Edward Fudge: Hero Or Heretic?

[Taken]

I personally believe that hell is concieved in the heart of the unredeemed, and proceeds out from the tongue. My hope is that when the time comes that all tongues cease death will be swallowed up in victory.

I believe hell is a place, downward, in the Earth, that Body's, souls, spirits can be cast down to such place.

I do not believe hell is a place conceived or born in a heart, or proceeds out from the tongue.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Waiting on him]

I believe hell is a place, downward, in the Earth, that Body's, souls, spirits can be cast down to such place.

I do not believe hell is a place conceived or born in a heart, or proceeds out from the tongue.

Glory to God,
Taken

James 3:6 KJV
[6] And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
In the parable he requested the tongue be quenched.

 

[amadeus]

so often feel crushed and realize how little I know or understand, but then there is still there ‘a miss know-it-all’ that rises up throwing out scriptures left and right saying ‘what about that’ ...it is like I can’t stop Amadeus and shut my mouth. My worst enemy being myself...

It is the nature of the beast, that is, the carnal man part of us to want absolute answers to every question now...or as soon as possible! Such a desire in itself is not evil or sin, but wanting it, or in worst case scenario even insisting that I must have it or that I do have it now, can actually hinder the work of God in us.

God gave each of us the reins to ourselves and a brain that sometimes works pretty well in us. But... those two items tend to swell people up as they realize how smart they are and that they can figure this all out for themselves. See anyone like that on this forum? I fight with a devil like that repeatedly, myself! Anyone else?

Humility is perhaps what is needed most in order to surrender to God letting Him always be first... then...?

"So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen." Matt 20:16

 

[Earburner]

The unsaved dead come back to life in the second resurrection after the 1000 year Millennium. Read Rev. 20. I also believe the saved Christians who were not martyred will be in the second resurrection as well. Only martyrs will reign with Christ during the Millennium.

This post isn't about judgment.

Oh, but that is where you are wrong! It most surely is about judgment:
1. The judgment of death through Adam
2. The judgment of Life through Christ.
John 3:18.
Could it be that your thinking has been skewed by Religion? I am going to give you alot to think about, that is contrary to many popular religious beliefs.

Are you sure that it is the unsaved dead who is being referenced here?
KJV Rev. 20[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them:
> Is that not taking place now?
Spiritually speaking, in Christ, are we not ambassadors for Christ, holding forth to the unsaved, the words of His Truth for salvation? They either accept Him or reject Him by our witness. That is judgment.

and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded
1. for the witness of Jesus,
and
2. for the word of God,
and
3. which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;
4. and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Q. Were there not Christians being beheaded, BEFORE the MoB shall be revealed?
Surely you don't think that only those who will not take the MoB, will be the only Christians beheaded, since the time of Jesus. Lets begin with John the Baptist.
Wasn't he "a witness of Jesus"?

> When did they live and reign with Christ?
A. Before His Glorious and Fiery return?
B. After His Glorious and Fiery return?
Lets see:
[5] But the rest of the dead [those Christians who were not martyrs] lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Q. When did the first resurrection take place?
A. Jesus.
Q. Who was/is the first resurrection?
A. Jesus.

Q. If you are now a "partaker of the divine nature", what are you now taking "part" in?
A. Jesus, who is "the Firstborn from the dead", aka the FIRST resurrection!!

Q. Have you been born again by His Spirit?
If not, then you are not a "partaker" in the first resurrection, aka "the divine nature", who is Jesus, and therefore Romans 8:9 applies to you.

So the questions remain, when is the 1000 years, who and what does it involve, and when is it "finished"? Is it happening now, ever since Pentecost?
Clue:
1 Peter 2[9] But ye are [present tense]
a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Rev. 1[6] And hath made us [present tense] kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Q. So, what do "priests unto God" do?
A. They serve God, in the work/act of reconciliation!
Q. Are we not now doing that work of reconciliation (judgment) now, everytime we bare witness about Jesus, with those who are unsaved?
Yes! We are!

Could it be that a thousand years is meant to be understood as being figuratively, and not literally? Maybe one day to God, really "is as a thousand years"!
Therefore, could it be, that a 1000 years is symbolic, and is only pointing to God's Age of Grace, and not anything else?

When will God's Age of Grace end?
Correct- you do not know, and neither does Jesus! Only the Father knows. He has set no time limit on the length of time for His Grace to us. It could end now in this year of 2020 and/or in another 500-1000 years after that. Only the Father knows.
However, Jesus did give us a clue, of what it will be, that shall cause the Father to send His Son for His Saints. Luke 18:8

Yes, as you probably guessed by now, I am
of the Amillennial view.

 

[bbyrd009]

A god is born?

?

Yeah, that's just a tad weird @Giuliano but I guess it's hyperbole or something, huh?

i dunno, I said "you are elohim"

 

[bbyrd009]

The rich man and Lazarus is not a parable.

And you say the opposite.

Well, there is the possibility that I am right and you are wrong.

Are you going to bank your eternity on your being right about this issue?

How much better to accept the doctrine of eternal torments as a deterrent concerning sin in your life?

he who digs a pit for others to fall into...

