The Eu And World Socialism

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veteran

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In the 1970's there was a well documented work written from historical documents in western Europe called 'Conspiracy Against God and Man' (I cannot recall its author, but it should be easy to find).

This work is important because it continues documentation of the Bavarian Illuminati subversive influence upon later European history, after it was discovered and banned by the governments of Europe in the late 1700's. Adam Weishaupt, the founder of the Bavarian Illuminati, had said that if his order and its aims to overthrow the governments of Europe and Christianity was ever discovered, that it would then go ten times deeper into secrecy (per John Robison's work 'Proofs Of A Conspiracy' written in 1798).

In 'Conspiracy Against God and Man', it gives documentation of continuing Illuminati order influence in Europe under new names like the German Economic commission or union. It was that German Economic group that instituted the plans for a European Union to include all of Europe under a socialist type system.

What's even more revealing, is that system's link to world Communism.

An ex-KGB colonel that defected to the U.S. in the 1960's named Golitsyn covered in his 1980's work 'New Lies For Old' the Soviet long-range strategy for takeover of the West. He predicted in 1984 the Soviets would allow the Berlin Wall to come down if it was time for the start of the third phase of their long-range disinformation strategy against the West. The Berlin Wall was taken down in the '90's. Part of that long-range strategy was to create a one-socialist Europe from the Atlantic to the Ural mountains. That in essence is what the European Union is about, as it keeps expanding farther east to include many ex-Soviet bloc nations.

Ever since Marxist socialism tookover Russia in 1917, they have sought to infiltrate western society to spread its goal of world socialism. Communist political parties working within various Labor movements began springing up in western Europe that supported Communist ideology. Communism began hiding under the name Socialism. In 1938 Spain it led to a civil war against Franco's support of the royal family of Spain and the Christian Church. Many deceived Americans even participated in that war fighting for the Republican rebel Communists against Franco, including the American author Ernest Hemingway. Hemingway even wrote a fictional account of his experience in that Spanish civil war serving under the Republican Communists (For Whom The Bell Tolls, a work that is required reading in many American public schools).

When I was in 1970's Spain, the Spanish Communists were still active, though subdued much by Franco who was still in power. There were times when we of the U.S. military there were told to not wear our U.S. uniforms off the base if we lived nearby because of Communist activity. At times the Communists would turn over and burn cars they could identify as American owned in the villages surrounding the U.S. military base. And that was in the mid-1970's just after the Vietnam War had ended. I was told by friends in Spain after I returned to the U.S. that since Franco died, and the government voted in a parliamentary system of Democratic Socialism, that things had gotten worse for those allied to the Monarchy and Christian Church in Spain. These kind of Communist movements happenned all over western Europe in that era, much of it operating within political Labor parties.

When the Berlin Wall came down, it was heralded as the defeat of Communism and the Soviet system in Russia. Nothing more could be farther from the truth. It instead opened up free trade in support of Communist-Socialist countries, and gave Communism an easy way to hide and work in the primarily Christian West. It produced the strategy of forcing western nations to reduce their military strength (though I think some of our wise western leaders eventually caught on to that strategy). The Communist International's long-range strategy for takeover of all nations to create a one-world Socialist State has not changed one bit. During the Peristroka event of Gorbachev hugging President Regean in the supposed 1990's fall of Soviet Communism, he was asked if his policy towards Communist ideology had changed. He basically said not at all, that he is still as much a believer in Communism as he ever was (see Golitsyn's work 'The Peristroika Deception' of that era of the 1990's, a follow up on the long-range Soviet strategy agains the West).

One of the major idealistic changes that has come of that strategy against the Christian west, is how many professed Christians have joined with the ideas of world Socialism as a modern movement for equal rights. Communism is dead, many of them will say. Yet the fruits of Communist ideology is more alive in the West today than it has ever been.

