22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

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Spiritual Israelite

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Found also in Revelation 19. The LoF is introduced along with Death in the Seals. Now we see 3 places of judgment: sheol, Death, and the LOF. We know they are separated, because eventually sheol and Death are cast into the LOF. Do you have the specifics of who goes where?
Of course I do if you're talking about people. It's spelled out for us.

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

It couldn't be any more clear. All whose names are not written in the book of life will be cast into the lake of fire. Very simple.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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Mortal survivors live during the Millennial period. The Millennial period is NOT the final age.
It's easy to make claims like this, but can you back them up with scripture? I don't believe you can. Can you tell me how you interpret this passage:

Luke 20:34 Jesus replied, “The people of this age marry and are given in marriage. 35 But those who are considered worthy of taking part in the age to come and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage, 36 and they can no longer die; for they are like the angels. They are God’s children, since they are children of the resurrection.

How about this passage:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. 11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12 as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. 13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.

If you can give me an interpretation of these passage that is at least somewhat feasible, then you would be the first Premil that I've ever seen do so.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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Premil is totally preoccupied with, and dependent upon, one chapter in the Bible – Revelation 20. It interprets the rest of Scripture in the light of its opinion of one lone highly-debated chapter located in the most figurative and obscure book in the Bible. All end-time Scripture is viewed through the lens of Revelation 20.
This sums it all up. It is not a good approach to interpreting scripture at all. Instead, we should interpret Revelation 20 in light of more clear, straightforward scripture, as Amils do. It's very ironic that we Amils get accused of spiritualizing everything, when the fact of the matter is that the passages we use as the foundation of our doctrine are contain very literal and straightforward text.

This is not a very wise way to establish any truth or doctrine.
That's for sure.

Take this passage out of the equation and Premillennialism has nothing in the inspired pages to support their main tenets.
Agree.

Amils have a problem with, and very much disagree with this form of hermeneutics and exegesis of many Scriptures.
Absolutely.

Premil hangs its doctrine on a very precarious frayed thread: that of Revelation 20 following Revelation 19 chronologically in time. To hold this, it has to dismiss the different recaps (or different camera views pertaining to the intra-Advent period) that exist throughout the book of Revelation, divorce it from repeated Scripture on this matter and also explain away the clear and explicit climactic detail that pertains to Revelation 19. Premil is dependent upon the dubious premise that Revelation 20 is chronological to Revelation 19. That is it! Disprove that and Premil falls apart.
Right again.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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This is a distortion of the truth. Saying there is a "past" and a "future" to me doesn't mean the world is divided up only into two time periods. "Ages" tend to be directed, in biblical context, to periods of particular prophetic significance, such as when Israel was under judgment, and kept out of the place of blessing. We may classify "ages" differently, depending on how we're applying them.

The Age to Come was understood by the Jewish People to refer to the Messianic Age, or to the Kingdom Age.
You mean Jewish people like the Pharisees and scribes? How did that work out for them? You understand that the Jewish people were wrong about a lot of things, right?

Amillennialists dismiss this because they think Israel no longer plays a role in prophecy, rendering the need for a "Kingdom Age" of no value. And they dismiss Jewish teaching on the Kingdom Age because they think Jewish teaching has lost validity.
It never had any validity. We need to go by what is taught in scripture, not by what people like the Pharisees and scribes, who were wrong about almost everything, taught.
 
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Spiritual Israelite

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This is a distortion of the truth. Saying there is a "past" and a "future" to me doesn't mean the world is divided up only into two time periods. "Ages" tend to be directed, in biblical context, to periods of particular prophetic significance, such as when Israel was under judgment, and kept out of the place of blessing. We may classify "ages" differently, depending on how we're applying them.
Don't you think it's a good idea to look at how Jesus understood "ages"? To Him, there were only two. This temporal age that has been ongoing from the beginning of time and the eternal age to come. I think it's a good idea to try to look at things the way He did, don't you?
 

Spiritual Israelite

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Why did you not read what he said? You deliberately twist his comments. Shame on you!
It's incredible, isn't it? He does that often. He definitely does it blatantly. It's evil to do that. Does he think God isn't aware of his devious tactics? I will never understand someone going on a Christian forum and purposely lying and twisting other people's words the way he does.
 
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Spiritual Israelite

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You don't know how to apply the eschatological Kingdom properly in these verses. The Kingdom of Heaven has always existed, but it took form on earth through Israel, and now through Christian nations. But this is just a temporary form of the Kingdom, and not the Kingdom to Come, the eschatological Kingdom. You seem unable or unwilling to distinguish them?

We sign up for the Kingdom now, but our hope is in heaven, with Christ. Our hope lies purely with him, where he is in his glorified state. If he is glorified, we may become glorified through him by being taken to him at the proper time. That time is *not yet.*
Come on, Randy. You know that Amils believe that we will inherit the kingdom in its fullness in the future. To say that he is "unable or unwilling to distinguish them" is clearly not true and you know it.