 

[Brakelite]

Those who are avocating eternal torment are so sure. So determined to put God in that particular box. I so sincerely hope that you all are seriously considering who this God is you are painting. This is God you are talking about here. Yeah, I know He doesn't need me to defend Him. But I'm sorry, the picture you are painting here is obscene. It's ugly. It's an extremely poor caricature of the biblical God, and I don't think many of you have seriously considered the ramifications. Because this is a very serious issue. The god you are painting is the same one you pray to each day asking him to change you into his image. Is that really what you want? To become like a universal supreme commander who takes joy in torture? Is that the god you want to be like? A Divine Hitler? Stalin? Do you really believe your interpretation of the scriptures are so correct and so perfect you are willing to continue to believe eternal torment was the very best plan God could come up with to deal with the sin problem? Make it permanent????

 

[BarneyFife]

i dunno, I said "you are elohim"

lol lol

 

[BarneyFife]

Those who are avocating eternal torment are so sure. So determined to put God in that particular box. I so sincerely hope that you all are seriously considering who this God is you are painting. This is God you are talking about here. Yeah, I know He doesn't need me to defend Him. But I'm sorry, the picture you are painting here is obscene. It's ugly. It's an extremely poor caricature of the biblical God, and I don't think many of you have seriously considered the ramifications. Because this is a very serious issue. The god you are painting is the same one you pray to each day asking him to change you into his image. Is that really what you want? To become like a universal supreme commander who takes joy in torture? Is that the god you want to be like? A Divine Hitler? Stalin? Do you really believe your interpretation of the scriptures are so correct and so perfect you are willing to continue to believe eternal torment was the very best plan God could come up with to deal with the sin problem? Make it permanent????

And, again, Amen. The doctrine of eternal torment has very likely been more responsible for the furtherance of Atheistic philosophy than all other false doctrines combined. At the risk of sounding like the Pharisee in the parable, I'm glad I swore it off 30 years ago.

 

[ChristisGod]

And, again, Amen. The doctrine of eternal torment has very likely been more responsible for the furtherance of Atheistic philosophy than all other false doctrines combined. At the risk of sounding like the Pharisee in the parable, I'm glad I swore it off 30 years ago.

I'm sorry but I don't measure Gods truth by what an atheist thinks that is ABSURD. They are God haters read Romans 1 who believe the LIE.

The things of God are foolishness to them.

 

[BarneyFife]

UPDATE: I found the movie on Youtube:
(I've saw it when it was new 8 years ago.
It's a good watch. It won secular awards.)

 

[BarneyFife]

I'm sorry but I don't measure Gods truth by what an atheist thinks that is ABSURD. They are God haters read Romans 1 who believe the LIE.

The things of God are foolishness to them.

Nice straw man. Neither do I.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I do not believe hell is a place conceived or born in a heart, or proceeds out from the tongue.

Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

?

 

[CharismaticLady]

[5] But the rest of the dead [those Christians who were not martyrs] lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Don't forget that those people you think are all Christians, how is it then that the ones whose names are NOT in the Book of Life get thrown in the lake of fire?

So, think again.

 

[Taken]

James 3:6 KJV
[6] And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.
In the parable he requested the tongue be quenched.

Fire OF Hell, not that it IS hell.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Enoch111]

It is a deeper study than which you have delved into....VOID of your KNOW it all sarcasm and accusations the Truth is Revealed in Scripture should you want to see it.

Everything you have said here is nonsense. If you want to discuss Scripture let's see you REFUTE what is already there regarding the Lake of Fire. Take each and every passage and try to refute it based on other passages. Therefore you have two options: (1) call God and Christ liars or (2) repent of your false interpretations.

 

[Taken]

Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

?

What does that have to do with Hell?

 

[Taken]

Everything you have said here is nonsense. If you want to discuss Scripture let's see you REFUTE what is already there regarding the Lake of Fire. Take each and every passage and try to refute it based on other passages. Therefore you have two options: (1) call God and Christ liars or (2) repent of your false interpretations.

My options are not limited by you.
I went back to my study notes.

Your position (according to my understanding is) all unsaved men will be Tormented Forever in the lake of Fire.
(And you can put into your own words how you want to clarify what you believe).
I was speaking In opposition...excepting men from eternal torment...
And will now clarify my position with...(something I had omitted).

The Same - devil, beast, false prophet Shall be put in the lake of Fire and Tormented Forever.

Some unsaved men (Body and soul), Shall have all LIFE removed from their body and soul and put into the Lake of Fire.. and Destroyed.

Some unsaved men, Shall be put into the Lake of fire, and BE Tormented Forever.

So it is not Either or (Destroyed or Tormented Forever) for all unsaved souls...it is one or the other depending on the Individual unsaved man.

So if your position is eternal torment is applicable to All unsaved men, I disagree with you.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[Earburner]

I believe hell is a place, downward, in the Earth, that Body's, souls, spirits can be cast down to such place.

I do not believe hell is a place conceived or born in a heart, or proceeds out from the tongue.

Glory to God,
Taken

Here is a clue of what "soul" is:
Genesis 4[10] And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.[11] And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
I have more scriptures to share, and can expound on it effectively, but it is extremely contrary to how most all are taught by "church-ianity", as to what they think "soul" is.

 

[BarneyFife]

Here is a clue of what "soul" is:
Genesis 4[10] And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.[11] And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
I have more scriptures to share, and can expound on it effectively, but it is extremely contrary to how most all are taught by "church-ianity", as to what they think "soul" is.

We're anxious to see what you have to share.