The Apostate Holy Laughter Movement

[DNB]

On one side you have those who see no problem to the Holy Spirit falling on people in a tangible way and leading them into supernatural experiences that gives them a sense of the presence of God.

Don't misconstrue where the contention lies.
We are saying that this is not from the Holy Spirit, ....nor are any of your sentiments.
Can you not tell the difference between God and satan?
I do not believe for one minute that you were god-smacked, as far as your falling down experience is concerned.
The only time that people were thrown to the ground in the Bible, is when they had a devil spirit, and they were being exorcised.
Your experience, on the other hand, sounds like voodoo to me.
Otherwise, the true Spirit caused people to speak in tongues and praise God with profound worship, or perform other miracles.
Can you not tell the difference?

 

[FollowHim]

Sorry Nancy, I am judging.
It is my place to judge, as it is yours, and I will do so with the utmost confidence that what was on that video, or any other discussions on this matter either advocating, or remaining indifferent towards this movement, is absolute insanity, and straight from the devil.
Anyone who engages is such activity, will turn out the worse for it, for sure!

There is a place for judging, but laughter is not one issue. The heresy of living an abject sinful life and doing nothing to repent and walk in the ways of Jesus, deserves condemnation. If one condemns laughter, why not singing, why not being happy, why not greeting anyone optimistically etc and so it goes on. One can hide an emotional disposition and judgmentalism, a kind of dominance under the disguise of speaking the truth. There is a therapy that suggests 15 minutes a week of good laughing is good for the soul. If you look at children, enjoying the gift of life and exploring is part of how we live and prosper. God does not condemn praise and celebration of good things, but rather evil actions and causing harm to others in an unjust way.

 

[Enow]

On this issue, my understanding is absolute Amadeus. Do i sound arrogant or audacious?
This is elementary, even a novice can tell the difference. @charity put it very well, 'it's obscene!'.
We are offended by it, and we find the other people on this thread, like yourself, who are too naive or complacent to denounce it, to be sounding extremely incompetent and foolish, and verging on heretical.

But if they know not what they do, we can only reprove the works of darkness for what it is. It is best to avoid judging people in the fourm. It can lead to biting and devouring one another. We should do the instructions for outreach ministry by judging only the works of darkness themselves in the hopes that God is peradventuring to recover some from this snare of the devil.

 

[FollowHim]

As to be expected, a subject like this is very polarising. On one side you have those who see no problem to the Holy Spirit falling on people in a tangible way and leading them into supernatural experiences that gives them a sense of the presence of God.

On the other side, you have those who deny the supernatural in any shape or form and if it does happen then it is from Satan even if people have been set free from problems or healed from some sickness or disease. Most of these people are armchair critics who have never seen any of the supernatural happenings. They prefer to criticise from the sidelines based on what they have been taught is or is not kosher.

One supernatural experience I had when I was 36 years old. We were having a series of meetings at the church that was experiencing a revival and the preacher spoke about rejection. When he had finished speaking he asked people to come forward if they wanted prayer to be released from rejection.

I knew I had it because I was abandoned as a baby by my parents so I went forward for prayer. One of the Elders prayed for me and with no help from anyone, went flat on my back on a hard floor. I was not hurt in any shape or form. When I came too I tried to get up but I couldn't. There was a supernatural force holding me down. I tried several times to get up but could not so I gave in. I was down there for 30 minutes and during that time I could feel God operating on me removing the spirit of rejection. When I did eventually get up it was gone.

It is very hard for anyone to pull the wool over my eyes because I am autistic and we do not have emotions that need feeding and stimulating. I have to admit that I can sit in a meeting that is supposedly having a spiritual visitation and I sit there stone cold as it does not touch me for the simple reason it is manufactured by a few in the congregation. When the genuine does happen, then I am gobsmacked by it and cannot resist it.

Over my 66 years as a Christian, I have been exposed to all sorts of beliefs and denominational teaching and I give no allegiance to one in particular. All I am interested in is the real deal so I do not care who provides it as long as it is the real deal. I am old enough and ugly enough to know the real thing from the counterfeit and wise enough to differentiate between the two. So when people tell me I do not know what I am talking about my only response is that it means you know nothing at all what you are talking about.

What I talk about is always based on what I experience and have been taught. I am never an armchair critic. Unless I have personal experience I keep my mouth shut. And when you have been in a church for 10 years that was in revival as I have been, you tend to have seen it all so telling me that I don't know what I am talking about is like telling a fighter pilot he doesn't know how to fly a plane.

So unless you can produce some solid evidence, not just hearsay and conjecture, as far as I am concerned you are totally up the creek without a paddle and just pushing your own barrow because you have such a narrow definition of God that puts him in a box of your making and he is not allowed to get out of it as it contravenes your theology. In other words, God has to fit your theology rather than your theology fitting in with God.

