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I only brought that up because it wasn’t the only “come up hither”. And I don’t believe that is the resurrection either. I never said that. But you using the first one as a rapture makes John the universal church and you’re spiritualizing him. No where in scripture is John made to represent...

There is also a come up hither in Rev 11. But the John is never himself spiritualized as the church universal anywhere in scripture. The church is the saints. The Ekklesia isn’t mentioned in 10 NT books. With your same logic, those books have nothing to do with the church. They’re absent right...

The bride was raptured? Ok. Where is the great multitude? The bema seat? The reward? The archangel? The last trumpet? The kingdom? Sorry, none of those exist in Rev 4 or 5 and Christ cannot, will not leave Heaven till the restoration of all things per Acts 3:21 and I’m afraid nothing is restored...

You can’t take one part literal and not the other to fit your theory. Similar to what Pre-TB does with their theft in various passages. Ie. They’ll borrow 1 taken and 1 left as a rapture but then they say there is no rapture in Matthew 24 cause it’s for the Jews. Or that the rapture comes like a...

Because Timtofly, you said, If you can provide quotes from their works, I could point out their error You said it. Therefore, there is no reason for me to post. You made up your mind as foolish as that is. And God says it is foolish instead of heeding wise council. You did not give their words...

Where in all of scripture does God command believers redeemed by his blood to be literal virgins? If we take the 144k to be literal Jewish men, by bloodline, it exempts all women and we must also take them literally as virgins. Where does Christ command us that to be redeemed and the first...

The seals are the wrath of God? What makes the seals wrath? How about, what demonstrates that they are not wrath. 1. Does God's wrath normally contain (the seals themselves) the contents of the scroll? Jesus opening a seal doesn't imply wrath at all. There is no verse that proves it. It only...

That doesn’t make any sense. You said, Noah is in the ark 7 days before wrath. If we are raptured before wrath, and you’re counting the entire 70th week as wrath, we’d be in heaven 7 years before it…just like Noah? If we’re in heaven 7 years before wrath, and the 70th week lasts 7 years, you’re...

There is no point posting their sayings if you already consider them to be in error. That’s a shame since we could all learn from those that spoke directly with the apostle the Lord loved or had second hand knowledge from someone who spoke to him. We don’t know the hour or day, but we do know...

You do realize that by saying @Davy is wrong, you’re also saying all the early church father’s were also wrong! Eusebius, Irenaeus, Justin Martyr, Polycarp and others all believed the church would see the AC and the resurrection would not happen till after that time.

1. Prideful 2. Un loving 3. Disrespectful 4. Foul mouthed Nothing in your previous 5 responses is Christ likeness. Having a difference of opinion isn’t wrong in itself, but your conduct to others is of the world. You really need to practice what you profess to read because right now, based...

Agreed. Though I was hoping someone would mention one caveat. Christ, who is God, was married to fleshly Israel yet in order to marry another people who were not his people, he has to die. Because the law allows remarriage when the spouse dies, only then is it permissible otherwise it would be...

I’m not sure on what your response was intended to target.

I'm old, but I'm not confused. It is more a difference in opinion and what the spirit shows. I could give multiple examples of why I believe what I do, but it'll fall on deaf ears if the reader isn't ready to hear. That doesn't mean the reader has to believe it, but just to search it out. Well...

On that part, I disagree. Let me explain. Christ said when he reigns in his kingdom he will separate the just from unjust and with the unjust, they’ll be cast into utter darkness. He will come to establish his kingdom and in that kingdom he lays down all rule and authority. This happens after...

Simply, Acts 3:21 The restoration of all things will not be completed in a Pre-TB rapture timing because according to them, there exist 7 years of God’s wrath on earth after their departure . Therefore, it’s impossible for Christ to leave heaven with that scenario because all things are still...

I know some are waiting for the 80th year (2028) from 1948 (they think Israel, they who are fleshly anti-Christian Jews, is part of a fig tree that blooms) because the 70th year (2018) didn’t work out for Pre-TB rapture enthusiasts.

You misunderstood what I was saying. We go “up” to meet. There’s no disagreement there, but caught “up” is not the same. A really poor translation that people use to equal it to going up. That’s not the noun’s definition.

Good thing I’m not a KJV only-ist :) We shall be seized together and meet the dead in the air.

Not really caught up as if going up. Properly: like someone seizing bounty (spoil, a prize) We can say when Christ seizes us (his treasure).