Why does everything revert to some kind of "requirements" and "doing" in order to deliver enough "works" to earn and/or maintain Salvation?
Must we endure in the faith by continuously believing and repenting?
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Do you have evidence for this statement.
Bible translators takje great pains to produce an accurate yet readable translation. They are not working on there own but as part of a team with reviewers who go over there work.
Any variation has to pass numerous checks and be justified befor it appears in a bible.
The corruption is called political expediency, if you scratch my back I will scratch your back. And so the errors have come. The translators achieve their desired outcome of getting their understanding incorporated into the bible translations.
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
OSAS. To say one can be saved and then unsaved if they do not repent daily is nailing Christ back on the cross daily.
As well when one is saved they are baptized by the holy spirit and then born again. To become unsaved mean one becomes unbaptized in the holy spirit and unborn again.
Catholics and some other cults believe no one is born again until they die.
When one is born again they have a new spirit, heart and mind. The flesh still sins but as romans 8 states, once you belong to Christ nothing can remove you from his hand.
As well when one is saved they are baptized by the holy spirit and then born again. To become unsaved mean one becomes unbaptized in the holy spirit and unborn again.
Catholics and some other cults believe no one is born again until they die.
When one is born again they have a new spirit, heart and mind. The flesh still sins but as romans 8 states, once you belong to Christ nothing can remove you from his hand.
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
Some bibles are written by cults. Some, such as the King James version, was written for political purposes. Some were written to give people an accurate bible to study.
Continued.
Enter on scene JESUS.
One of His primary things to do, was to ACCOMPLISH fulfillment of Laws, fulfilment of particular Prophecies (ie things that were foretold would come to pass).
As well many other things.
Fulfilling of the Laws, resulted in the Laws being no longer APPLICABLE.
In short, as to say, a law was like a task; complete the task; it is accomplished, and does not require repeating; or continue to be considered.
JESUS, fulfilling is ONLY one portion ...
Men also have a portion to fulfill....but by JESUS fulfilling: it is THEN, that men "CAN thereafter" fuflill their portion.
So, we look to read what JESUS DID fulfilll...And then look to read....the mans portion....which is where Scripture is FULL of.... "IF" a man..."IF" a man does this...
"THEN", that "IS" the act of "that man", fulfilling his portion.
In this respect....we learn what JESUS DID...
FOR all men. And then WHICH MEN have elected to ALSO fuflill "their" portion.
Not ALL men "choose" to Fulfill "their" portion, thus...they are NOT accounted as having accomplished....the "IF"..."THEN".
JESUS accomplished....
Again...a man must also accomplish.
Also.....a man must obviously BELIEVE in Jesus Being the Lord, Jesus Having accomplished...and A man thereafter accomplishing.
Clearly we KNOW, all men do not believe, (IN JESUS the CHRIST) or have become accomplished/Converted IN Christ Jesus....so SURE, according to Scripture....
IF they were under the Law, and Continue under the Law, the Law Continues to APPLY to them. AND sin against God, and calling violations of trespass of man against man, a sin. <--> which is typically applies to the Jews, who continue Under the Law, and it's applications.
Anyone who WAS under the Law, and subject to the CONSEQUENCES (curses) of the Law...
And Convert IN Christ Jesus...
1) their Law was fulfilled
2) they are relieved from the Curses.
THEY ^ have become as a Gentile, who is Converted IN Christ Jesus....both believing IN God and Christ Jesus, AND forgiven (BY) God, of their SIN, AGAINST (God/Christ Jesus), FOR
Having had DISBELIEF IN God/Christ Jesus.
I am a Gentile, who was naturally born, in DISBELIEF, In God, In Christ Jesus, which was MY SIN AGAINST GOD.
I came to Belief IN God, IN Christ Jesus, and elected to BECOME CONVERTED IN Christ Jesus. My SIN AGAINST God, was ONCE and FOREVER FORGIVEN, and I am KEPT from eVER AGAIN "not believing in God/Christ Jesus", by the indwelling Power of God, which is a part of the Conversion.
THAT ^^ does not cover any TRESPASSES that can transpire between myself and other men or other men trespassing against me.
Such trespasses ARE NOT SINS, since they are NOT according to Jewish LAWS.
THEY ARE according to Gods PRECEPTS, which applies to all men.
I do not ASK God to forgive me FOR ANYTHING MORE. He has accomplished His forgiveness TOWARD ME, Once and Forever.
Any Trespasses I commit AGAINST men, or they aagainst Me, are forgiveness that take place between men.