A Communist strategy Golitsyn also mentioned in his work New Lies For Old is the influence of Christian leaders that attend world religious summits in Moscow (last one mentioned in the news media was in 1993, that I know of). Golitsyn revealed those religious summits were actually about propaganda upon Christian leaders to go back to their Churches in the West and preach disarmament and pacification. That was to influence western popular opinion towards disarmament since the Berlin Wall was allowed to be taken down. And it worked, as western leaders began doing just that, and still are doing that today.

The Communist strategy for world takeover is not anywhere near dead. It is very much alive today and is only hiding in the West under new names, like Socialism. And one of huge problems with that is how many influential American families have sided with socialist idealism without being direct members of the Communist Party USA (CPUSA). Yet some influential leaders like Alger Hiss and Whitaker Chambers, etc., working within our U.S. State Department have been discovered as Soviet spies.

The 'mask' of Socialism today is actually a hiden mask for world Communism, regardless of those who see socialist ideology as an alternate democratic type of political thought beneficial to the peoples. It will be too late when many taking a ride on that system finally discover what movement they've taken part in, i.e., the world communist movement. World Communism has always sought influence by peaceful means through propaganda first, even while another one of its hands has been forceably subversive and militaristic in using whatever means necessary to achieve its goals. The Christian West has been on the defensive ever since the world Communist movement began, which per documentation of the old Bavarian Illuminati influence in the later EU system, reveals today that defense has been greatly weakened by long-range Communist strategy.

The journalist Jerome Corsi obtained information through the Freedom of Information Act about a strategic working behind the scenes within our U.S. government to create a globalist union of the U.S., Canada, and Mexico. Corsi outlined the various U.S. departments already assigned to implement that strategy, and many of the names assigned to those departments (you can find the info on Worldnetdaily news where many of Corsi's articles are published). That in essence means an American Union like the pattern of the EU. The EU began with 12-15 member nations, and has increased to many more. That suggests a North American Union would eventually include states other than just the U.S., Canada, and Mexico. Under such a system it would mean the dismanteling of our U.S. Constitiion and the end of our U.S. Constituional Republic. It would change our rights as U.S. citizens under protection of our U.S. Constitution. Do you now understand why today's present U.S. federal administration would be against Arizona's passing of state legislation to protect itself per the U.S. Constitution against illegal immigration?

It's time to wake up for what's coming brethren. Canada and the EU already has laws against preaching certain ideas directly from The Bible, and has already violated rights of Christians there, as that has already begun in the U.S. also. The main obstruction Communists face in the U.S. today is our U.S. Constitution. So as an American citizen and Christian, whether you intend to stand up in support of our U.S. Constitution, you should at least be aware of the Communist strategy that is taking over our country and trying to end our Constitution.
 

aspen

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Conspiracy theories serve a strange purpose - they provide a sense of order to random chaos. We would rather invent a boggie man to blame, rather face the unknown. I think today's conspiracy theories are yesterdays fairytales about trolls under the bridge or werewolves and vampires.

My Grandmother is totally into conspiracy theories - it help her feel safe because she has someone to blame for all the evil in the world. In her case, the world will be ending soon - she is 91 - it 10 times better for her to have some conspiracy to hang onto rather than think about her own death - it is also comforting to know that the world may end before she dies or that her end will be shared by everyones end. She also has a purpose - to spread the word to everyone about the illuminating and the [font="arial][size="2"]The Bilderberg Group, and the King Charles is the beast theory.[/size][/font]

Here is the question I ask her: "Even if all the conspiracies are true, what are we supposed to do about it? If they are really that powerful and we know that Revelation has to happen for Christ to return - what are we supposed to doing differently? She usually responds by backing away from her strong opinions - "I just think it is interesting", she tells me.
 

lawrance

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I have only just read this thanks veteran.

aspen that is typical you think all you have to do is just sit back and all will be taken care of ( head in the sand stuff.) sure it will fail and God will win but are you forgetting that all the people will go through a very painful time as in no time before it.
There will be no love for the people who let it all happen, knowing full well of the predicament that people will go through.
Your Mothers generation knew that they had to struggle for victory sorry to say now our gen is no so.

