<My English Bible>
The Bible was not written in English, rather Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic.
<Keep it coming, I'm not going to change>
The issue is whether you can support your position.
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(The Beast) & (The Two Witnesses) Will Be On This Earth Together For 3.5 Years (Then Cometh The End)
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The Bible was not written in English, rather Greek, Hebrew, Aramaic.
<Keep it coming, I'm not going to change>
The issue is whether you can support your position.
IMO:
"Image of the beast" (Revelation 13:14-15) is a statue of the beast that is to be reveranced. This was customary for Roman emperors.
The Romans did not have a concept of a Creator, rather their "gods" were fictitious exalted men.
We see their gods in our days of the week:
Sunday..........the sun is a god
Monday.........the moon is a god
Tuesday.........Tiu, god of war
Wednesday....Woden's day, equivalent to Jupiter, king of the gods
Thursday........Thor, god of thunder
Friday..............Freya, wife of Woden, goddess of marriage/fertility
Saturday.........Saturn, god of wealth and plenty
"Image of the beast" (Revelation 13:14-15) is a statue of the beast that is to be reveranced. This was customary for Roman emperors.
The Romans did not have a concept of a Creator, rather their "gods" were fictitious exalted men.
We see their gods in our days of the week:
Sunday..........the sun is a god
Monday.........the moon is a god
Tuesday.........Tiu, god of war
Wednesday....Woden's day, equivalent to Jupiter, king of the gods
Thursday........Thor, god of thunder
Friday..............Freya, wife of Woden, goddess of marriage/fertility
Saturday.........Saturn, god of wealth and plenty
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Biblical fact: Jesus returns and rules 1000 years (millennium).
(Revelation 20:6)
Biblical fact: new heavens, new earth come after the millennium.
(2Peter 3:7, Revelation 21:1)
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Biblical Fact: There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation
This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ
(Behold, I Make All Things New)
2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;
Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:
Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.
Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.
Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.
Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.
Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.
Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.
Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
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Paul clearly taught that when Jesus returns the resurrection of the dead takes place, (Then Cometh The End) its that simple (The End) not a 1,000 year kingdom on this earth as many "Falsely" claim
1 Corinthians 15:21-24KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
The scripture above is in perfect agreement with Jesus being revealed in fire and brimstone as seen below (Then Cometh The End) as all the unsaved wicked are destroyed at the Lord's return
(Destroyed Them All)
Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
The resurrection of "All" is seen below and the wicked are judged to eternal damnation, this is when the "Final Judgement" takes place (The End)
John 5:28-29KJV
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Jesus clearly taught that the resurrection of "All" takes place on "The Last Day" this is in perfect agreement with the scripture above
John 6:39-40KJV
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
"Christ the firstfruits" = "firstfruits from THE GRAVE."
"End" (of the millennial kingdom) is succeeded by the new heavens and new earth (Revelation chapters 21, 22).
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It's a valid claim. There are things that happen after the end according to Jesus, which includes ruling over people.
Rev 2:25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come.
That is the second coming. Everything we read of next comes after the second coming:
Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
After "the end" comes, there is given power over the nations to those that are overcomers. They will be given power over the mortal unsaved nations after Christ has returned not before it.
Compare that wording to these:
Mat_10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
Mat_24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Mar_13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
These are survivors of the Great Tribulation. Same here:
Mar 13:9 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.
Mar 13:10 And the gospel must first be published among all nations.
Mar 13:11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.
Mar 13:12 Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death.
Mar 13:13 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
Rev 2:27 And he shall rule (FUTURE tense verb) them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father.
After the second coming and after "the end" will the overcomers be given power over the nations, ruling them with a rod of iron. That proves the rod of iron rule over the nations for a thousand years does not even start until Christ has returned and has given overcomers this power to rule over the nations.
It is impossible to understand what happens at the second coming and what happens AFTER the second coming properly without understanding the verb tenses involved.
Since scripture does not contradict itself, there are no scriptures which state all mortals are slain at the second coming leaving none to be ruled over.
"""Yes Scofield abandoned his wife Leotine and two daughters.....""
King David impregnated Bathsheba & arranged to have her husband Uriah killed in battle.
Yet 7t7 is sinless :)
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David repented of his sin, Scofield remained in his sin being married to (Hettie Van Wart) to his death in 1921, Adulterers don't make it into heaven
1 Corinthians 6:9-10KJV
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
.
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Has no relationship to myself, the words of God stand true, active unrepentant adulterers don't go into the eternal kingdom
David repented of his sin, Scofield remained in his sin being married to (Hettie Van Wart) to his death in 1921, Adulterers don't make it into the eternal kingdom
1 Corinthians 6:9-10KJV
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
We are all sinners, hence we have never experienced sinless perfection.
