The Myth of saying that Jesus Christ died for all men without exception !

[Wrangler]

God Did NOT Say: Part of "The WHOLE world" but:

man says: He MEANT "part of" THE WHOLE WORLD!!

God often speaks figuratively.

In a recent OT reading God said he would kill all of a group of people. In the very next verse he talked about what would happen to the surviving remnant. Doesn't this mean that when God says all, he means part? (In the alternative, he may have mean the nation - as a whole - while allowing some individuals to survive)

In watching Father Brown tv show, the lead character said it is not wise to talk the LORD too literally.

 

[Renniks]

Did you not read my post? I said “People become sheep by the election of God.”

Tong
R2295

Only in your mind.

 

[Wrangler]

Only in your mind.

What is your answer? By the sheep’s obedience?

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Did you not read my post? I said “People become sheep by the election of God.”

Only in your mind.

Not only in my mind, for I learned that truth from scriptures. Read scriptures and find out. Hint: the children of Israel.

Tong
R2300

 

[Renniks]

What is your answer? By the sheep’s obedience?

Go back and read my last reply before that one.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

God often speaks figuratively.

So, "in This case," I can interpret Figuratively that:

CHRIST Died {figuratively} "For The WHOLE world" but:

CHRIST Died {Literally} for "PART of the WHOLE world."

Now, we're making progress {figuratively}, correct?

 

[Triumph1300]

In response to the first post:

“Everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved” (Romans 10:13).

It is not simply everyone, but everyone who calls.

Everyone will not be saved, but everyone who calls on the name of Lord will certainly be saved.

Everyone who calls can be anyone at all. It doesn’t matter how messed up your life is.

 

[brightfame52]

You seem to not read what’s in the verse but rather read in the verse what you believe.

1 John 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

Tong
R2297

Im quite read up on that verse, probably more than you It pertains to the elect

 

[brightfame52]

God Did NOT Say: Part of "The WHOLE world" but:

man says: He MEANT "part of" THE WHOLE WORLD!!

Christ died for His Sheep Jn 10 and all of them will believe. If one never comes to believe in Christ, they were not of His Sheep, and He didnt die for them.

 

[brightfame52]

In response to the first post:

“Everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved” (Romans 10:13).

It is not simply everyone, but everyone who calls.

Everyone will not be saved, but everyone who calls on the name of Lord will certainly be saved.

Everyone who calls can be anyone at all. It doesn’t matter how messed up your life is.

That pertains to the Elect, the Sheep !

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
You seem to not read what’s in the verse but rather read in the verse what you believe.

1 John 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.

Im quite read up on that verse, probably more than you It pertains to the elect

Well that would be true, if the whole world are elect. But that would easily be proven wrong and false.

It is clear to the reader, by simple common sense, the phrase “not ours only but also for the whole world” means all men, all peoples.

Tong
R2309

 

[Triumph1300]

That pertains to the Elect, the Sheep !

Everybody will become a sheep when they call upon the name.
Anybody on the face of this world.
It's simple.

 

[Triumph1300]

Christ died for His Sheep Jn 10 and all of them will believe. If one never comes to believe in Christ, they were not of His Sheep, and He didnt die for them.

That was their decision.
Not Christ's decision.

It does not have to be that way.
Christ invites ALL.

If you decide Christ did not die for you, that's your choice.

 

[Tong2020]

Everybody will become a sheep when they call upon the name.
Anybody on the face of this world.
It's simple.

Hi Triumph.

With respect, I beg to disagree.

In my reading of scriptures, I see nothing about becoming a sheep when and by calling upon the name of the Lord.

As I said in one of my post under this thread, people are made His sheep and so becomes His sheep, by the election of God and the making of God.

Tong
R2311

 

[brightfame52]

Well that would be true, if the whole world are elect. But that would easily be proven wrong and false.

It is clear to the reader, by simple common sense, the phrase “not ours only but also for the whole world” means all men, all peoples.

Tong
R2309

Nothing you can say can change the reality that 1 Jn 2:1-2 is strictly about the Elect.

 

[brightfame52]

Everybody will become a sheep when they call upon the name.
Anybody on the face of this world.
It's simple.

lol, thats false, no where stated in scripture !

 

[brightfame52]

That was their decision.
Not Christ's decision.

It does not have to be that way.
Christ invites ALL.

If you decide Christ did not die for you, that's your choice.

You just make yourself say anything !

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Well that would be true, if the whole world are elect. But that would easily be proven wrong and false.

It is clear to the reader, by simple common sense, the phrase “not ours only but also for the whole world” means all men, all peoples.

Nothing you can say can change the reality that 1 Jn 2:1-2 is strictly about the Elect.

If that is how you approach this issue and that is how you think and is the reality for you, I’ll say no more nor perhaps anyone that has an argument to make against your take of “whole world”.

But considering that passage, the reader must not make the mistake that it means salvation unto eternal life for the whole world. No. What it says is that Jesus Christ is the propitiation for us and also of the whole world. Now, it is a mistake to make propitiation necessarily mean salvation unto eternal life. For it is not.

That passage speaks not of the forgiveness of sins, but clearly about atonement or propitiation, which was also accomplished by the sacrifice of Christ on the cross, among a number of things that His death accomplished.

Tong
R2312

 

[Wrangler]

So, "in This case," I can interpret Figuratively that:

CHRIST Died {figuratively} "For The WHOLE world" but:

CHRIST Died {Literally} for "PART of the WHOLE world."

Now, we're making progress {figuratively}, correct?

Mock all you want. In my devotional reading this morning from Deuteronomy, Moses talked about the Israeli's having more children than 'stars in the heavens.' It's just a figure of speech.

Later in the same book he talks about God 'utterly destroying' a group of people but in the very next verse he talks about the remnant survivors.

 

[Renniks]

Well that would be true, if the whole world are elect. But that would easily be proven wrong and false.

It is clear to the reader, by simple common sense, the phrase “not ours only but also for the whole world” means all men, all peoples.

Tong
R2309

Right. Because anyone can be saved.