Why don't people comprehend the mistakes of the past as it's plain to me the horrors of what this type of stuff has caused to the people under it.
I suppose when or if they see the storeys told by the people who endured through the madness that these people hide their eyes from it.
Even the people who were in the position of torturing people were afraid.
All this socialism sounds good in the beginning as it's a wonderful dream but it will become a nightmare in reality because it rejects God and it's just a lie and farther of all lies is behind it all.
 

aspen

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I have only just read this thanks veteran.

aspen that is typical you think all you have to do is just sit back and all will be taken care of ( head in the sand stuff.) sure it will fail and God will win but are you forgetting that all the people will go through a very painful time as in no time before it.
There will be no love for the people who let it all happen, knowing full well of the predicament that people will go through.
Your Mothers generation knew that they had to struggle for victory sorry to say now our gen is no so.

Why don't people comprehend the mistakes of the past as it's plain to me the horrors of what this type of stuff has caused to the people under it.
I suppose when or if they see the storeys told by the people who endured through the madness that these people hide their eyes from it.
Even the people who were in the position of torturing people were afraid.
All this socialism sounds good in the beginning as it's a wonderful dream but it will become a nightmare in reality because it rejects God and it's just a lie and farther of all lies is behind it all.

When was Socialism ever tyrannical?
 

Tullius

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When was Socialism ever tyrannical?

Socialism has lost its value as a word since it is so deluted. The perfect example of this is my Country of Norway.

Many people claim Norway to be a socialist state because of the one party labor state for 40 years and the strong even overwhelming welfare state. But its important to remember that the Norwegian classical socialists, that "built the country" at least layed the welfare and infrastructure and geopolitical foundation were all anti communist, they hated communism and loved NATO, Capitalism combined with welfare. Norway combines welfare with a strong private sector of free enterprise, the notion of private property is very strong in Norway and people are not individually collective at all. For example Norway citizen gives some of the least amount of personal donations to charity in the industrailized world, and Norway also has over 40% strong tax revolt parties that help keep a balance of sustainable free enterprise stong welfare state, so that we dont go into deficit spending. Besides Statoil the national enterprise is driven like a private company and not controlled by politicians.

An example of a Socialist state that is tyrannical would be Hungary, after the Communists retreated and the Socialist took over people were overtaxed, the state nationalized private property and then sold it off to outside investors for their own personal gain, the central bank is beyond parliament control and is totally controlled by the socialist party which used inflation to gain wealth to the upper elite of society. The Hungarian were before Fidesz took over living under oppression by a democratically elected government for eigth years where they had no freedom and no rights. So there are examples of tyrannical socialist states, though this discussion if dragged on I fear will degenerate into semantics.


I think its too big a stretch to say that Communism is controlled by the illuminati, and like the sources of "John Robison's work 'Proofs Of A Conspiracy' written in 1798" is very very dubious, it reminds me of the "Elder Protocols of Zion" or whatever they were called. They have no real scientific foundation. For example the quotes from Rockefeller, JP Morgan and the other elites where they supposedly say that they are planning to take over the world and nothing can stop them have no real source and is fear mongering.

When it comes to the EU it was the United States that created the EU, it would never have survived if it hadnt been for the marshall plan and the permament presence of strong US Military divisions in Europe. The fact that the EU is socalists today is a reflection of European society which is majority Socialist, but this is changing as the combination of massiv unsustainable immigration and culture clash with too much taxation and regulation which is strangling the individual citizens is breeding a new reactionary movement of both moderate right wing capitalist and the more extreme radical right wing nationalist movements. If the United States were too pull out of EU it would break apart very quickly.