I am simply IMFORMED, "that" "IF" I forgive men their trespasses AGAINST me, so also will God forgive my trespasses against other men. It is a given instruction, and nothing about Asking God repeatedly to forgive me because I did whatever to another man.
^^ THAT concept is RARELY taught in Christian Churches...particularly Catholic Churches who TEACH "every act of a man against a man IS a SIN, and men SHOULD ask GOD, for forgiveness of their repeated "SINS".
I believe, SIN is only AGAINST God, and ONLY God forgives SIN.
I believe, IF I Kick you in the knee, or damage your property....it is YOU, I need to apologize to and make amends, and YOU can forgive me or not.
I do not run to God and ask Him to forgive me for what harm I caused you.
Continued
Enter on scene JESUS.
One of His primary things to do, was to ACCOMPLISH fulfillment of Laws, fulfilment of particular Prophecies (ie things that were foretold would come to pass).
As well many other things.
Fulfilling of the Laws, resulted in the Laws being no longer APPLICABLE.
In short, as to say, a law was like a task; complete the task; it is accomplished, and does not require repeating; or continue to be considered.
JESUS, fulfilling is ONLY one portion ...
Men also have a portion to fulfill....but by JESUS fulfilling: it is THEN, that men "CAN thereafter" fuflill their portion.
So, we look to read what JESUS DID fulfilll...And then look to read....the mans portion....which is where Scripture is FULL of.... "IF" a man..."IF" a man does this...
"THEN", that "IS" the act of "that man", fulfilling his portion.
In this respect....we learn what JESUS DID...
FOR all men. And then WHICH MEN have elected to ALSO fuflill "their" portion.
Not ALL men "choose" to Fulfill "their" portion, thus...they are NOT accounted as having accomplished....the "IF"..."THEN".
JESUS accomplished....
Again...a man must also accomplish.
Also.....a man must obviously BELIEVE in Jesus Being the Lord, Jesus Having accomplished...and A man thereafter accomplishing.
Clearly we KNOW, all men do not believe, (IN JESUS the CHRIST) or have become accomplished/Converted IN Christ Jesus....so SURE, according to Scripture....
IF they were under the Law, and Continue under the Law, the Law Continues to APPLY to them. AND sin against God, and calling violations of trespass of man against man, a sin. <--> which is typically applies to the Jews, who continue Under the Law, and it's applications.
Anyone who WAS under the Law, and subject to the CONSEQUENCES (curses) of the Law...
And Convert IN Christ Jesus...
1) their Law was fulfilled
2) they are relieved from the Curses.
THEY ^ have become as a Gentile, who is Converted IN Christ Jesus....both believing IN God and Christ Jesus, AND forgiven (BY) God, of their SIN, AGAINST (God/Christ Jesus), FOR
Having had DISBELIEF IN God/Christ Jesus.
I am a Gentile, who was naturally born, in DISBELIEF, In God, In Christ Jesus, which was MY SIN AGAINST GOD.
I came to Belief IN God, IN Christ Jesus, and elected to BECOME CONVERTED IN Christ Jesus. My SIN AGAINST God, was ONCE and FOREVER FORGIVEN, and I am KEPT from eVER AGAIN "not believing in God/Christ Jesus", by the indwelling Power of God, which is a part of the Conversion.
THAT ^^ does not cover any TRESPASSES that can transpire between myself and other men or other men trespassing against me.
Such trespasses ARE NOT SINS, since they are NOT according to Jewish LAWS.
THEY ARE according to Gods PRECEPTS, which applies to all men.
I do not ASK God to forgive me FOR ANYTHING MORE. He has accomplished His forgiveness TOWARD ME, Once and Forever.
Any Trespasses I commit AGAINST men, or they aagainst Me, are forgiveness that take place between men.
I am simply IMFORMED, "that" "IF" I forgive men their trespasses AGAINST me, so also will God forgive my trespasses against other men. It is a given instruction, and nothing about Asking God repeatedly to forgive me because I did whatever to another man.
^^ THAT concept is RARELY taught in Christian Churches...particularly Catholic Churches who TEACH "every act of a man against a man IS a SIN, and men SHOULD ask GOD, for forgiveness of their repeated "SINS".
I believe, SIN is only AGAINST God, and ONLY God forgives SIN.
I believe, IF I Kick you in the knee, or damage your property....it is YOU, I need to apologize to and make amends, and YOU can forgive me or not.
I do not run to God and ask Him to forgive me for what harm I caused you.
Continued
Continued last page of 3
You could unknowingly trespass against someone, again a trespass, not a sin (less you be UNDER Jewish Law).
