All the fulness of Deity dwells in Him Bodily !

[ChristisGod]

Holy Carp Batman .. lack of knowledge of one passage in the Bible now qualifies as proving that someone does not know Jesus ?

Sounds very legalistic to me .. Is from Paul you are getting this legalism ? .. and what is this gibberish about this one vague passage from Paul Paul that you desperately want to cling to and relate to the Joel passage when all use of the term Lord .. referred not to Jesus .. because Jesus didn't exist .. so Joel cannot support Pauls claim . because in Joel it is YHWH ...

but when we go to Paul -- 13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved. OK .. the Lord is Jesus .. but Just because you use the epithet Mr ... doesn't mean its the same person ... no serious Biblical Scholar or Theologian would make such a claim... it is .. sorry - not laughable - but lets say "problematic" in serious circles. No .. In Pauls Gospels .. Jesus - the man he never met .. is referred to as Lord .. as is Jesus in th erest of the NT..

So your argument boils down to .... they Call Jesus Sir in the NT .. and YHWH Sir in the OT ... .. with EL above both .. the Most High - but yet another Sir .. and that makes them all the same

OK ... you go with that :) Jesus is Lord ..but not YHWH .. but YHWH is Lord and not Jesus ..

But this gets me thinking ... I am wondering if El was ever referred to as Lord .. The other Sons of El - Lord Baal for example - was referred to as Lord - but can't say for sure that this one one of El's epithets.

Good question to try to answer.

Notice the RED in bold below even a child can connect the dots and understand its the same Lord in Joel and Romans


Joel 2:32
32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Will be delivered;
For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem
There will be those who escape,
As the Lord has said,
Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.

Here we see Paul quote this OT passage about YHWH and apply it to Jesus who is the one and only Lord according to the N.T.

Rom 10:9-13
9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

 

[DNB]

correct

The Word was God John 1:1
Thomas said to Jesus : my Lord and my God John 20:28
Paul and Peter call Jesus their God and Savior Titus 2:13 and 2 Peter 1:1
John calls Him the True God and Eternal Life in 1 John 5:20
Hebrews call Him our God and Creator YHWH Hebrews 1:8-10

Once God, always God.

Jesus has been raised and exalted to a position adjacent to the one and only God, the Father. It is for this reason that all the praise and appellations that have been ascribed to him, have such a majestic and supreme connotation. But, every context that you quoted, emphatically distinguishes God from Jesus, also defining how it was God the father who exalted and ordained Christ to be in the position where he currently resides.
If by chance, there are expressions that have created an ambiguity between the exalter, and the exalted, these are the exceptions, and no competent exegete ever makes the exception the rule, or builds radical doctrines based on ambiguous passages.

 

[kcnalp]

Jesus has been raised and exalted to a position adjacent to the one and only God, the Father. It is for this reason that all the praise and appellations that have been ascribed to him, have such a majestic and supreme connotation. But, every context that you quoted, emphatically distinguishes God from Jesus, also defining how it was God the father who exalted and ordained Christ to be in the position where he currently resides.
If by chance, there are expressions that have created an ambiguity between the exalter, and the exalted, these are the exceptions, and no competent exegete ever makes the exception the rule, or builds radical doctrines based on ambiguous passages.

John 1 The Word was God. The Word became flesh ...
Jesus is God.

 

[ChristisGod]

John 1 The Word was God. The Word became flesh ...
Jesus is God.

notice poster did not deal with a single text but ran away from all of them

 

[FollowHim]

Sorry, you lost me. Jesus is not God, only the Father is.

Funnily this is actually what I thought would happen.
We are different because from the same words we see different things.

The truth is singular, but our perception of it is always growing and changing. I know from experience I can talk about lots of different issues, but only those which echo in the listener do they hear it.

So hard hearts do not know what Jesus meant about Mercy, mourning, purity, righteousness, being poor in spirit etc. It is because these words are window dressing, just to make things look good, what matters is power and influence, looking good, but reality is to be avoided because it just stinks.

And those who claim to be something they are not are just liars and hypocrites, just there to make others look bad and themselves look good. Now I would have previously thought this was just an idea, until I was told these exact things. Jesus warned us this would happen, because sinners live in the dark and can only see what is in them, which of course is exactly the same as everyone else.

God bless you

 

[justbyfaith]

Not good enough for such an outlandish and implausible claim. Don't be reckless with God's Word.

All the fulness of Deity dwells in Him Bodily !

 

[Heyzeus]

Paul quotes Joel 2:32 whoever calls upon the name of YHWH(LORD) will be saved in Romans 10:13 who is Jesus- the One Lord a person must call upon to be saved.

proving you do not know Jesus.

case closed

You are Projecting again .. It is you who has consistently demonstrated lack of understanding of Scripture - in particular the Teachings of Jesus .. which you try to run from at every turn ... first to John .. and when this fails you . you run to Paul .. and when again you fail .. you start name calling and spewing unsupported and false accusations .. in a desperate attempt to "demonize the Other" .... as you were taught to do in Sunday School.

Now that we have that out of the way .. did you have anything of substance you would like to discuss.. your claims with respect to the use of the term Lord throughout the OT and NT has been proven false - and made no sense .. specially claiming that this was what the OT folks meant. One could plausibly argue - albeit would have to be far fetched .. but you could make a case ...... but no one in their right pajamas would claim that the Ancient Israelite's thought that the term Lord .. referred to Jesus .. his is right out of the turnip farm... sorry .. but.. Turns out it is you who doesn't now scripture .. again . and again .. and again .. but I keep trying...

So Lesson 1. Who is this El fellow ? and why is he so Prominent .. and in such a High position .. ?