In every move of God, there is ALWAYS the good and the bad but one does not if he/she has any common sense throw the baby out with the bathwater. You take the good and ignore the bad. That is what I have always done and that is why I have seen so much of God's power and glory in a tangible way as God knows that he has a receptive heart at any time he wants to reveal himself to me which he has done on numerous occasions.

Telling me that God does not appear supernaturally is like telling the Queen of England she does not have a palace.

The problem here is simple. A preacher laid hands on you and you found yourself on the floor, so you know what is of God and what is not of God. I thought spiritual authority and truth came through the word of God and His reality, not emotional or spiritual experiences.

I read the testimony of a man under the delusion of the prosperity gospel and the hope of seed sowing. Even though he knew it was false teaching and a delusion, he still gave, in the middle of the process of leaving the church. We love these optimistic, quick fix solutions that always have a good outcome, with the right fuzzy feeling.

But throughout church history guys have felt they knew God, and did insane stuff, claiming they now had the unique light, only to be actually wrong and deluded. And these super apostles, often are the most aggressive and condemning of simple faithful believers, which speaks more about the error of their hearts and position than anything else. Our core is loving from the heart. Anything that loses that, is not of the Lord.

 

[Enow]

I am not going to argue. All I was trying to get across was... they have thrown the baby out with the bath water.

Neither Wille, Amadeus or myself were saying that there was no 'flesh' mixed in..there was...anyone would have to be blind not to see it.

Whenever God is at work..guess what, there is the Devil too right in the midst.

The leadership allowed it to get right out of hand.

<quote> But how is it again people are judged by their experiences when not having them and they become “little people with stunted vision” < >

Well that is a twist!

It's not a case of 'not having them' these people believe that everything stopped with the apostles ...these people don't want them, and most probably if God even tried to show them something in the Spirit realm, they would no doubt 'cross themselves' wave the garlic, and rebuke the devil!!

Any saved believer with the indwelling Holy Spirit in them since salvation at the calling of the gospel that testifies to receiving the Holy Spirit again after a sign, even a sign of tongues, and believes it to be the Holy Spirit, such testimonies are free to be thrown out altogether as not of Him at all in keeping the faith in Jesus Christ.

Ephesians 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

You cannot receive another Jesus when He is in you and is with you always since your salvation at the calling of the gospel when you had first believed in Him. That is how you can test the spirits as not of Him when greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world; 1 John 4:4

 

[Enow]

And Who died and made you King?

You are speaking NOT against me...but against GOD Himself.
Take it up with Him, not me.
You should be shaking in your boots.

Until you reprove by the scripture, there is no need for him to do that.

Since scripture aka His words reproves & thus judges the movement as not of Him, then prove otherwise in rightly dividing the word of truth.

Just believing every spirit is of God is not what the apostle John told you to do.

1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. 5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them. 6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

 

[Enow]

neither am I. Maybe I should have stayed away from this topic. Right after coughing endlessly for weeks, our home was hit with a stomach virus. It has been one thing after another this winter. I’m sorry for not being in the best of moods.

I hope you are feeling better soon.

 

[Enow]

Do you read any of you own posts?

Amadeus always answers like a polite gentleman, while make yourself look like a foolish little boy in the playground sticking his tongue out .
And now, when you can't prove you dogmatic arguments , you revert to THIS!! Name calling!!

What a big brave boy you are.
Hope you go to bed tonight really proud of yourself.

I can't defend the action of that fellow brother, since we all need His help in ministering to others to not get mad that have gone astray, but Amadeus wanting us to stop reproving and thus not judging what he is involved in by the scripture as a work of darkness is hardly a "polite answer", sister.

 

[Enow]

If God himself were to tell me that what went on in that video was 'of the Holy Spirit', I would become a 'Pologramist'.
And before anyone asks, Pologramism is an undiscoverable religion to which I alone have been given the key, as a safeguard against a time of need.
At which time I would become its leader and sole member.
Its objective would be to pull the plonkers of all followers of Benny Hinn and, at a time of which no man, and not even I, would know, would be to make war against Benny Hinn, and cast him into the ‘Pitiless Bottom’ from whence he came.

Clarification is needed. Are you supporting Benny Hinn by saying you cannot make war with him or are you exposing what Benny Hinn is into as not of the Lord at all?

 

[DNB]

There is a place for judging, but laughter is not one issue. The heresy of living an abject sinful life and doing nothing to repent and walk in the ways of Jesus, deserves condemnation. If one condemns laughter, why not singing, why not being happy, why not greeting anyone optimistically etc and so it goes on. One can hide an emotional disposition and judgmentalism, a kind of dominance under the disguise of speaking the truth. There is a therapy that suggests 15 minutes a week of good laughing is good for the soul. If you look at children, enjoying the gift of life and exploring is part of how we live and prosper. God does not condemn praise and celebration of good things, but rather evil actions and causing harm to others in an unjust way.