Yes, men learn the process of forgiveness of trespasses, among men. After all it is men who lie, cheat, deceive, trick, etc. against other men. (Like who is going to TRICK God?)
Being baptized in the Holy Spirit, is not VISIBLE. You do not FEEL the Holy Spirit entering you. It is not PHYSICAL.
It begins with you learning KNOWLEDGE about God, about Christ, and TRUSTING to BELIEVE IT. The more you learn, the more you trust, the more measures of gifts of Faith you receive. The more you continue learning, trusting to believe, the move Faith, until you have come to a point, that the Faith moves you to CONFESS your "HEARTFELT" Belief IN God, IN Christ.....and there after thee Lord God does all the Internal changing.
You do not require an audience, a water baptism, a certificate, and such. You have accepted the Lords Offer to SEAL a relationship between YOU and thee Lord God, once and Forever. Henceforth, you can never SIN against God again...ie Disbelieve In thee Lord God. You body become dead crucified with Christ, kept with Christ until Risen up in Glory. Your soul becomes forgiven and RESTORED, (ie saved from ever being separated from God, or destroyed), Your natural heart is Circumcised, ie a new heart. Your natural spirit (ie truth in your heart), IS where Gods SEED is PLANTED...HIS TRUTH, which grows forth with HIS TRUTH within you.
You have thereafter gained a Spiritual relationship with the Lord, and have 24-7 One on One entitlement to speak directly to God, to ask about His word, and His understanding of His word.
You are becoming equipped to serve the Lord by Speaking His TRUTHS to the ears of others.
Not sure your meaning....would likely guess, it has to do with possible behavior of you, and perhaps you and another.
A conversion makes a man PERFECT-ED, sealed to be CLAIMED, resurrected, glorified.
A conversion does not make a man PERFECT.
Flesh urges, lying, cheating, etc., can still exist....and will still fail in "YOU" trying to "wish away" a behavior.
What you do have is the POWER of God, that can WORK within you. And THE authority to ASK Gods Help, etc.
It is not asking for forgiveness, but rather, simply saying your are too weak to overcome natural urges, and WANT Gods intercession.
Nothing is too difficult for God to accomplish;
And men with the internal Holy Spirit have an advantage to call on Gods Power to intervene and HELP....remember...He can HELP you, not DO it for you.
And the same when trespassing against men, who DO NOT FORGIVE you...He will not force them to forgive you....but will comfort you through the unfavorable experience.
God Bless,
Taken
You could unknowingly trespass against someone, again a trespass, not a sin (less you be UNDER Jewish Law).
Yes, men learn the process of forgiveness of trespasses, among men. After all it is men who lie, cheat, deceive, trick, etc. against other men. (Like who is going to TRICK God?)
Being baptized in the Holy Spirit, is not VISIBLE. You do not FEEL the Holy Spirit entering you. It is not PHYSICAL.
It begins with you learning KNOWLEDGE about God, about Christ, and TRUSTING to BELIEVE IT. The more you learn, the more you trust, the more measures of gifts of Faith you receive. The more you continue learning, trusting to believe, the move Faith, until you have come to a point, that the Faith moves you to CONFESS your "HEARTFELT" Belief IN God, IN Christ.....and there after thee Lord God does all the Internal changing.
You do not require an audience, a water baptism, a certificate, and such. You have accepted the Lords Offer to SEAL a relationship between YOU and thee Lord God, once and Forever. Henceforth, you can never SIN against God again...ie Disbelieve In thee Lord God. You body become dead crucified with Christ, kept with Christ until Risen up in Glory. Your soul becomes forgiven and RESTORED, (ie saved from ever being separated from God, or destroyed), Your natural heart is Circumcised, ie a new heart. Your natural spirit (ie truth in your heart), IS where Gods SEED is PLANTED...HIS TRUTH, which grows forth with HIS TRUTH within you.
You have thereafter gained a Spiritual relationship with the Lord, and have 24-7 One on One entitlement to speak directly to God, to ask about His word, and His understanding of His word.
You are becoming equipped to serve the Lord by Speaking His TRUTHS to the ears of others.
Not sure your meaning....would likely guess, it has to do with possible behavior of you, and perhaps you and another.
A conversion makes a man PERFECT-ED, sealed to be CLAIMED, resurrected, glorified.
A conversion does not make a man PERFECT.
Flesh urges, lying, cheating, etc., can still exist....and will still fail in "YOU" trying to "wish away" a behavior.
What you do have is the POWER of God, that can WORK within you. And THE authority to ASK Gods Help, etc.
