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  1. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    So there's quite a bit in that post, but is this ~ "how do you explain Romans 10:9-10 and Acts 16:31 ?" ~ the only question? Well, two questions, I suppose... Is that right? Grace and peace to you.
  2. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    You can probably figure it out, if you, you know, actually think about it. :) But, hey, I'm here to help if you like... :) You may possibly already do this ~ understand Scripture as a whole in this way ~ but it seems to me you don't now see Scripture as covenantal ~ and incremental...
  3. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    For? I reserve the right to... be forgetful... from time to time... :) Grace and peace to you.
  4. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Yes. :) Ah, so no longer is there anyone out there who will but have not yet come to Christ.... Hmmm... :) According to Scripture, God's completion of Israel is what will prompt the return of Christ. So, if what you say here is so, then why hasn't Jesus come back yet, and executed the...
  5. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    You misunderstand. I agree that no promise of God is greater than another in this wooden sense. But rather, "lesser" (in quotes) in that it is not the full manifestation of the one ~ "greater" in this sense, of full manifestation ~ Promise. Consider this: This is covenantal thinking, which is...
  6. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Fantastic! This is what Paul exhorts us to specifically in Romans 11:18 ("do not be arrogant toward the branches... remember it is not you who support the Root, but the Root that supports you"), as you understand, I think. Remember what Paul writes to the Philippians, that none of us should...
  7. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    All the ones that are elect of God. As Paul says, "not all who are descended..." (physically) "...from Israel belong to Israel, ..." (the Israel of God) "...and not all are children of Abraham because they are his..." (physical) "... offspring..." I would disagree that Paul prophesied that all...
  8. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Well, what is the "end?" In Romans 9 through 11, what is God's end? It is God's saving all of His elect, which includes Jews and Gentiles... bringing His Israel to completion. And I would say that God, by the work of His Spirit in a person's heart ~ "provoking" someone to a godly jealousy (*)...
  9. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Natural descendants, yes, "by the letter," as Paul puts it in Romans 2, so ethnic Jews. But they are not necessarily of God's Israel; they are not, and not true Jews of God, if they are not in Christ. They are the ones who have been "broken off," but it is possible for them to be re-grafted...
  10. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Me, too, but you replied anyway, so, I did. :) Yes. But His promises have a lesser and a greater fulfillment. The lesser points to the greater, and the greater includes ~ not "replaces" ~ the lesser. No. It always was and always will be what it is. Okay, well yeah, don't. Me, either. :)...
  11. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Well, it's been my point a couple of times, as I said. Sure, off the same track. That's what I've been saying. You mean as if I haven't (many times)? :) Well, I agree... Lesser Israel. But certainly not "lesser" in the sense of "not as good"... :) Rather a forerunner and indication of the...
  12. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Good. I guess we'll see how it plays out, yes? :) Hmmm... well maybe that's because of where you've interacted with them. Message boards like this one are well-intentioned, but the behaviors you see out of posters, reformed or otherwise, very often can bring out... well, I won't say the...
  13. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Agreed. Absolutely agreed. But the difference between us, really, Eternal Grateful, is who you and I understand that "specific group" to actually be. I say you suppose... Well, I won't put words into your mouth. It seems obvious to me, but I'll let you answer this for yourself: Who is that...
  14. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    I mean, theological things, in general ~ or specifically ~ sure. And as you surmised, in that discussion ~ if we are to engage in such ~ I will enter into it from the reformed perspective. But even before that, before engaging in such, I think we should both agree to keep from any sort of...
  15. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Same to you., of course. Me, too, of course. No, not partially. And I would say much more fully ~ that His promises are much greater ~ than you seem to suppose, limiting them to only a specific ethnic group. I do, too, of course, but sometimes, that love can seem like something other than...
  16. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    In your opinion. And I have no problem with you saying that what I am saying is my opinion. All good, right? :) And I would say the exact same thing to you, EG. When in that same verse he says, preceding "all of Israel," Jewish and Gentile believers? Hmmm... it should be clear that the...
  17. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Okay, thanks, GG. You are not alone in thinking that. Knowingly or otherwise, many draw their views on Scripture directly from him. Others, independent as they may be, believe along the very same lines as he did. Ah, early Christian fathers and commentaries. Yes, there's a lot out there...
  18. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    So you think; I get that loud and clear. :) Yes, and together they make up all of God's Israel... as Paul says in Romans 11:26. Right, but the Gentiles are grafted in, which is to make natural from what was unnatural. Well, the distinction is cited, but then resolved. Paul says this in all...
  19. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    LOL! Yeah, I'll own that. :) So to you too I say, who is God's Israel, GG? Who makes up the Israel of God? And where... :) ...is the land of (Greater, so, true) Israel? :) Hmmm, okay, well, by the same token, maybe you should just plainly read the NT with an open mind and not by listening...
  20. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    And the Israel of God consists of people of all ethnicities ~ Jew and Gentile. As Paul says, speaking to Gentiles: "Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called 'the uncircumcision' by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands ~ remember that...