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  1. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Hi Retro, You asked, "Do you believe in the plenary verbal inspiration of the Bible in the original manuscripts; that is, do you believe that, in the original manuscripts, the Ruach haQodesh gave the authors EVERY WORD that they were to write?” No, I don’t. 2 Tim. 3:16 - “All scripture is...
  2. Trekson

    End Times Optimism

    Hi Vet, Your words: "Seeking to 'fly away' to save one's soul from the tribulation event is not a show of believing we as Christians already have the victory through Christ." Again for the umpteenth time, the church will be here and endure the great trib, but thank God that great trib will end...
  3. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Hi Retro, I will answer your post early next week but I have a couple of questions. 1. Are you a regular Messianic or a "militant one" who believes in the HRM and would follow someone like Michael Rood? 2. Do you believe the NJ comes down at the beginning or end of the millennium?
  4. Trekson

    Revealing the Sons of God.

    Hi Axehead, Your ( I realize you copied them from Fowler) charts seem to misplace the vials. Does he consider that the "defeat of evil"? I would put Armageddon at that point. I don't think the order is right either, imo. You have seals, trumpets, beasts, Babylon, defeat of evil in a seeming...
  5. Trekson

    Two witnesses 2+2=2?

    Hi Raeneske, Your words: "Please give me the basis that the 490 years actually meant Over 2000 years." Could anyone satisfactorily answer that question? No. But consider this. There are many prophecies in the OT that have yet to be fulfilled. That is the main reason Israel's leaders rejected...
  6. Trekson

    Two witnesses 2+2=2?

    Hi Raeneske, Let's take a closer look at this passage. I believe this prophecy should be taken "literally" and not symbolicaly as the fulfillments were literal. Jesus was literally "cut off" by crucifixion, however...(words in parenthesis mine) "Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people (...
  7. Trekson

    Two witnesses 2+2=2?

    Hi Raeneske, Your words: "Now, for those who say Daniel's 70th week is in the future, there is not even a shred of Biblical evidence for such a thing. An illogical time gap was inserted between Daniel's 69th week and Daniel's 70th week, to bring about the 7 year tribulation period. Daniel's 70...
  8. Trekson

    Mark of the Beast

    I agree that it will be a physical mark of some sort. I don't believe this is meant to be taken "symbolically".
  9. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Hi Retro, OK you get 2 brownie points for being a fellow trekker (trekkies are young trekkers), however seeing as you're a long-winded feller, I need to ask you a favor. You seem to be an intellectual type guy and I am not. You can be a danger to your fellow board members 'cause when you get...
  10. Trekson

    Why Should the Church Endure the Great Trib?

    Hmmm Weighing options... Hermeneutic or Holy Spirit, Hermeneutic or Holy Spirit. I think I'll stay with the Holy Spirit!
  11. Trekson

    Why Should the Church Endure the Great Trib?

    Kaotic, Your words: "Is that why verse 10 reads, "Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him." What's your point? whether we are alive or dead we should live together with him. Sounds like a pre-wrath rapture affirmation to me! Regarding your supposed...
  12. Trekson

    Why Should the Church Endure the Great Trib?

    Kaotic, Here's the definition of the word "salvation" per the Strong's G4991 - "rescue, safety, deliver". Soul salvation is not in sight with this verse.
  13. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    There is nothing to defend. If you were to do a study on the "day", last day", "day of the Lord", "that day", etc. all referencing the "day of the Lord", first, it would take you next to a life time and secondly you would see that it contains everything from the 7th seal until the GWTJ. The...
  14. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    I change and add nothing, you're the one trying to pound a round peg into a square hole, not me.
  15. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Hi Retro, All I can say dude is you're really lacking in imagination. All of Christ's teachings on the kingdom of heaven is ours as we appropriate it by faith. If you don't want to believe in heaven I guess you don't have to but I assure you, you won't be disappointed when we get there. I mean...
  16. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    If you desire to continue to be blinded by your fallacies, so be it. I've been here with you before. Time will tell.
  17. Trekson

    Why Should the Church Endure the Great Trib?

    I believe I can answer this question through God's word. "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." I think it's safe to assume that the whole bible is God's message to the church in one way or another via 2 Tim. 3:16 - “All scripture is given by inspiration of God...
  18. Trekson

    What Should A Person Do If They Miss The Rapture ?

    Hi Oliver, Your words: "The great tribulation that Jesus spoke of in Matthew 24 is the wrath of God on the world." The great trib (satan's wrath upon the church per Rev. 12:17) and the wrath of the Lamb (trumpets) and the wrath of God (vials) are separate events. Your words: "There can be no...
  19. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Hi Kaotic, You asked reasonably, so I will reply reasonably. Your words: "Jesus say's that the gathering occurs after the tribulation. I understand this as the entire tribulation period. Where do you differ in belief than I do on that? I don't know how long it is. I just know it occurs at the...
  20. Trekson

    The pre-tribulational rapture

    Kaotic, Your words: "I know you don't believe in two raptures. But you break down the tribulation into two different periods. And that's the fabrication you use to fit your eschatology." No, I don't have to fabricate anything, I just read the word as written. I don't lump things together just...