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exactly!

ATP, your problem is Cognitive Dissidence. You can't handle the unwelcome reality of conditional salvation based on total surrender of mind and body members to Christ so you default to the unbiblical doctrine of OSAS in the attempt to obtain through the dead faith of absentee obedience that...

If merely "believing" is surrender, then why are the believing devils trembling? The lengths that the dead faith of OSAS will go to establish itself, including REDEFINING words like "surrender" :rolleyes: No, ATP, "surrender" means to "submit to another's authority" and those who refuse to...

ATP, no one lied to us. No Bible writer, including John ever taught that confidence in Christ's salvation can accompany active rebellion to Christ.

We can be confident in our salvation if we are surrendered to Jesus, which everyone will agree is truth.

The Bible says "he that believeth AND is baptized shall be saved", which refers to water baptism, and not Holy Ghost baptism alone. What about that?

ATP, if you want to try and obtain eternal life by the dead faith of OSAS, they go ahead, but you should know that we can only obtain that by living faith. You MUST obey the commandments of God because refusal to do so proves to the world and the universe at large that you do not have Jesus in...

BTW, if the Unmerciful Servant didn't believe that he was forgiven, then he's an idiot because the condemned don't have the ability to walk the streets and track down other people who owe them money.

Did you even read what I said? I said the death you crossed over from was ETERNAL, yet you are still able to cross over from that, so you can't use "eternal" as an operative word for claiming the inability to cross back over from life to death. "Consistency, thou art a jewel." You can't have...

OSAS is the belief that dead faith can obtain that which only living faith can obtain: eternal life.

Brother, the death from which you crossed over to life was also "eternal", so "eternal" is no proof at all that you can't cross back over to death. :rolleyes: BTW, the Unmerciful Servant crossed back over from forgiveness to condemnation, right?

The devils also believe and tremble, yet they do not have eternal life. You will say, "But, there's more to the story regarding demons...." I find that incredible that you're willing to admit there's more to the story regarding this, but when you're shown countless other chapters in the story...

I've already shared that point with him, but to no avail. It's like herding cats. SMH

OK, if we do that we have eternal life, but where's the proof that you can't cross back into death from that verse?

Brother ATP, you seem to be avoiding my "dead faith" versus "living faith" point. Do you see the distinction and that the "faith" versus you point to for support for OSAS are "living faith" versus?

What I have figured out is that by excluding the context of Ephesians 2:10 KJV, you have rendered Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV a pretext and a pretext is a poor foundation for which to base OSAS. The "faith" of Ephesians 2:8-10 KJV is the same "faith" of 1 Peter 1:3-5 KJV: "living faith" not dead...

Yes, it is "kept in heaven for us, who through faith are shielded" from death, but... ...is that the dead faith of OSAS or the living faith of those who keep the Ten Commandments? My brother, I appreciate your sincerity, but I asked for a verse that proves OSAS, so please try again...

Why do you always accuse those who disagree with you as not knowing Jesus, and thereby seat yourself down in the Judgement Seat of Christ? It is the Spirit of Antichrist which seeks to take the place of Christ and "ye know not what spirit ye are of" when you do so. Please stop it.

OSAS is a doctrine which has convinced those who possess dead that they may obtain that which comes only by living faith - eternal life. But the sad reality is that they really do not believe OSAS in the first place! Proof? If OSAS Christians really believe that they are free to kill others...

Show me one verse which teaches in no uncertain terms that we cannot lose salvation.