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Did you know that pruning actually stimulates growth? I have an apricot tree, and have looked in to it, and spoken with master gardeners about it.

Again, I was playing devil's advocate--there are valid arguments against it, but there are valid arguments for it (eg, the one I presented).

With more details and provisos, but effectively and substantively, I should not be able to disagree with that.

I'm going to play devil's advocate again : since we're not provided with any other material/examples to go on (to apply it to), you could describe those branches that do continue to abide in the Vine as precisely these individuals who seem to be going along with the program, but, ultimately...

@marks In other words, it's as valid to simply say, "If you've believed, and are saved, you won't fall away," as it is to say the same thing, but using all those other details. Lol

Yeah, I only used the term "false" to accommodate those who do use that term, but I would not use it--certainly not in the past, before I even knew that the concept did seem to be taught in Scripture--and I already addressed why I don't think James 2 can be referring to the invalid faith taught...

I'm laughing at the situation, not at your explanation (as if it is "silly").

I think I hold to a paradox: I believe that if you are truly saved, you can't lose it, and you're supposed to believe in that, and rest, AND those who are truly saved and lose it are accounted as never having been saved, which, in a way, actually goes back to the original point (if you're truly...

See, that's why I was hesitant to share this tidbit--I know it's going to add ammunition against my views. LOL But why should I protect myself? And I think it really has edified me to get into the conversations and to consider the things that have been brought to consideration through the...

Before, I didn't think so--because I'd seen no evidence for it--but, now, I think it is possible that, in Scripture, "believe" can refer to an invalid belief or a valid belief. The issue of "become a child of God" is also complicated...

To me, this is a different issue--falling away--but I haven't considered it through the lens of John's Gospel. There is more, along these lines, I want to say about John's Gospel, but I'm not sure it is the right time. Maybe some other time I will mention it.

Well, most gays weren't gay, but were changed by life circumstances, but most gays don't change back, because homosexuality is a powerful delusion/illicit desire. I'm not going to discuss the topic with you, because it is my experience that you all pretend to be interested in facts, but only as...

I wouldn't necessarily go that far just yet.. because they received the Word into their hearts, which is, technically speaking, faith...

I meant there seems to be a continuity between "If you remain in My Word, you will prove you are truly My disciples", and this idea of "invalid/false belief", and "they went out from among us to prove they were never of us".

I was just surprised that true and false faith actually existed in Scripture at all.

No, I'm saying that this invalid faith seems not to result in God placing one into Christ where the eternal life is.

I'm wanting to zero in on "true and false faith".

1. As mentioned in my preface, I don't take James 2 as referring to true and false faith. 2. I see 1 Jn 2 as having other potential interpretations--therefore (and bc I hadn't seen "false faith" proven as even existing through Scripture), in times past, I was hesitant to interpret it in that...

They could not "abide" Christ's Word. Therefore, they didn't really believe in the actual Christ--they were titillated that this could be the one they had waited for, that would do the things they had expected, carnal opinions and hopes about what Messiah would be (eg, "Our fathers ate manna...

Clarification : don't want to discuss this topic.