Taken
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I meant the opposite (must have had a brain frt).
I meant to say that you believe it is merely a parable to your own peril.
Ok.
But Why do you say that IS not a parable?
Glory to God,
Taken
Edward Fudge: Hero Or Heretic?
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Ok.
But Why do you say that IS not a parable?
Glory to God,
Taken
Taken
Well-Known Member
So break it down...
Body is dead? Yes?
Body is where?
Soul is experiencing the conscious torment in lake of Fire?
And the non- born Again spirit is Where?
Thanks,
Taken
To counteract the teaching that it is one.
Those who are cast into the lake of fire, will be cast in bodily; their spirit and soul dwelling in their bodies.
Well that is TOTALLY FALSE and I did not expect false doctrine from your corner. Just goes so show how insidious Satan's lies can be.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
First and foremost, no one who is not found "written in the book of Life (Jesus)" , is going to get into heaven with immortality "some other way". The sooner one accepts that, then they will understand that the wicked dead being resurrected, back into their old flesh and blood bodies is an imposibility.
Secondly, all born again Christians have already spiritually appeared before the judgment seat of Christ, in the day they repented towards God, and accepted/received Jesus as their Savior.
This is God's judgment unto Life:
John 3[18] He that believeth on him is not condemned [judged]: but he that believeth not is condemned [judged] *already,
because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
*Note: that judgment of death, was given to Adam, of which we all inherited.
The judgment of Life, is now through Christ today, and not ever after death, for those who falsely believe in "a second chance".
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
The unsaved dead come back to life in the second resurrection after the 1000 year Millennium. Read Rev. 20. I also believe the saved Christians who were not martyred will be in the second resurrection as well. Only martyrs will reign with Christ during the Millennium.
This post isn't about judgment.
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I'm not saying they are resurrected into their bodies, I'm saying the opposite, that these are not resurrected, they remain dead. But there they are standing before God being judged, then cast into the lake of fire.
Death is not cessation of existance. But it IS seperation.
Much love!
Earburner
Well-Known Member
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Earburner
Well-Known Member
Oh, so you believe in the preconcieved idea that the unsaved wicked have been given "eternal souls".
If so, then you also believe that all animal life have been given eternal souls too.
I mean, they also have the breath of life in their nostrils too.
So the questions remain,
1. What exactly is "the breath of life"?
2. What does the word "soul" describe?
Ref. KJV (1.) Genesis 2:7; 6:17; 7:21-22 and (2.) Genesis 4:10.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
I can't see post numbers on my mobile device. Please be more helpful.
Thanks!
Prayer Warrior
Well-Known Member
So spiritually dead means dead (no spiritual life whatsoever), and physically alive mean alive. Got it.
So when a person is "spiritually dead" having no spiritual life whatsoever, and then they die the second death in the lake of fire, which burns up the physical life, that person is then Dead and Dead (twice dead), yes? They have no spiritual life and then no physical life, right? How are they in any way "alive" after being burned to ashes? Explain please.
You sound like you are able to make assumptive statements and then unable to back up those aprioric statements. I am able to do so, when I stated that Luke 16 and the Rich man and Lazarus is a parable, and you choose to not hear it out? Do I understand you correctly?
The Bible doesn't teach that they are "burned to ashes" in the lake of fire. For that is a fire that shall never be quenched...your arguments aside...and it is also made of sulfur...which merely burns (causing pain) but does not burn up the object of its fury.
Pro 19:27, Cease, my son, to hear the instruction that causeth to err from the words of knowledge.
But that the story of the rich man and Lazarus is not a parable is evident in that parables do not have the names of people in them. Allegories do...parables don't.
But even if it is a parable, what is the meaning of the parable? What does "being in torments" (Luke 16:23) mean parabolically?
Could it be the born again person who chooses to turn back into his own vomit or like Lot's wife after being saved from Sodom looks back and becomes a pillar of salt?
Brakelite
Well-Known Member
Earlier on I expressed my antipathy against the concept of eternal torment based on God's character. No-one has answered this, nor attempted to. I'm not surprised at this, because everything we know of God or have been informed of Him in His word cries out in objection and loathing to the idea that Jesus would immortalize sin by granting sinners eternal life.
