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You have made clear your position. I and others disagree with you. There’s nothing else to be said if you are not open, but closed up.

Marks, you’re arguing with me because I used the word theories and yes, we should just follow God’s word. But every theory one follows they say IS God’s word. They all cannot be correct. So when we talk about theories, it’s only in a difference of eschatological sense. It’s not about not...

Obviously, you know that answer. Pre-Tb centers around Dispensationalism. Or perhaps the other way around, what really came first? The idea Israel and the Church are separate, and God deals with each separately. On the other hand, the idea that Paul tells us that we are spiritual Jews, of the...

No, I don't believe that at all. I have spoken to some Pre-Tb believers which equate that theory with an unwillingness (but I wouldn't say its Pre-Tb specific, but really anyone may have that thought), but most believers that I have delt with would still die and/or suffer for Christ. I don't...

Many commentators and myself see Paul simply making a statement to believers that God will save and change all his children regardless if they were already dead or the ones still alive in the day Christ appears in his kingdom. That is very different from suggesting that Paul assumed he’d be...

Grace, there is only 1 second coming. Christ doesn’t leave heaven, go back, come out again and descend twice for a total of 3 advents. Acts 3:21 Who heaven must receive till the restoration of all things. He cannot leave heaven and descend till the restoration. The world isn’t restored when...

Easily argued the “we” were Paul’s listeners/readers. Not himself. 2 Cor 5 is every believers hope. Not just Paul’s. Of course we think those things while alive contemplating our change. Addressing ideas like this while alive have zero barring on linking it to a harpazo. Now you’re just...

I am thankful, his grace is sufficient. And yes, Israel is God’s people of whom is the church.

Paul wasn’t looking to be seized by force (harpazo), He was looking to the resurrection of the dead. The early church taught that fundamental understanding wherever they went. Paul said his rest would be when Christ would return in flaming fire to destroy the wicked. Because he is dead, the only...

So, in that wall of text, you had no answer. Got it! Thlipsis never ever means wrath. And we are always to endure it for Christ sake.

Yet the Jews, who you said have KNOWN God had said this: 39“Abraham is our father,” they replied. And Christ responded, No! He is not your father. “If you were children of Abraham,” said Jesus, “you would do the works of Abraham. 40But now you are trying to kill Me, a man who has told you the...

Where is thlipsis ever used as a synonym for wrath (Orge or thumos)? Can you show me one place where we aren’t to ever endure thlipsis?

What? Have you not read, Whoever doesn’t know the son, does not know the father. They cannot know God without Christ. And as belief goes, it is then a false belief. Belief is worthless without works that follow that belief. The devils believe, are they going to be saved?

I’m saying (IMHO) a prophecy given in the spirit shouldn’t be taken literal though it will happen in the real world. If you don’t consider it, you may just miss it.

Marks, the Rev 11 statement is in the spirit. Do you consider everything in the spirit to be literal?

Ronald, how do we know they are only Jews? Not Arabs or those who identify as Christian or others? What I’m suggesting is, the text doesn’t tell us their nationality or their bloodline. The context is that people will change. They will acknowledge God, right?

Since you quoted my reply to Marks, I’ll respond back to you. I’m a Christian. I don’t deal with conspiracy theories or fear tactics. And if you think by seeing things, this is the end? Christ said in Matthew 24, the end is not yet.

I’d rather let the spirit lead you. Posting scripture about something others disagree with will just push it out of topic and it gets lost in a wall of text. Those serious in eschatology would rather systematically analyze all claims and see if it holds weight rather then replying, “we...

Haha. It’s funny you said that Marks. For me, it’s just the opposite. I hear the Pre-TB Rev 4:1 rapture too, but less frequently nowadays. And you’re right, it depends on what circles we’re in.

Most people haven’t made that connection. There are other reasons which I was waiting to see if you recognized.