Communism is dead today, the entire notion of 100% state controlled collective society is discredited, but the Environmentalist Movement is the new totalitarian party, and until they actually take control, rule for decades with genocide and economic ruin and finally gets defeated by their own abominations of regulation it will be the future of Europe unless the reactionary right wing movements win.

There are many individual organizations and even cabals of organizations dedicated to destruction of the Church and implement totalitarian ideologies, but to try and draw a red line from a german cult to all the organizations today, I would agree with Aspen is trying to find solace in order from chaos even if that order is the worst kind of evil.

But the other extreme of saying that conspiracy theories are junk is equally unintelligent and unscientific as the very definition of a conspiracy describes a real life event that happens everyday from the individual level to the state level.
 

HammerStone

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Tullius, your post is interesting and it's interesting to see a non-American perspective on the matter.

I think conspiracy theories are a comfortable way to explain things. I've mentioned this in other threads, and I will continue to do so, but I don't buy into a single over-arching conspiracy of elite. Instead, I go back to the verse in the Bible at I Corinthians 14:33 - we know God is not the author of confusion.

While I don't follow everything he says, I think the best person to explain this is Glen Beck. We have the paradigm of right and left, but there are other ways to characterize the matter. More government and less government, more social programs and less social programs, etc. These schools of thought all vie for followers and adherence, but the reality is not that they are some smart conspiracy, but more like the dumb (as in lifeless) conspiracies.

For instance, the Conservative movement was originally for conserving a King. Do we endure in that thought process? Heck no, I'm a Conservative and I don't.

Returning to the matter at hand, we have to see that all indeed fall short and the problem is not the government or this or that. It's people. It's exactly why we needed Jesus to redeem each and every one of us. The heart and soul of politics for the Christian should be to expose the minds to Jesus and let God do the rest. Our modern problem is that we, like many others to include atheist progressives and so forth, try to control a system. That's too far downstream. The Founder's here in America understood that the heart of the ruler is what makes or breaks the system. Don't get me wrong in saying that they did their best to come up with the "perfect" system, but things like the principle of Judicial review and the Judiciary itself stymied their attempts. (Something progressives woke up to about 50-60 years ago or more.)

A Godly monarch is a good ruler (see David). A Godly leader (see some of the early American Presidents) is a good ruler. A Godly Prime Minister of Norway is a good ruler.

I just happen to think our battles as Christians are being fought in all the wrong places. We are to seek first the kingdom. Mathew 6:33.
 

aspen

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Socialism has lost its value as a word since it is so deluted. The perfect example of this is my Country of Norway.

Many people claim Norway to be a socialist state because of the one party labor state for 40 years and the strong even overwhelming welfare state. But its important to remember that the Norwegian classical socialists, that "built the country" at least layed the welfare and infrastructure and geopolitical foundation were all anti communist, they hated communism and loved NATO, Capitalism combined with welfare. Norway combines welfare with a strong private sector of free enterprise, the notion of private property is very strong in Norway and people are not individually collective at all. For example Norway citizen gives some of the least amount of personal donations to charity in the industrailized world, and Norway also has over 40% strong tax revolt parties that help keep a balance of sustainable free enterprise stong welfare state, so that we dont go into deficit spending. Besides Statoil the national enterprise is driven like a private company and not controlled by politicians.

An example of a Socialist state that is tyrannical would be Hungary, after the Communists retreated and the Socialist took over people were overtaxed, the state nationalized private property and then sold it off to outside investors for their own personal gain, the central bank is beyond parliament control and is totally controlled by the socialist party which used inflation to gain wealth to the upper elite of society. The Hungarian were before Fidesz took over living under oppression by a democratically elected government for eigth years where they had no freedom and no rights. So there are examples of tyrannical socialist states, though this discussion if dragged on I fear will degenerate into semantics.


I think its too big a stretch to say that Communism is controlled by the illuminati, and like the sources of "John Robison's work 'Proofs Of A Conspiracy' written in 1798" is very very dubious, it reminds me of the "Elder Protocols of Zion" or whatever they were called. They have no real scientific foundation. For example the quotes from Rockefeller, JP Morgan and the other elites where they supposedly say that they are planning to take over the world and nothing can stop them have no real source and is fear mongering.