Atheists sometimes argue that since God causes everything, God causes sin, and I agree. The apostle Paul said the same (Romans 9:19). I do not see how it could be otherwise, since God is Creator. If we create a story, do the characters do anything that we did not write.?
The Bible says we will all stand before God and give an account of what we did with the things God provided (Romans 14:12).
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New heavens and earth is AFTER the millennium (Revelation chapters 21, 22).
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TribulationSigns
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You clearly don't understand what the Mark of the Beast is, who receives it, or why they receive it.
So let’s start there.
The Mark of the Beast is NOT some random physical object that a Christian accidentally receives and then suddenly loses salvation. Revelation 13 presents the mark as belonging to those who worship the beast and submit to his authority. The issue is allegiance, worship, and obedience—not the magical properties of ink, metal, or technology.
And regarding your two questions:
1. Can someone be forgiven after taking the Mark of the Beast? — NO.
Not because the physical mark itself has magical power, but because those who receive the mark are identified with the beast in worship and allegiance. Revelation 14:9–11 explicitly connects receiving the mark with worshiping the beast and warns of God's judgment.
More importantly, look at the chronology of Revelation. The Elect are sealed in Revelation 7:1–4 before the beast comes out of the bottomless pit and start forced everyone who "have not yet sealed by God" to receive the mark, Revelation 9:4. God's elect are already secured before the beast is permitted to carry out this final assault upon God's congregation.
So your scenario of a genuinely sealed believer casually receiving the Mark of the Beast and then asking whether they can repent afterward completely misses the prophetic sequence.
2. Can a sealed believer who fails to perform the works described in Matthew 25:35–46 therefore be cast into the lake of fire? — NO, not on the basis of failing a works test.
Sounds like you believe in salvation based on performance or work. Matthew 25 does not teach that Christ's elect "earn" or "maintain" salvation by performing enough charitable works, etc. No, we got saved by believe in Christ and trust His work on the Cross. Here are tons of Scripture support:
John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
John 3:18
“He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already…”
John 5:24
“He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
John 6:28–29
“Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.”
John 6:40
“And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.”
Acts 10:43
“To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.”
Acts 15:11
“But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved…”
Nothing is said about we need to do some perform or work to earn salvation on top of belief. You are trying to construct hypothetical situations that Revelation itself does not present, while ignoring the actual context of the Mark.
Understand the Mark before asking hypothetical questions about it.
The real question is not, “What happens if a Christian accidentally gets a tattoo or chip?”
The real question is:
Whom do you worship? Whom do you belong to? Whose authority do you submit to? Whom do you believe?
The Mark of the Beast identifies those who belong to the beast. The seal of God identifies those who belong to God.
That's the contrast Revelation is actually giving us.
IMO:
o. The tribulation spans seven years.
o. The great tribulation occurs at the midpoint of the seven years.
o. The rapture occurs at this midpoint.
o. The rapture is depicted in Revelation 11:12, 14:14-16.
"Then they (two witnesses) heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, "Come up here!" And in the sight of their foes they went up to heaven in a cloud." (Revelation 11:12).
"So he who sat upon the cloud swung his sickel on the land, and the land was reaped." (Revelation 14:16).
o. The tribulation spans seven years.
o. The great tribulation occurs at the midpoint of the seven years.
o. The rapture occurs at this midpoint.
o. The rapture is depicted in Revelation 11:12, 14:14-16.
"Then they (two witnesses) heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, "Come up here!" And in the sight of their foes they went up to heaven in a cloud." (Revelation 11:12).
"So he who sat upon the cloud swung his sickel on the land, and the land was reaped." (Revelation 14:16).
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YES or NO was the polite request.
- Is it possible to be forgiven for taking the Rev 14:9-10 MOTB ?
TribulationSigns
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You don't seem to understand the point I'm making. You may not even understand what the beast represents in Scripture.
The real questions are: WHO receives the Mark of the Beast? WHEN does it happen? And HOW does it happen?
Revelation 14:9–10 is describing those who receive the mark and worship the beast as an act of judgment. The issue isn't whether one of the Elect can accidentally take a physical mark and then lose salvation and then ask for forgiven. No, the Elect has to be secured BEFORE the beast and the mark of the beast can occur! That means the Elect will NOT be the ones to receive the mark. It is other group of the congregation under the judgment of God becasue. Didn't you even bother to study Revelation 9 on who God is using the locusts as a judgment against.
If you reject the spiritual meaning of the Mark of the Beast, then demanding a simple "yes or no" answer misses the entire theological issue. You can't properly answer the question until you understand what the beast, the mark, and those who receive it signify in Revelation.
Selah!
- Is it possible to be forgiven for taking the Rev 14:9-10 MOTB ?
Was the answer YES or NO ?
TribulationSigns
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