We Amils believe that scripture teaches that Jesus will deliver the kingdom, which up to this point is not of this world and does not come with observation, to the Father when He returns (1 Cor 15:22-24). At that point the kingdom will be something we can observe and it will fill the entire new earth where we will dwell for eternity. As Peter said in 2 Peter 3:13, we are looking forward to a new heaven and new earth in accordance with the promise of His second coming.
 
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Spiritual Israelite

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Randy your claims of "Localized" destruction leaving surviving mortals behind is a sci-fi fairy tale found no place in scripture, the two mentions of scripture below silences your false claims

Randy it's amazing how far your denial of biblical truth will go, simple, clear, and before your eyes!

"The Fire Shall Try Every Man's Work"!

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

"The World And "ALL" That Dwell Therein!

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.
Not to mention:

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything done in it will be laid bare. 11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12 as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. 13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells.

In verse 13, when Peter refers to "his promise" he, of course, is referring to the promise of His second coming. Premils say in keeping with the promise of His second coming we are looking forward to a temporary millennial kingdom. Amils agree with Peter and say in keeping with the promise of His second coming we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth.
 
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jeffweeder

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This is a distortion of the truth. Saying there is a "past" and a "future" to me doesn't mean the world is divided up only into two time periods. "Ages" tend to be directed, in biblical context, to periods of particular prophetic significance, such as when Israel was under judgment, and kept out of the place of blessing. We may classify "ages" differently, depending on how we're applying them.

The Age to Come was understood by the Jewish People to refer to the Messianic Age, or to the Kingdom Age. Amillennialists dismiss this because they think Israel no longer plays a role in prophecy, rendering the need for a "Kingdom Age" of no value. And they dismiss Jewish teaching on the Kingdom Age because they think Jewish teaching has lost validity.

But I can't do this with biblical truth. Though it seems as if Israel will never again be a "nation of God," the Bible indicates it shall be! And Israel's personal failures, as a nation, cannot render void their Scriptures and their prophecies!

Furthermore, the NT writers referred to the Age to Come as the "Kingdom Age" in the same way the Jews did. It is not just the end of the present age, but the beginning of a new age.

The NT was written by Jews Randy and at the consummation of the ages their Messiah came...,

Heb 9
24 For Christ did not enter into a holy place made with hands, a mere copy of the true one, but [He entered] into heaven itself, now to appear in the very presence of God on our behalf; 25 nor did He [enter into the heavenly sanctuary to] offer Himself again and again, as the high priest enters the Holy Place every year with blood that is not his own. 26 Otherwise, He would have needed to suffer over and over since the foundation of the world; but now once for all at the consummation of the ages He has appeared and been publicly manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself. 27 And just as it is appointed and destined for all men to die once and after this [comes certain] judgment, 28 so Christ, having been offered once and once for all to bear [as a burden] the sins of many, will appear a second time [when he returns to earth], not to deal with sin, but to bring salvation to those who are eagerly and confidently waiting for Him.

This is the consummation of all the ages, known as the age of grace and salvation.

“Today [while there is still opportunity] if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your heart, as when they provoked Me [in the rebellion in the desert at Meribah].”

16 For who were they who heard and yet provoked Him [with rebellious acts]? Was it not all those who came out of Egypt led by Moses? 17 And with whom was He angry for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose dead bodies were scattered in the desert? 18 And to whom did He swear [an oath] that they would not enter His rest, but to those who disobeyed [those who would not listen to His word]? 19 So we see that they were not able to enter [into His rest—the promised land] because of unbelief and an unwillingness to trust in God.

2Cor 6
2 For He says,

“At the acceptable time (the time of grace) I listened to you,
And I helped you on the day of salvation.”

Behold, now is “the acceptable time,” behold, now is “the day of salvation”—


There is one more age to come after certain judgment when Jesus comes again, and it's the eternal one of rest.
 
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WPM

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It's incredible, isn't it? He does that often. He definitely does it blatantly. It's evil to do that. Does he think God isn't aware of his devious tactics? I will never understand someone going on a Christian forum and purposely lying and twisting other people's words the way he does.

I agree. He is most at home hurling ad hominem. He got demolished in the ECFs thread and he is smarting sore with bitterness toward me.
 
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WPM

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It's too bad that you didn't stick what what you were taught then because it's the truth. I notice that you didn't specifically address anything I said in my post. Why not? If you disagree with what I said, can you tell me why?

That is his MO.
 

WPM

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This is a distortion of the truth. Saying there is a "past" and a "future" to me doesn't mean the world is divided up only into two time periods. "Ages" tend to be directed, in biblical context, to periods of particular prophetic significance, such as when Israel was under judgment, and kept out of the place of blessing. We may classify "ages" differently, depending on how we're applying them.

The Age to Come was understood by the Jewish People to refer to the Messianic Age, or to the Kingdom Age. Amillennialists dismiss this because they think Israel no longer plays a role in prophecy, rendering the need for a "Kingdom Age" of no value. And they dismiss Jewish teaching on the Kingdom Age because they think Jewish teaching has lost validity.