You sound immature. Can you not distinguish the inconvenience and frivolity of laughter, in general?
Who laughed in the Bible as a therapeutic measure, or for absolutely no reason? No one!
Sarah laughed at the marvelous thing that God did. It was miraculous and grounds for an extreme sentiment. It wasn't laughter, as we know giddiness and silliness to be, but shaking of one's head in disbelief of God's kindness and greatness (laughter is not the best understanding of what she meant)

 

[Willie T]

I knew Benny Hinn here in Tampa some 35 or 40 years ago — before all this fame went to his head and he seemed to go nuts — I am curious to check out what it is people are saying he has now renounced. He was actually quite a sane person in those days.

 

[Enow]

Using labels like "spirit of the anti-christ" is not a good idea. Laughing is not an evil act, it does not hurt people. Laughing for no apparent reason is something to wonder about, that something is not adding up. Laughter is about absurdity, elation, being relaxed and happy. It is a human condition like crying, or speaking or sleeping.

Normal laughter is done when there is something funny to laugh about. Being supernaturally made to laugh and lose self control is not the same thing. 1 Corinthians 14:32-33 has the spirits of the prophets subject to the prophets thus no loss of self control here as God is not the author of confusion as in ALL churches of the saints; hence no exception. The fact that Khundalini was in the world before Pentecost as the works therein is of evil, it cannot be found in Christianity at all. When they testifying to a spirit coming over people in these events is why it is the spirit of the antichrist, because the Holy Spirit has been in them since salvation at the calling of the gospel when they had first believed in Him.

What does matter is what is the subject, the focus, the context, the meaning and how are people using the experience.
If you put me in a room of laughing people, I will probably laugh as well. I have seen whole groups of people laughing with Kenneth Hagin and his theology that you do not need to repent of sin and get right with God, just live as if you are a child of God with no need to consider consequences. That belief is no laughing matter, but laughing along with him could in itself be regard as sin.

Agreed.

Before the King of Kings, laughing with a self confessed sinner who does not repent, confess or deal with their sin, or walk the straight path.
There is something ironic here. The idea a sinner can flout Gods ways, be in rebellion and claim for themselves miraculous powers and authority is enough to make me roll about laughing at just the total stupidity of the idea, and to the audience, their minds probably find it so absurd it is funny. Unfortunately it is something that should generate weeping and wailing in sack cloth and ashes, but for these folk, to say such a thing would be called "anti-Christ".

The Lord said He would bring a delusion on people.

11 For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie
12 and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.
2 Thess 2:11-12

The lie being that they believe they can receive the Holy Spirit again apart from salvation after a sign, even a sign of tongues for private use or in this case, "holy laughter". This is why Paul reminded them of that tradition of when they had received the sanctification of the Spirit and the belief of the truth at the calling of the gospel in 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15

Put these two things together, wickedness and praise of God. Sadly this is not slander or make believe, but these folk will aggressively defend their behaviour suggesting being sorrowful and repentant for sin is condemnation of the enemy, while praise and elation is Gods blessing.
If you want to define dysfunctional individuals who are dangerous this is it, who want the appearance of being loving and kind but without the reality.

Thank you for sharing. That is another way of discerning this to be of the works of darkness.

1 John 1:3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ. 4 And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full. 5 This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

 

[DNB]

But if they know not what they do, we can only reprove the works of darkness for what it is. It is best to avoid judging people in the fourm. It can lead to biting and devouring one another. We should do the instructions for outreach ministry by judging only the works of darkness themselves in the hopes that God is peradventuring to recover some from this snare of the devil.

After you Enow, let's see if your patience and gentleness will convince these people of what darkness that they are endorsing.
I feel that they should know better, and that there is a time for austerity and rebuke. For, who can possibly watch those videos and claim that these people are manifesting the power and wisdom of God?
It's offensive, and people should know better.

 

[Enow]

The problem here is simple. A preacher laid hands on you and you found yourself on the floor, so you know what is of God and what is not of God. I thought spiritual authority and truth came through the word of God and His reality, not emotional or spiritual experiences.

1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world....4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

I read the testimony of a man under the delusion of the prosperity gospel and the hope of seed sowing. Even though he knew it was false teaching and a delusion, he still gave, in the middle of the process of leaving the church. We love these optimistic, quick fix solutions that always have a good outcome, with the right fuzzy feeling.

1 Timothy 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. 9 But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

But throughout church history guys have felt they knew God, and did insane stuff, claiming they now had the unique light, only to be actually wrong and deluded. And these super apostles, often are the most aggressive and condemning of simple faithful believers, which speaks more about the error of their hearts and position than anything else. Our core is loving from the heart. Anything that loses that, is not of the Lord.