It is not asking for forgiveness, but rather, simply saying your are too weak to overcome natural urges, and WANT Gods intercession.
Nothing is too difficult for God to accomplish;
And men with the internal Holy Spirit have an advantage to call on Gods Power to intervene and HELP....remember...He can HELP you, not DO it for you.
And the same when trespassing against men, who DO NOT FORGIVE you...He will not force them to forgive you....but will comfort you through the unfavorable experience.
God Bless,
Taken
Sure. And the Puritans were just playing politics to obtain this Bible!
For those who have never read The Translators to the Reader (the preface to the KJV which is no longer included) it would be beneficial to read it from top to bottom. It will show you how CoreIssue loves to twist the truth about the KJV.
The Translators to the Reader
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
The KJV was created for the Church of England event by King James. The Church of England
Was the legal state religion.
The Puritans were barred from even attending the first meeting of the committee.
Nothing you're saying is changing the fact the KJV is loaded with errors.
Am I also twisting the fact the 1611 KJV contain the books of the apocrypha? That Easter was never part of the bible and did not even exist when many apostles were alive?
That's a load of baloney. As to the rest of your post, it is not worth responding to, since you even believe that the Puritans were excluded.
Because people dont believe. simple as that..
Mar_6:6 And he marvelled because of their unbelief. And he went round about the villages, teaching.
Mat_15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
As a church we support witclife bible translators and in there last visit they discussed why they worked from the King James bible when translating into other languages.
It is a good translation.
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
VictoryinJesus
Well-Known Member
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Must we endure in the faith by continuously believing and repenting?
It is the Spirit which endures: Romans 8:1-2 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [2] For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Titus 3:5
[5] Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
1 Chronicles 16:34
[34] O give thanks unto the Lord ; for he is good; for his mercy endureth for ever.
Not by works of righteousness we have done, but according to his mercy ... for his mercy endures.
For His mercy endures...do you know how many times that “His mercy endures” is in the word? Many times... many passages with “for his mercy endures.” It is by and through His mercy we endure.
Psalm 118:1-4
[1] O give thanks unto the Lord ; for he is good: because his mercy endureth for ever. [2] Let Israel now say, that his mercy endureth for ever. [3] Let the house of Aaron now say, that his mercy endureth for ever. [4] Let them now that fear the Lord say, that his mercy endureth for ever.
Romans 9:23
[23] And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Romans 11:29-33
[29] For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: [31] Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. [32] For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. [33] O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
his mercy endures. 1 Corinthians 13:7-10 [7] Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. [8] Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. [9] For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. [10] But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
“...for His mercy endures.
It is the Spirit which endures: Romans 8:1-2 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. [2] For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Titus 3:5
[5] Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
1 Chronicles 16:34
[34] O give thanks unto the Lord ; for he is good; for his mercy endureth for ever.
Not by works of righteousness we have done, but according to his mercy ... for his mercy endures.
For His mercy endures...do you know how many times that “His mercy endures” is in the word? Many times... many passages with “for his mercy endures.” It is by and through His mercy we endure.
Psalm 118:1-4
[1] O give thanks unto the Lord ; for he is good: because his mercy endureth for ever. [2] Let Israel now say, that his mercy endureth for ever. [3] Let the house of Aaron now say, that his mercy endureth for ever. [4] Let them now that fear the Lord say, that his mercy endureth for ever.
Romans 9:23
[23] And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
Romans 11:29-33
[29] For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. [30] For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: [31] Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. [32] For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. [33] O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
his mercy endures. 1 Corinthians 13:7-10 [7] Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. [8] Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. [9] For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. [10] But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
“...for His mercy endures.
Do a comparison between the context of the original source texts and the translations. Also the introduction of PC language within the later translations, the introduction of the Rapture theology into the translations etc.
Committees work best when political expedience drives the outcome.
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All of the many dire warnings in the NT ...
MAY be there ONLY to keep God's elect on the narrow path to salvation!
But, then we have to consider if God is bluffing, exaggerating, lying even.
However, IF you desire to RECONCILE
the so-called eternal security NT verses ...with...
all of those NT verses which stand against them,
please consider the following:
True saving faith = enduring belief + enduring trust + enduring obedience
.
Nonsense ... whoever's in charge has a bias!
Here's my favorite ... now go and weep!
John 8:24
Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins;
for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.”
Da "He" is in italics 'cause it has been inserted.
There is NO "He" in the Greek!
With the "He" in there, one can say Jesus is claiming to be whoever he likes:
prophet, teacher, rabbi, angel, created god, whatever!
Jesus is saying we need to believe that He is "I AM", or else!
.
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