannot judge others, because we cannot see their hearts. How clearly can we see even our own hearts?

Perhaps many people in these "movements" you condemn so self-righteously actually received something good, that is something from the only One who is good because of their hearts. Did you not see one of them? No, so then condemn the whole thing because it looks awful bad to you!

You said that God is not the author of confusion and so it is, but everyone of us who is still double minded has confusion mixed with the good things of God. [Only those who have already overcome the world as Jesus did, are not double-minded serving God on the one hand and sinning on the other when we quench the Spirit in us.] That is what in the end of the matter could cause us to be spit out of His mouth. I include myself too, because I know that I have not yet overcome all that stands between me and God, but the end is not yet. I am hopeful, not because I have been given definite confirmation of my salvation, but because I strive to always love God even in the worst of times and I know that He is fair and loving and merciful. That is not a guarantee, but a hope!

How about we do this instead.

What have you discerned supernaturally that is not of Him at all? And how did you discern that?

Now if you say you have not done anything like that at all, then you are saying you do not test the spirits at all but believe every spirit to be of God then, right? Can you see my concern for you, brother?

1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. 5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

 

[Enow]

I have no idea why you are posting all those verses as they have nothing at all to do with the laughter that happens in meetings.

Can you address those scripture to explain why it does not apply to that movement? How can you discern seducing spirits if we believe that spirit to be the Holy Spirit just because it makes us laugh? What part of "seducing" spirits don't you get for why it applies to that movement?

 

[Enow]

The scripture says that the HOLY SPIRIT will lead us into all truth, not Jesus.

The Holy Spirit hears from Jesus and speaks unto us from Jesus. So our response is TO the Bridegroom, not TO the Holy Spirit. Jesus Christ is the Good Shepherd that guides us through the Holy Spirit in us. Jesus Christ is the Head of every believer and every church. He is the One that began a good work in us ( Philippians 1:6 ) being the author & finisher of our faith ( Hebrews 12:1-2 ) as all the fruits of righteousness are by Jesus Christ ( Philippians 1:11 )

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

So yes, the Holy Spirit will lead us into all truth but Jesus Christ is the One leading us by the Holy Spirit in us. Truth.

 

[Enow]

Can't see the point of the verses you posted as they do not refer to those who laugh in meetings.

Judging by your judgment on what God does, the Welsh revival was a sham. Men, in particular, would fall to the floor in the meetings because of the overwhelming sense of sin in their lives. Even men who were walking along the street would fall to the ground if they walked by the chapel where the revival was happening.

If it is the revival I think you are referring to, they were habitual drunkards that exchanged their works in the flesh to those seducing spirits. When it stopped happening, they went back to their alcohol. So no lives changed there. Just exchanged from drunkenness by liquor to seducing spirits and then back again. That's what happens when you put the emphasis on the phenomenon rather than preaching Jesus Christ & Him crucified.

 

[Enow]

Can you show me a scripture where it shows God approves of you driving a car?

Can you? The scripture I apply is for every believer for edification and reproof and discernment with His help. You are not asking Him if they apply or not, are you? Ask Him today, brother. Give us the answer He gives you by the scripture as in rightly dividing the word of truth with His help.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

As I mentioned before...when I asked God " Why this, and why that" ..He told me - " Because I can."

If He wishes to touch someone just to show them that He is there, and He wants to jump right into their life. He can.
Woe unto those who keep stating that it is all demonic and that "God does not do that. these days"

Well , I like Marksman , have heard the audible voice of God. I have seen angels, I have seen the demonic , I have had dreams, I have had visions.

WHY? I have no ides at all.
My husband never has. He does not see himself as not being special to God , or suck his thumb because no special thing has ever happened to him in his christian life.

John 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

Seems reversed blessed are those who have seen...

Little people with stunted vision seem so sure that they "know what is what" in the spiritual realm , and talk with so such confidence against the spiritual things.

yet the topic is seeing with two eyes things manifested literally ...things that take days to wash off in the shower. I’m sorry and hate not agreeing as you and Amadeus are friends. But how is it again people are judged by their experiences when not having them and they become “little people with stunted vision” instead of “blessed are they that have not seen, yet have believed.”

 

[amadeus]

It is by heeding His words is how we build on the rock and not sand so that we will not fall to these seducing spirits. Matthew 7:24-27 Jesus is the only way to come to God the Father by in worship, prayer, & fellowship. John 14:6 By climbing up another way is a work of iniquity ( John 10:1 ) for why God would permit strong delusion to occur for believing the lie that you can receive the Holy Ghost again ( 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12 ) when He is in you since your salvation at the calling of the gospel as Spirit-filled so you can testify that Jesus is the Savior for He has saved us. 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15

With this I understand well why friend @Episkopos sometimes refuses to begin to try to clarify because so many things are different that simple, or even any communication, is impossible. I will try one more time.

Read II Thessalonians again especially verse 10 about the "love of truth". It is because of this that delusion is sent.
If you understand that maybe you will begin to see something good!

A leaky vessel does not testify to such an effect. Matthew 9:17

The vessel leaks because the Holy Spirit which could seal it is spread too thin. Plenty of flesh, but little Life giving Spirit. Imbalance will do this.

As long as you know what you are praying for, so you KNOW you are can giving the Father thanks in Jesus's name, then that is the will of God for you, BUT if you do not know what you had prayed for, and you think the Holy Spirit is praying, then you need to test that spirit and that tongue ( 1 John 4:1-6 ) because that kind of tongue was in the world before Pentecost had come.

John 16:13 in all Bibles say the Holy Spirit cannot use tongues for uttering His own intercessions. KJV Romans 8:26-27 is the one that lines up with John 16:13 because not even His groanings can be uttered hence silent intercessions. It is Christ Jesus that searches our hearts as per Hebrews 4:12-16 and so it is "he" that "knows" the mind of the Spirit to give His silent intercessions to the Father because this is the will of God that there be only One Mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus. This is how the Holy Spirit makes intercessions for everybody silently and how the Father knonws before we, ourselves, ask anything in prayer.

Matthew 6:7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

It is a lie to believe that the Holy Spirit needs a covert language so the devil cannot do anything to undermine the prayer, but we all know the Book of Job has the devil limited for he is the one that cannot do anything without God's permission.

So don't believe every spirit but test them; and tongues for private use is not of Him at all, brother. Shun it today and don't chase any more after the spirits for s sign in receiving when He has been dwelling in you since salvation.

Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

This is an overwhelming amount on your part. I could answer every question and every difference but your whole response is, if you'll pardon the expression, 'out of wack'. Until you are able to go the lowest room and let Him lift you up again... any effort on my
part would not be received anyway primarily probably because the verse 10 thing I mentioned above. I may not be completely right but you are so far off we cannot really discuss it. I noticed this before when I read a few of your posts and then purposely avoided responding to you until God pressed me. He is not pressing at the moment. Only God gives the increase!