Titus 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Scripture agrees with you. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Enow]

You sound immature. Can you not distinguish the inconvenience and frivolity of laughter, in general?
Who laughed in the Bible as a therapeutic measure, or for absolutely no reason? No one!
Sarah laughed at the marvelous thing that God did. It was miraculous and grounds for an extreme sentiment. It wasn't laughter, as we know giddiness and silliness to be, but shaking of one's head in disbelief of God's kindness and greatness (laughter is not the best understanding of what she meant)

I believe he was judging that laughter but that it was not the only issue. How they lived in unrepentant sinful lifestyle while all of this is being promoted is to be judged as well.

 

[Enow]

I knew Benny Hinn here in Tampa some 35 or 40 years ago — before all this fame went to his head and he seemed to go nuts — I am curious to check out what it is people are saying he has now renounced. He was actually quite a sane person in those days.

Well, when you find out, feel free to share, brother.

 

[Willie T]

Well, when you find out, feel free to share, brother.

This seems to sum it up. This sounds more like the rational person he used to be. I guess time will tell if he keeps on begging for people to send him money.

 

[Enow]

After you Enow, let's see if your patience and gentleness will convince these people of what darkness that they are endorsing.

Not my patience nor gentleness; but His fruits of the Spirit in me.

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. 24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. 25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. 26 Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:... 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

It is easy to get mad at those astray. I'm no superman. I need His help just as much as you do, brother. Paul reminds us to walk in love and not bite & devour one another and so you may find yourself reminding me when I lose sight of Him in any discussion when I start attacking the poster. Course I am trusting Him as my Good Shepherd to definitely do it, but He can use others too to confirm His word to me to let go of the anger.

I can get that way when I think of them leading others astray, but then He reminds me that His sheep will follow His voice and not a stranger's voice and so He helps me to rest in His sovereignty while I trust Him to take me Home when He comes as the Bridegroom regardless of what I am in the middle of doing in serving Him.

I feel that they should know better, and that there is a time for austerity and rebuke. For, who can possibly watch those videos and claim that these people are manifesting the power and wisdom of God?
It's offensive, and people should know better.

I would think so too, but Jesus has prayed to the Father to forgive them for they know not what they do, yet some of those people plotted His death.

When believers are not rooted in His words to use the meat of His words to discern good and evil, then when phenomenon comes, they fall away from the faith to give heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils to such a point that they do not care what the scripture says in reproving the works of darkness. When believers have been denouncing the KJV, and saying not all Bibles say the same thing, they come to rely on experience more than anything and they wind up falling for everything rather than stand on the Word of God. That is what the get for not heeding His words.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. 24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.

So if a person is ignorant, pointing out his or her ignorance doesn't really help them nor convince them until God does by His words for them to see their ignorance in order for them to repent.

It's like believing tongues are for private use; even though it sounds like the tongues before Pentecost, they cannot discern that as not of Him because it feels good and makes them feel closer to God that way; especially when they got that tongue by what they assume was the Holy Spirit coming over them apart from salvation moment in their lives. Then others see that and then believe the lie that they can receive the Holy Spirit again to get that tongue and then it happens. Not knowing scripture of 1 John 4:1-6 that would reprove the phenomenon & that tongue as not of Him, they wind up being susceptible to other receiving of spirits after other sensational signs in the flesh in confusion which God is not the author of. It seems so common sense to us but in truth, we have the Lord Jesus Christ to thank for that because of us knowing the truth in His words.

1 Corinthians 3:1And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. 2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.

Hebrews 5:11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing. 12 For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat. 13 For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe. 14 But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

1 Corinthians 3:5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man? 6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. 7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.

So we can only hope in Him to keep us from walking in our flesh but in the Spirit when we are relying on God to cause the increase.

 

[FollowHim]

You sound immature. Can you not distinguish the inconvenience and frivolity of laughter, in general?
Who laughed in the Bible as a therapeutic measure, or for absolutely no reason? No one!
Sarah laughed at the marvelous thing that God did. It was miraculous and grounds for an extreme sentiment. It wasn't laughter, as we know giddiness and silliness to be, but shaking of one's head in disbelief of God's kindness and greatness (laughter is not the best understanding of what she meant)

"Be still and know that I am God" Psalm 46:10

I just love this, Amen, Praise the Lord.
I would call this exercising faith and knowing God in every situation.

25 About midnight Paul and Silas were praying and singing hymns to God, and the other prisoners were listening to them.
Acts 16:25

That is spiritual maturity, facing death while praying and praising God, Amen.

 

[Mike Waters]

Clarification is needed. Are you supporting Benny Hinn by saying you cannot make war with him or are you exposing what Benny Hinn is into as not of the Lord at all?

John 19:22