When it comes to the EU it was the United States that created the EU, it would never have survived if it hadnt been for the marshall plan and the permament presence of strong US Military divisions in Europe. The fact that the EU is socalists today is a reflection of European society which is majority Socialist, but this is changing as the combination of massiv unsustainable immigration and culture clash with too much taxation and regulation which is strangling the individual citizens is breeding a new reactionary movement of both moderate right wing capitalist and the more extreme radical right wing nationalist movements. If the United States were too pull out of EU it would break apart very quickly.

Communism is dead today, the entire notion of 100% state controlled collective society is discredited, but the Environmentalist Movement is the new totalitarian party, and until they actually take control, rule for decades with genocide and economic ruin and finally gets defeated by their own abominations of regulation it will be the future of Europe unless the reactionary right wing movements win.

There are many individual organizations and even cabals of organizations dedicated to destruction of the Church and implement totalitarian ideologies, but to try and draw a red line from a german cult to all the organizations today, I would agree with Aspen is trying to find solace in order from chaos even if that order is the worst kind of evil.

But the other extreme of saying that conspiracy theories are junk is equally unintelligent and unscientific as the very definition of a conspiracy describes a real life event that happens everyday from the individual level to the state level.

I appreciate your post and I agree with you on many of your points. As one of the people who has rejected conspiracy theories, outright; I see your point about being less extreme, although grudgingly. I should include that I do see the possibility for wide scale corruption and small, competing conspiracy theories - it is the overarching, one world government conspiracy that I reject.
 

veteran

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I enjoyed what you wrote Tullius, but these other parts are not difficult to prove you wrong...

I think its too big a stretch to say that Communism is controlled by the illuminati, and like the sources of "John Robison's work 'Proofs Of A Conspiracy' written in 1798" is very very dubious, it reminds me of the "Elder Protocols of Zion" or whatever they were called. They have no real scientific foundation. For example the quotes from Rockefeller, JP Morgan and the other elites where they supposedly say that they are planning to take over the world and nothing can stop them have no real source and is fear mongering.

The 1798 work Proofs Of A Conspiracy by John Robison is not a dubious work. Robison was a naturalist, a respected British scientist in his day. He wrote that work based on REAL Illuminati order documents that the Bavrian government got off of one of Adam Weishaupt's agents. The Abbe Baruell also wrote a similar work in that same era based on those confiscated Illuminati order documents. The books by both those authors can be found on Amazon.com. The existence of the Bavarian Illuminati was a fact of European history. Someone saying it is not is in ignorance.

Within that Illuminati documentation, the idea of collectivism runs throughout it. And Collectivism was the basis of later Communist doctrine. Someone living in a socialist welfare state is probably going to show bias against anyone revealing those things. Yet, facts are facts. One can deny them, but it doesn't change the existence of those facts.



Communism is dead today, the entire notion of 100% state controlled collective society is discredited, but the Environmentalist Movement is the new totalitarian party, and until they actually take control, rule for decades with genocide and economic ruin and finally gets defeated by their own abominations of regulation it will be the future of Europe unless the reactionary right wing movements win.

No, Communism is not dead today.

http://pajamasmedia.com/zombie/2011/05/06/seiu-drops-mask-goes-full-commie/
 

veteran

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When it comes to the EU it was the United States that created the EU, it would never have survived if it hadnt been for the marshall plan and the permament presence of strong US Military divisions in Europe. The fact that the EU is socalists today is a reflection of European society which is majority Socialist, but this is changing as the combination of massiv unsustainable immigration and culture clash with too much taxation and regulation which is strangling the individual citizens is breeding a new reactionary movement of both moderate right wing capitalist and the more extreme radical right wing nationalist movements. If the United States were too pull out of EU it would break apart very quickly.

