Search results

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  1. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Yes. :) Yes. :) Right. I know exactly where you're going, and I'll speak to it (it will not be the first time...) when you get there. But to your statement here, I do believe ~ and God's Word is very clear about this ~ that God's love is and will be made manifest in different way regarding...
  2. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Exactly right. But again, John did not say, "God loves (us) because we first loved Him," but the very opposite. After having said in verse 7, "love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God" ~ and here again is this knowing in the same context as Paul's in Romans 8:29...
  3. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Ah. Yes. :) I mean, this thing is... these things are, actually... very straight already, God's Grace. But okay... Absolutely. In a certain sense, yes. But in Paul's context regarding God's foreknowledge of those who are in Christ in Romans 8 ~ which is further defined as His elect in...
  4. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    God never... randomly... does anything; everything He does is for His own glory. Which fits ~ as if that's surprising... ~ with what Paul says in Romans 9:21-23 regarding the elect... Yes. Agreed. Right, the Calvinist says, very emphatically, "No. Not random at all." :) That's a...
  5. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    You mean the Jesus Who Himself is God? Hmmm.... But, yes, I'm sure He knew who they all were... :) No, they were not known, in the very same context as Paul in Romans 8:29. The fact is you're.... well, not "changing," really, but mischaracterizing the context of both Jesus in Matthew 25 and...
  6. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Yes, but not what you say I did... :) I mean, not to compare myself to Jesus at all, but He tells quite a few parables, many of which are what we call Kingdom parables, saying, "The Kingdom of God is like..."... and then following that with some earthly metaphor. Right? Well, we can do that...
  7. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    You mean as if I haven't? :) And... yet again... there is no Scripture saying that He "chooses who will be lost." AH! Exactly what I have said... Each one directly follows from the one(s) previous. And again, they are in that order only because Arminius's objections were in that order...
  8. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    If they're "good Calvinists," yes. :) They (I) redefine absolutely nothing. They (I) may not define things the way you define those things, but that's neither here nor there, really; they are what they are. See above. That really can't be said; the only thing that can really be said is that...
  9. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Well, rather, for those of us that believe anything opposite each other about anything taught in God's Word, that means one of two things, that either a) one is wrong and one is right, or b) both are wrong. These are the only possibilities. The only impossibilties are that a) both are right...
  10. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Continued from above (again): LOL! Well, Ulrich Zwingli (born in Switzerland in 1484) was certainly a Reformer who believed and taught many of the same things as Martin Luther (born in Germany in 1483) ~ and, later, John Calvin (a second-generation Reformer, born in France in 1509) would ~...
  11. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Continued from above: ...is a very... limited... understanding of this "knowing" in Genesis 4... and Romans 8:29. Generally speaking, it is a concrete act of the highest expression of love possible. And that's... a bit different... just a bit :) ...for human beings, as opposed to God. Isaiah...
  12. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    No, I'm not ignoring anything; read on... Right, which is a limited group, as I said; not everyone loves God, and likewise, not everyone is foreknown. So, the foreknowledge of God, in Paul's context, as I said, cannot be a mere cognitive foreknowledge; it has to be something very different...
  13. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Right, but while inadvertent, your inescapable misconception is that it is the work of man nevertheless. Not intentionally, maybe... Absolutely, unequivocally not. Absolutely not; you are. It is not me taking faith out of Paul's statement that "by grace you have been saved through faith. And...
  14. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Continued from above... Sigh. It's outward in the sense that it is administered by preachers like Peter... and John the Baptist, who says in John 1, "I baptize with water..." John's baptism ~ and no baptism administered by man (or woman) after truly washes away sin. The washing of sin is a...
  15. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Again, what you say is correct, but you are understanding God's foreknowledge in a different way ~ a mere, cognitive knowing beforehand, as if God looked forward in time and saw who would choose Him and thus predestined ~ that Paul does, as should be clearly evident in what he says in Romans...
  16. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Continued from above... Good, And, being convicted assured by God and convicted by the Spirit ~ given this faith ~ what do we then do? :) There are several correct answers to that question... :) Ah, so you're saying God gives everyone this saving faith, even as much as a mustard seed. If...
  17. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    In your opinion only. Nope. Do you understand these not to be the same thing? Born again of the Spirit? Because they are... Right, and in like manner, spiritually, the same is true: you were not spiritually alive previous to your being born spiritually, born again of the Spirit. You were...
  18. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    No, salvation depends on being one of God's elect, which depends on God and His mercy. I've never said otherwise. Sure. He has made promises, because the fulfillment of all those promises is His will. What He has promised He will surely do. You mean the guys to whom He directly stated, "You...
  19. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Well, again, it depends on what you really mean by "cannot." :) Do you mean (either/or): 1. that he or she is woodenly unable, incapable, and thus cannot? In this case, my claim is absolutely not what you say here... 2. that he or she will not, because of his or her absolute predisposition...
  20. PinSeeker

    Elect or Not Elect: Why ALL Should Be Alarmed

    Yes it does... Right, so quit saying that I or any Calvinist suggests He does... LOL! Well I can't do anything to force your will, for sure... :) See what I did there? :) The first thing you say here is true, but does not necessitate the second (the in other words part). Or do you mean...