The only moral defense offered for eternal torment has been that it is a deterrent to sin. Please tell us how immortalizing sin can be a deterrent against it? And while you're at it, can you explain why punishment should be the prime deterrent to sin anyway? I can think of several other things that would be a far greater deterrent to sin than the threat of punishment. Certainly the fear of punishment would never stand as grounds for repentance. I hope that isn't how you teach your own children to respect your authority.
But back to God's character. We know He is
merciful
gracious
longsuffering
abundant in goodness
and truth
just
love
compassionate
patient.
Please explain how eternal torment is a reflection of any of the above attributes of God. Please explain why God would choose to immortalize sin in His creation rather than destroy it. Please explain how a constant barrage of profanity and cursing by suffering tormented beings without end brings glory to God. Please explain how a fourteen year old child who knew not Christ and a 75 year old profane murderer can share the same eternal punishment and be just. Please explain how eternal torment is a reflection of love. Who is God loving in that context? The sinner? The redeemed? Himself? Where is compassion? Where is grace?
Please explain from the life of Jesus and His interaction with people and His selfless giving of Himself to benefit others, how this harmonizes with your understanding of His warnings against refusing His message.
For goodness sakes. For God's sake...literally. You profess to know God. You profess to desire to be changed into His character...the image of Jesus. How can you not recognize the complete discordant dichotomy between Who God is, and what you believe Him capable of doing?
It astounds me that otherwise sensible clear thinking people are so willing to defend so resolutely a concept upon which rests so flimsy evidence, and not only so, happily resort to changing the entire meaning of a word in order to justify their the position. Death...separation? Not one dictionary on the planet describes death as a separation. It goes against the rules of language...common sense...and reality. When a plant or tree dies - from what is it separated from?
And no-one has offered an explanation how anything separated from God, the only source of life, can still live. Oh, right. They are immortal. Even that is made up. A complete fabrication. The evidence for the natural immortality of the soul isn't even flimsy. It is completely non existent. Even more that that, there is scripture that states categorically the very opposite.
God is Spirit. God only hath immortality. How clearer does God need to be to convince you of this truth? The soul that sinneth, it shall die.
The only moral defense offered for eternal torment has been that it is a deterrent to sin. Please tell us how immortalizing sin can be a deterrent against it? And while you're at it, can you explain why punishment should be the prime deterrent to sin anyway? I can think of several other things that would be a far greater deterrent to sin than the threat of punishment. Certainly the fear of punishment would never stand as grounds for repentance. I hope that isn't how you teach your own children to respect your authority.
But back to God's character. We know He is
merciful
gracious
longsuffering
abundant in goodness
and truth
just
love
compassionate
patient.
Please explain how eternal torment is a reflection of any of the above attributes of God. Please explain why God would choose to immortalize sin in His creation rather than destroy it. Please explain how a constant barrage of profanity and cursing by suffering tormented beings without end brings glory to God. Please explain how a fourteen year old child who knew not Christ and a 75 year old profane murderer can share the same eternal punishment and be just. Please explain how eternal torment is a reflection of love. Who is God loving in that context? The sinner? The redeemed? Himself? Where is compassion? Where is grace?
Please explain from the life of Jesus and His interaction with people and His selfless giving of Himself to benefit others, how this harmonizes with your understanding of His warnings against refusing His message.
For goodness sakes. For God's sake...literally. You profess to know God. You profess to desire to be changed into His character...the image of Jesus. How can you not recognize the complete discordant dichotomy between Who God is, and what you believe Him capable of doing?
It astounds me that otherwise sensible clear thinking people are so willing to defend so resolutely a concept upon which rests so flimsy evidence, and not only so, happily resort to changing the entire meaning of a word in order to justify their the position. Death...separation? Not one dictionary on the planet describes death as a separation. It goes against the rules of language...common sense...and reality. When a plant or tree dies - from what is it separated from?
And no-one has offered an explanation how anything separated from God, the only source of life, can still live. Oh, right. They are immortal. Even that is made up. A complete fabrication. The evidence for the natural immortality of the soul isn't even flimsy. It is completely non existent. Even more that that, there is scripture that states categorically the very opposite.
God is Spirit. God only hath immortality. How clearer does God need to be to convince you of this truth? The soul that sinneth, it shall die.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Scroll up and look for your posts. It is about 4 of your posts back on this page.
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