Communism is dead today, the entire notion of 100% state controlled collective society is discredited, but the Environmentalist Movement is the new totalitarian party, and until they actually take control, rule for decades with genocide and economic ruin and finally gets defeated by their own abominations of regulation it will be the future of Europe unless the reactionary right wing movements win.

Most of that sounds like disinformation directly from the Communists.

The European Union (EU) was not a brainchild of the United States of America. It was a brainchild of Soviet Communism joined with European Socialists. Many of western Europe's early Socialists were associated with local labor parties that were allied with Communists. When I was in 1970's Spain with Franco still in power, they tried to come out and hold big public rallies and demonstrations to incite revolution, but weren't allowed to. That began to change after Franco died.

Spain's 1938 Civil War was a result of Communists in Spain trying to overthrow Spain's monarchy, the Church, and the government, which reveals Communist activity in western Europe has been a problem for quite a long time. Communists tried to assassinate the pope in Italy just in our generation. So to say that Communism is now dead is either to push their disinformation, or to be very ignorant of the state of things.

The ex-KGB colonel Golitsyn who defected to the U.S. back in the 1960's, revealed in his work New Lies For Old how the Communist International had planned in their 1958 long-range strategy, to join East with West by creating a newer form of Communism. They used the idea of "democratization" as a term for that new strategy which involved the plan to take the Berlin Wall down.

Their idea of "democratization" of Communist Europe involves Communism joining with Capitalism so East can meet West. THAT is a new strategy Communism was not traditionally known for prior to the Berlin Wall coming down. But it was part of their 1958 long-range strategy per Golitsyn. It's been on their books for quite a while. This is why the Communist Party concentrates on usage of the terms like "democratization" and "democracy" and "democratic" more now. It is all to fool the West into thinking Communism is now dead, just so Communism can be opened up more in the West for their ultimate plans towards world socialism.

Nowhere in the U.S. founders writings can be found the idea that we were to ever become a Socialist state, and definitely not a Socialist Welfare state. But that is exactly what the United States of America has become today, because of the influence of Communism within our own nation. Yet that is the plan by Communism, not to turn the U.S. into a purely Communist state, but into a Socialist state joinable with a one-Socialist Europe, and eventually a one-world Socialist system over ALL nations, the very 'beast' system of Revelation 13:1-2.



 

Thursday

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Most of that sounds like disinformation directly from the Communists.

The European Union (EU) was not a brainchild of the United States of America. It was a brainchild of Soviet Communism joined with European Socialists. Many of western Europe's early Socialists were associated with local labor parties that were allied with Communists. When I was in 1970's Spain with Franco still in power, they tried to come out and hold big public rallies and demonstrations to incite revolution, but weren't allowed to. That began to change after Franco died.

Spain's 1938 Civil War was a result of Communists in Spain trying to overthrow Spain's monarchy, the Church, and the government, which reveals Communist activity in western Europe has been a problem for quite a long time. Communists tried to assassinate the pope in Italy just in our generation. So to say that Communism is now dead is either to push their disinformation, or to be very ignorant of the state of things.

The ex-KGB colonel Golitsyn who defected to the U.S. back in the 1960's, revealed in his work New Lies For Old how the Communist International had planned in their 1958 long-range strategy, to join East with West by creating a newer form of Communism. They used the idea of "democratization" as a term for that new strategy which involved the plan to take the Berlin Wall down.

Their idea of "democratization" of Communist Europe involves Communism joining with Capitalism so East can meet West. THAT is a new strategy Communism was not traditionally known for prior to the Berlin Wall coming down. But it was part of their 1958 long-range strategy per Golitsyn. It's been on their books for quite a while. This is why the Communist Party concentrates on usage of the terms like "democratization" and "democracy" and "democratic" more now. It is all to fool the West into thinking Communism is now dead, just so Communism can be opened up more in the West for their ultimate plans towards world socialism.