 

[kcnalp]

Isaiah 48:12-17 (NKJV)
12 "Listen to Me, O Jacob, And Israel, My called: I am He, I am the First, I am also the Last.
13 Indeed My hand has laid the foundation of the earth, And My right hand has stretched out the heavens; When I call to them, They stand up together. ...
16 "Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord GOD and His Spirit Have sent Me."
17 Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, The Holy One of Israel: "I am the LORD your God, Who teaches you to profit, Who leads you by the way you should go.

Amen Jesus!!! You are the First and the Last, "the LORD your God"!

 

[Heyzeus]

Notice the RED in bold below even a child can connect the dots and understand its the same Lord in Joel and Romans.

No actually .. it would be difficult for a child .. but .. as stated .. for Paul to mean such a thing one could argue.

What is straight off the Turnip farm however would be to argue that the Ancient Israelite's - the folks writing OT scripture .. did not think the term Lord meant Jesus.

You did a non sequitur .. "does not follow" fallacy. Perhaps that's what Paul meant .. Biblical Scholarship highly doubts it .. as to Serious Theologians .. but its possible.

No one in their right flower garden would claim that the ancient Israelite's knew Jesus ... this is just absurd.

 

[Heyzeus]

The Father gave to His Son the name that is above every name (Philippians 2:9-11).

Cool . so Jesus is above every other name ... Let me try on the Latin Version of that .. I can dig it :)

So what about this El fellow . who is this guy ... ? the "Most High" .. the Supreme one .. of the Council of El ? The court in which these idols/angels and demons were tried.

 

[DNB]

Funnily this is actually what I thought would happen.
We are different because from the same words we see different things.

The truth is singular, but our perception of it is always growing and changing. I know from experience I can talk about lots of different issues, but only those which echo in the listener do they hear it.

So hard hearts do not know what Jesus meant about Mercy, mourning, purity, righteousness, being poor in spirit etc. It is because these words are window dressing, just to make things look good, what matters is power and influence, looking good, but reality is to be avoided because it just stinks.

And those who claim to be something they are not are just liars and hypocrites, just there to make others look bad and themselves look good. Now I would have previously thought this was just an idea, until I was told these exact things. Jesus warned us this would happen, because sinners live in the dark and can only see what is in them, which of course is exactly the same as everyone else.

God bless you

You're doing it again. This is a thread on the ridiculous notion of the alleged deity of Christ, the god-man. What you are expressing lately has nothing to do with the subject at hand. Jesus was a creature, and still is.

 

[justbyfaith]

You are Projecting again .. It is you who has consistently demonstrated lack of understanding of Scripture

@Christophany actually has quite a good knowledge of what scripture teaches by my estimation...

Whereas you seem to be in denial of basic scriptural truths.

 

[justbyfaith]

You're doing it again. This is a thread on the ridiculous notion of the alleged deity of Christ, the god-man. What you are expressing lately has nothing to do with the subject at hand. Jesus was a creature, and still is.

How do you explain the fact that "He is before all things, and in Him all things consist"? (Colossians 1:17)

 

[Heyzeus]

notice poster did not deal with a single text but ran away from all of them

I have dealt with everything of significance .. .. any fool can post blithering amounts of incessant blather .. that doesn't mean I will address it all.

I dealt specifically with your ridiculous claim . that the folks writing the OT - thought that "Lord" .. referred to Jesus .. granted that with Pauline scripture it is possible .. which deals with all the pauline scripture you posted.

It is you who consistently Runs from Scripture .. So who is this El fellow we keep hearing about in the Bible ?

 

[justbyfaith]

No one in their right flower garden would claim that the ancient Israelite's knew Jesus ... this is just absurd.

Except that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament. So if they knew Him, they knew Him.

 

[Heyzeus]

@Christophany actually has quite a good knowledge of what scripture teaches by my estimation...

Whereas you seem to be in denial of basic scriptural truths.

I havn't seen it .. but I'm sure he appreciates your support... I am not the one running around claiming "You don't now Jesus" though .. now am I ...

and but you two .. have not scored well on some of the tests. In any case..

The current topic you are running from .. as you did from all the others .. is who this El Fellow is .. what do we know about him from the Bible ?

 

[justbyfaith]

There is one Lord in holy scripture (Ephesians 4:5, Mark 12:29) and that Lord is the Father (Matthew 11:25, Luke 10:21). Yet, no one can say that Jesus is the Lord except by the Holy Ghost (1 Corinthians 12:3 (kjv)), even the Spirit of truth.

And Jesus is the Lord (1 Corinthians 8:6).

So if Jesus and the Father are not the same Person, that is two Lords; a concept that is denied by holy scripture (Ephesians 4:5, Mark 12:29, 1 Corinthians 8:6).

Therefore the one Lord is Jesus, even the Father.

 

[Heyzeus]

Except that Jesus is the God of the Old Testament. So if they knew Him, they knew Him.

They did not know a God by that name .. ... you on the other hand are making a circular argument ...

But anyway .. who was this El Fellow ? You go around criticizing others for their lack of knowledge of Scripture .. but you seem a bit lacking in in that you don't seem to know who this El Fellow is.

 

[justbyfaith]

I havn't seen it .. but I'm sure he appreciates your support... I am not the one running around claiming "You don't now Jesus" though .. now am I ...

and but you two .. have not scored well on some of the tests. In any case..

The current topic you are running from .. as you did from all the others .. is who this El Fellow is .. what do we know about him from the Bible ?

Why don't you give some teaching from the holy scriptures on the subject?

 

[DNB]

How do you explain the fact that "He is before all things, and in Him all things consist"? (Colossians 1:17)

God ordained him as the first-born of all creation, ...not Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses or David, ....