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Reassuring them of being brought forth from the tomb as Jesus was, so that they "sorrow not as others (pagans) which have no hope". In speaking about Christ's glorious coming, doesn't Paul say "the Lord shall descend from heaven with a shout" immediately followed by "...and the dead in Christ...

"bring forth from death as Jesus was" - according to the context and Paul's chiasm. 1) "Saints" means "holy ones" which include "angels". 2) New Jerusalem will descend to Earth 1,000 years after the Resurrection of the Just with the angels and the redeemed inside at the Resurrection of the...

Nah, the Chiasm absolutely demands "bring with Him" refers to "bring forth from the tomb as Christ was" aka "the resurrection", the theme of the last half of the chapter...certainly not "celestial road trip". The only "trip" Paul even remotely refers to in the chapter is our "walk honestly...

Isn't it true the record of the sins of the forgiven polluted the earthly sanctuary year round, making necessary the cleansing of it - and wasn't the earthly patterned after the Heavenly? So then, Hebrews 9 says at this moment, right now, while every Christian is fully forgiven and...

Good, we agree that "bring with Him" doesn't refer to 'bring saints from heaven to earth". Sound, solid exegesis, friend. I only distract from the truth, and I've remained on topic, which is that dead saints are sleeping down here, not dancing and singing up there. Look, you can take or leave...

When I say "means" I'm not talking about "defined as" - I'm talking about "refers to". "Bring" refers to "resurrection" in the chiasm. I bring solid exegesis. Yours is textbook eisegesis, seeing that you've allowed "Thou shalt not surely die" to cloud your thinking. I add nothing - merely...

Surely, the Lord God will do NOTHING, but He revealeth His secret to His servants the prophets". Reverend S, please open the Bible and see what it says before climbing on the internet to "darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge".

Look, no one is buying your baseless argument. This classic "A-B-A-B" chiastic structure where "A" rhymes with "A" and "B" rhymes with "B" is a textbook example that any Hebrew would immediately recognize, is easily seen by any objective Bible student, and is destroyed by your false...

ICYMI, 1 Thessalonians 4:14 KJV is written as a Hebrew chiasm (meaning Hebrew Paul employed the same OT Hebrew writing style he'd been immersed in since he was knee high to a Nazarite): A. For if we believe Jesus died (death) B. and rose again (resurrection) A. them also which sleep in Jesus...

Making "bring" refer to "celestial road trip of disembodied saints from heaven to Earth" destroys Hebrew Paul's chiasm. Making it refer to "bring forth" from death in a resurrection destroys nothing, but actually: 1) preserves the chiasm 2) helps cement Paul's theme of the passage, which is the...

Sigh..doens't mindset dictate what device to use? Surely, men who grew up immersed in such a literary device would employ it when writing, just as an American who learned to write in Hebrew would tell a story and use Western literary device to put the climax at the end of the story, instead of...

Can you provide a Biblical reason for excluding "bring (forth)" as a candidate meaning for G71, especially when doing so destroys Hebrew Paul's chiasm? For if we believe Jesus died (death) and rose again (resurrection) them also which sleep in Jesus (death) will God bring with Him...

I hope many more read of them, too ;) "Hebrew" refers to the mindset, not the language. To argue that Hebrew men who grew up immersed in Hebrew Chiastic Old Testament writings would not employ the same writing style in Greek is extremely naive, especially since we see so many examples in the...

I can't force you to read G71 and admit that "bring (forth)" is included by Strong as one of its meanings, but I can kindly withdraw from pointless discussions with people who find that facts are unkind to their beliefs. So, until you read G71 and acknowledge this, good day, sir ;)

Sure it does, if we consider that the rewards of the wicked are determined before Jesus leaves the Most Holy place and comes back to Earth in glory - the NT "antitype" which meets the OT "type". Then, since God rules by committee (1 Kings 22:19-22 KJV), the resurrected saints will have 1,000...

I took the trouble making two red highlights in your post so that hopefully after reading the first, you'll reconsider the second. Not if "resurrection" and "bring forth" from the grave means the same thing...which is absolutely the case. It's really condescending for you to assume I need to...

See, your interpretation destroys the Hebrew Chiasm by making "bring" refer to a celestial roadtrip instead of to what if refers: being brought forth from the grave in like manner as Christ was brought forth. (DEATH) For if we believe that Jesus DIED (RESURRECTION) and ROSE again (DEATH) even...

John Wesley, like all the great Protestant Reformers, knew the First Beast of Revelation 13 was the Roman catholic papacy, and that its 1,260 year reign would last from its inception in 538 A.D. to 1798 A.D. Wesley, in his circa 1770 A.D. commentary on Revelation 13, wrote that the time of the...

Yes, after the 1,000 reign in heaven, when New Jerusalem comes down to a desolate Earth, Jesus resurrects the dead wicked and judges them before casting them into the fire that falls down from God and consumes them and the entire Earth, eradicating all traces of sin, before creating the New...

To those who preach 1 Thessalonians 4:14 is proof the saints go straight to heaven at death, it's important to consider the following: This passage is a Hebrew Chiasm - a well known Hebrew poetic literary method in which, not words, but ideas are rhymed. Psalms 33:6,9 is a well known example...