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You already acknowledged my point from Mt 18 was a fatal issue to your empty view, BUT you tried to rescue your empty view by saying it is irrelevant now. I showed that it's still relevant, because Jesus said go teach others what I taught you. Also, you claimed we weren't servants, but Sons...

An empty assertion--1 Cor 10 demonstrates my point. He says these things happened to them, and they were written down for us teach us not to do as they did because we know what God will do to us based on how He dealt with them How can you "help" anyone when you're completely unacquainted with...

Irrelevant : the things that happened to them happened to them to teach us about how God relates to His people. If not, then reprimand Paul for starting a "cult", since he taught about how God relates to His people in the NT using OT (1 Corinthians 10). The unforgiving servant (Mt 18)...

Deuteronomy 32:5 denies this. Also, Matthew 18, which shows the forgiveness that has already had its effect can also be rescinded so that its effect is reversed, so that the one who had previously received forgiveness now has to pay for his sins just as any other unbeliever.

The devil knows the Bible, too--he knows how to twist it--that's how!

Well, bottom line is it was only found among the Gnostics... ?

No, I don't observe Sabbath, and Ro 14 tells me that's perfectly fine.

If we agree, then that is good.

"Death reigned even over those who did not sin in the manner of Adam [transgress]". Paul says there is a group "under Law", and there is a group "without Law"; you deny that. The problem is not mine.

OK Well I guess our discussion has run its course; I trust your vanity will be evident to readers.

There is a group that is "under Law", and there is a group that is "without Law" : not all men were "under Law". Period.

With or without the Law, men died for sinning, so your entire false argument is moot : men die because of sin, even all the hundreds of years prior to the giving of the Law (which you vainly claim is needed to "define" men as sinners--then you want to use this vain false logic to claim...

Whether or not men are "under Law" is irrelevant with respect to whether or not they have to pay the price for sinning (ie, death)--Gentiles, who were "without Law", died bc of sin, and Christians, who are "not under Law" will die if they walk in sin, even if you wanted to claim the Law could no...

Nope : Paul describes a group that is "under Law" (the Jews), and he describes another group that is "without Law" (non-Jews). It really is quite a simple conclusion to arrive at : it is not possible that all men are "under Law", since there is a group that is "without Law". "Not sure" why you...

Nope : sin was in the world, and death reigned over the sinners (men died), even though they did not have the Law. Or do we have a record of men not dying in the many hundreds of years before the Law of Moses was given? Now, again, the fact that men died because they were sinners even before the...

I don't at all deny these things; I also think it is a possibility that a person could be trusting in their own righteousness. However, I don't think it is vital to your topic, so you shouldn't feel obligated to address it. I think I see that we do not agree--you have a view, and I have a view...

You haven't addressed anything I've said, you've merely done what you've claimed I've done--ie, posted your cherry-picked verses and shared your anti-Scriptural thoughts. What I have done is I have met your claims head-on, and what you have done is you have refused to address my objections. I...

I deny that all men were under Law before grace. The reason is Paul describes two groups of people : those under Law, and those without Law. I have shown you the Scriptures to this effect, and I await even the recognition of this fact, and, from there, I will await an actual justification for...

Romans 5 13For sin was in the world before the law was given; but sin is not taken into account when there is no law. 14NEVERTHELESS, death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who did not sin in the way that Adam transgressed. He is a pattern of the One to come. Therefore, as stated...

1 I don't know if I am a Gentile, bc we come from theJews who fled Iberia, and my grandmother told me her grandfather told her, on his deathbed, his secret that he was a Jew (it had to be kept secret back then in that place). 2. If you want to dispute what I've claimed from Scripture, the...