Nowhere in the U.S. founders writings can be found the idea that we were to ever become a Socialist state, and definitely not a Socialist Welfare state. But that is exactly what the United States of America has become today, because of the influence of Communism within our own nation. Yet that is the plan by Communism, not to turn the U.S. into a purely Communist state, but into a Socialist state joinable with a one-Socialist Europe, and eventually a one-world Socialist system over ALL nations, the very 'beast' system of Revelation 13:1-2.






Reading this, I wonder if it was not a bit of both. Perhaps both the US and USSR desired European unification for different ends. Where can I read further on a USSR fostered EU? I'm only familiar with the dreams of Truman, Eisenhower, and Kissinger.

The EU project definitely sticks of postmodern, post-national fabianism. That I'll give you.

 

veteran

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Reading this, I wonder if it was not a bit of both. Perhaps both the US and USSR desired European unification for different ends. Where can I read further on a USSR fostered EU? I'm only familiar with the dreams of Truman, Eisenhower, and Kissinger.

The EU project definitely sticks of postmodern, post-national fabianism. That I'll give you.


Try...

*Conspiracy Against God and Man, by Claire Kelly, Catholic priest that researched records in France of internationalist aims for Europe.
New Lies For Old, by Anatoliy Golitsyn, a 1960's ex-KGB colonel that defected to the U.S.
Tragedy And Hope, by Georgetown history professor Carrol Quigley.
The Naked Communist, by 1950's ex-FBI agent Cleon Skousen.
Foundations: Their Power and Influence, by Rene Wormser, chief counsel to the Reece Committee investigation of tax-exempt foundations (also called Cox Committee).
Proofs Of A Conspiracy, by British naturalist John Robison (1798).

I think all those works are available on Amazon.com. They are all hard reads, especially for someone not interested much in history. Those sources are not from conspiracy freaks. They're serious works, and basically point to prophecy from God's Word about the final world beast kingdom of Rev.13 that is now upon us.

 

revturmoil

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I have only just read this thanks veteran.

aspen that is typical you think all you have to do is just sit back and all will be taken care of ( head in the sand stuff.) sure it will fail and God will win but are you forgetting that all the people will go through a very painful time as in no time before it.
There will be no love for the people who let it all happen, knowing full well of the predicament that people will go through.
Your Mothers generation knew that they had to struggle for victory sorry to say now our gen is no so.

Why don't people comprehend the mistakes of the past as it's plain to me the horrors of what this type of stuff has caused to the people under it.
I suppose when or if they see the storeys told by the people who endured through the madness that these people hide their eyes from it.
Even the people who were in the position of torturing people were afraid.
All this socialism sounds good in the beginning as it's a wonderful dream but it will become a nightmare in reality because it rejects God and it's just a lie and farther of all lies is behind it all.

Socialism doesn't reject God. I happen to be anti-capitalist and pro-socialist. Capitalism rejects God more than socialism no doubt!!

Islam and Capitalism are the worlds two greatest evils!
 

veteran

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Skousen is a tad suspect. As a general rule, I don't trust anyone affiliated with the John Birch Society.

Where did you hear that? I never heard it.

He's retired and won't take interviews. Many media folks have tried to get interviews with him. Worldnetdaily news posted an article with the 45 Soviet strategic points for takeover of the west from his 1958 book The Naked Communist. The guy was an FBI agent for 16 years, my goodness.
 

dismas

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I appreciate your post and I agree with you on many of your points. As one of the people who has rejected conspiracy theories, outright; I see your point about being less extreme, although grudgingly. I should include that I do see the possibility for wide scale corruption and small, competing conspiracy theories - it is the overarching, one world government conspiracy that I reject.

Revelations 17

[sup][/sup]
[sup]12[/sup]And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. [sup]13[/sup]These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

[sup]14[/sup]These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

[sup]15[/sup]And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

[sup]16[/sup]And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.

