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  1. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    Not a lot. As I analyze the Crucifixion, I ask whether it was necessary for forgiveness of our sins. If it wasn't, and was just God's chosen means from among other alternative ways to forgive our sins, why would He choose this one? And if it WAS the only available alternative, what does that...
  2. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    The WHY matters to me. I want to at least try to understand it. If not here, what would be a good forum for me to engage, in an effort to make sense out of all of this?
  3. R

    Proofs of god's existence

    If any "proof" of the existence of God were logically airtight, there would be a lot more theists and a lot fewer atheists around. I doubt any philosophical argument will ever supplant faith as the basis for belief in God's existence.
  4. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    What I'm having a difficult time grasping is WHY God NEEDED to choose the Crucifixion of the Son as the method for His forgiveness of sin. Several theories have been advanced to explain what happened on Calvary, all of them using the language of “payment” in describing the sacrifice. The...
  5. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    I certainly understand that without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins; that's God's way. And I grant that the sacrificial lamb must be sinless if remission of sins is to be the result; that's God's way, too. I'm just asking for an explanation of why GOD INCARNATE is the...
  6. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    Jack, I am not questioning that salvation is only through the blood of Jesus. I'm questioning why, for those who think Jesus is God (which I assume includes both of us), why you feel that is important. Is it because you deem it to be a necessary element of salvation?
  7. R

    For those who think Jesus is God - Why is that important?

    Jack, since the post asks why Christ's divinity is important, and your answer focuses on his being Savior, I have to ask: Are you saying that his sacrifice on Calvary would have been ineffective to forgive our sins if he WEREN'T God? That proposition takes a bit more explanation than I have...
  8. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    But during this "emptied himself" time that Jesus walked the earth, there would have been little basis for any declaration by Jesus of identity to the Father. Besides, he was addressing Jews who would never be able to comprehend any esoteric declaration of Jesus' divine identity without seeing...
  9. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    Ye i know. I should have used a lower-case "s" here. My bad. And I am insulted by your "Guess not" comment. Why do you feel the need to be condescending? (Maybe "condescension" is another way to test the spirit . . .)
  10. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    The God of Israel. Referred to by Jesus as "the Father," if the gospel accounts are accurate.
  11. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    God is God, I agree. Jesus spoke about his God while walking the earth 2,000 years ago, I agree. A person can be called "God" without it being intended as a reference to The Ruler of The Universe, I agree.
  12. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    So if I understand you correctly, your talisman for testing the Spirit is John's single litmus test: whether that Spirit proclaims that "Jesus Christ is come in the flesh." But pretty much EVERYONE agrees that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh. Not everyone agrees that he is God come in the...
  13. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    I don't know how to conceptualize "his God" here, simply because my God is a Trinity, and Jesus is included in that Trinity. Before concluding that "his God" is himself in connection with the other two persons of the Trinity, I'd need to understand what you mean by "his God." I have difficulty...
  14. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    And just how do you suggest we δοκιμαζετε τα πνευματα in the face of conflicting views?
  15. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    Interesting way to cast the issue, Matthias (if Jesus Christ is God, can an omniscient God even have a "theology," or are such "ologies" purely human attempts at understanding things in a systematic fashion?). Assuming he has one (or had one while he walked the planet and had "emptied himself,"...
  16. R

    The Pre-Existence of Jesus Christ.

    Thus far nobody has discussed Proverbs 8:22-31. Doesn't that poem have to be in the mix here?
  17. R

    John the Baptist and Elijah

    There is a disconnect between the Synoptics’ association of John the Baptist with Elijah (Matt. 11:13-14; Mark 9:13; Luke 1:17) and John’s denial of it (John 1:21). Given that John wrote last, and must have been aware of the tradition that connected the Baptist with the OT prophet, what...
  18. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    The problem for me has always been wrapping my head around what a single "being" means in this context, yet maintain that Father and Son and Holy Spirit are not identical. We can express the orthodox doctrine of the Trinity (three persons in one God) as a set of propositions in this way: 1...
  19. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    I don't think any trinitarian would say that. The issue for us is never multiple gods, it's always multiple persons in a single god.
  20. R

    The Nature of Jesus Christ

    In French, "vous" is the plural form of "you" -- but also is used as the formal "you" referencing a single person. Accordingly one cannot tell, without more, whether the word "vous" refers to one or more than one. I realize that Elohim isn't French, but I'm just noting that different languages...