[sup]17[/sup]For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

And Revelations 18
[sup]7[/sup]How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow. [sup]8[/sup]Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.

[sup]9[/sup]And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,

[sup]10[/sup]Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.

[sup]11[/sup]And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:

[sup]12[/sup]The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,

The ten kings in waiting will give their authority to the beast and then they receive power with the beast when he takes power. How is this not a grand conspiracy?

There are 2 destructions of Babylon. One that allows Satan to take power at the beginning of the mid point of the Tribulation (the destruction of the current order/ financial and spiritual order - New York City and Jerusalem. This is the 10 kings in waiting receive their kingships.) and another when the 2nd coming of Christ occurs to destroy the 3rd Temple in Jerusalem and the rebuilt Babylon in Iraq.
 

Tullius

New Member
Jun 6, 2011
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Socialism doesn't reject God. I happen to be anti-capitalist and pro-socialist. Capitalism rejects God more than socialism no doubt!!

Islam and Capitalism are the worlds two greatest evils!

No you are totally mistaken I'm afraid, all your examples of scripture denouncing capitalism and some that "embraces" socialism is logically and empirically false.

I fear that you are so far into your own ideological political realm that you will never understand, but that is irrelevant and for you to work out for yourself. Because what you fail to comprehend or even realize because of your political materialist/nation-state perception is that scripture was never meant to be a political tool for statecraft or nation building. This is like the commandment "Thouh shalt not kill" this is directed to individuals on the individual level that because of matters of disagreement or any other you will not resort to violence. But on the state level killing is legitimate function of the state.

In the same manner the scripture that attacks greed, capitalism and want collectivism is only meant to guide individuals through FREE WILL. and this is the essential part that you dont understant, democratically crafted laws of socialism is not free willl but the use FORCE to make people give to the poor etc. The Bible wants us to reject greed through free will because God wants us to follow his will, the Bible does not encourage the State to use force to achieve this goal.


Socialism does indeed greatly reject God because it is based on dialectical materialism and darwinism which is social and economical. Capitalism is only economical and therefore does not in any way reject God. To say so is empirically false, for where has there been the most worship of God (christian)? It is in capitalist societies.


To Veteran:

I agree that the EU has some origins form communism, but I think that is more incidentall due to the socialists beliefs of many europeans. If communism is not dead, then I dont think they will ever regain power except through the disguise of environmentalism. But I may be wrong because communism is surely alive and open in Greece.
 

Foreigner

New Member
Apr 14, 2010
2,583
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What are you laughing about? I can post several scriptures that support socialism. And a few that denounce capitalism!

And several dozen that expose the evils of Islam!

Maybe you can show me by scripture how socialism "rejects God!"


-- You post this:

"Socialism doesn't reject God. I happen to be anti-capitalist and pro-socialist. Capitalism rejects God more than socialism no doubt!!

....and then actually wonder why someone would laugh?

You are obviously a person who has never actually spent time in a true socialist country. I, however, have.
Yes, they allow you to go to church, but that is about the extent of their benevolence.
Attend church but don't speak out against the government or decide how your own money should be spent.

Anyone who would say that a Capitalist society rejects God more than a socialist society is NOT speaking from a point of experience OR knowledge.
Yup, I'm talking about you.

And as far as the "evil" capitalist countries, those countries are the FIRST to donate time, money, and equipment whenever there are disasters around the world.
Socialist-based countries? Noooooooooooooot so much

People who live in capitalist countries, like the U.S., are the most generous...in...the...whole...world.
Charities across the "evil" capitalists nations and well as international charites receive hundreds of millions of dollars a year in donations - no strings attached - from those "evil" capitalists.
Socialists? Again, nooooooooooooooot so much.

Why is that if Capitalism is all about selfishness and lack of concern towards others?
Why is that if "socialist" governments are all about the welfare of the people?

Relax, the question is rhetorical. I formed it that way as a favor to you.