But I can't do this with biblical truth. Though it seems as if Israel will never again be a "nation of God," the Bible indicates it shall be! And Israel's personal failures, as a nation, cannot render void their Scriptures and their prophecies!

Furthermore, the NT writers referred to the Age to Come as the "Kingdom Age" in the same way the Jews did. It is not just the end of the present age, but the beginning of a new age.

Here we go again! You make it up as you go! I will then ask you to prove it and you will avoid it. This is the frustrating circle that you constantly go in. Where do "the NT writers referre to the Age to Come as the 'Kingdom Age'?
 

WPM

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You don't know how to apply the eschatological Kingdom properly in these verses. The Kingdom of Heaven has always existed, but it took form on earth through Israel, and now through Christian nations. But this is just a temporary form of the Kingdom, and not the Kingdom to Come, the eschatological Kingdom. You seem unable or unwilling to distinguish them?

We sign up for the Kingdom now, but our hope is in heaven, with Christ. Our hope lies purely with him, where he is in his glorified state. If he is glorified, we may become glorified through him by being taken to him at the proper time. That time is *not yet.*

Premils want to literalize that which is spiritual and spiritualize that which is literal. The kingdom of God that Christ introduced was of a spiritual nature. This absolutely confounded the Pharisees and their misguided earthly carnal concept of the Messianic kingdom.

The Jewish expectation was a literal visible territorial kingdom of which the Messiah – the King – would rule over. They believed He would immediately destroy every enemy that withstood the house of Israel. Their mistaken thinking was guided by a hyper-literalist attitude to Old Testament Messianic prophecies. These Christ confronted and exposed in His teaching. This expectation of a literal visible territorial kingdom was wrong, and revealed the ignorance which controlled the Jews at that time. They had a defective perception of the nature of God’s kingdom and the manner in which it would appear.

The Messianic kingdom is here now. Can I remind you that the Messiah came as king with His kingdom a long time ago? Just because you reject that does not in any way negate it. Your theology causes you to dismiss it. Like the Pharisees, you fail to see the eschatological nature of His First Advent and the kingdom of God. That is the very reason why the Pharisees nailed Him to a tree. When Christ appeared at His first advent, the Jews imagined He would reinstate the now defunct earthly throne of Israel and reign victorious over the physical nation, restoring their ancient borders. The Jewish expectation was a literal visible territorial kingdom of which the Messiah the King would rule over. They believed He would immediately destroy every enemy that withstood the house of Israel and usher in a period of physical and spiritual bliss for Israel.

When someone gets saved they enter into the kingdom of God, which is a spiritual kingdom and incorporates the whole domain over-which the Lord Jesus Christ exercises spiritual control. This kingship refers to the whole realm in which the rule of man becomes the rule of God; it is the area where the law of God and of righteousness are pre-eminent.
 

WPM

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This is a distortion of the truth. Saying there is a "past" and a "future" to me doesn't mean the world is divided up only into two time periods. "Ages" tend to be directed, in biblical context, to periods of particular prophetic significance, such as when Israel was under judgment, and kept out of the place of blessing. We may classify "ages" differently, depending on how we're applying them.

The Age to Come was understood by the Jewish People to refer to the Messianic Age, or to the Kingdom Age. Amillennialists dismiss this because they think Israel no longer plays a role in prophecy, rendering the need for a "Kingdom Age" of no value. And they dismiss Jewish teaching on the Kingdom Age because they think Jewish teaching has lost validity.

But I can't do this with biblical truth. Though it seems as if Israel will never again be a "nation of God," the Bible indicates it shall be! And Israel's personal failures, as a nation, cannot render void their Scriptures and their prophecies!

Furthermore, the NT writers referred to the Age to Come as the "Kingdom Age" in the same way the Jews did. It is not just the end of the present age, but the beginning of a new age.

Scripture exposes your opinion. Paul confirms the finality of the return of Jesus, in 1 Corinthians 15:22-24, stating, “as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming [Gr. parousia]. Then cometh the end [Gr. telos], when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.”

Please note the careful correlation between the parousia and the telos. This is a truth that is found throughout the NT. They are synonymous with each other. There is absolutely nothing that Premillennialists can do with such a clear and climactic passage apart from deny the obvious or add unto Scripture by inserting “a thousand years” in-between the coming (parousia) of Christ and the end (telos) where it does not belong. This is the dilemma for Premil throughout the Word. They are fighting the obvious.

The Greek simply reads:

Christos – Christ
en – at
autos – His
parousia – coming
eita – then
telos – the end

The coming of the Lord is shown to be the end of the world. There is no gap of time in-between the coming of Christ, the resurrection and the end. They all belong to the one final climactic overall event.

The phrase “he shall have delivered up” comes from the single Greek word paradidomi meaning surrender, yield up, intrust, or transmit. This is what happens to the kingdom when Christ comes. He surrenders it to His Father, He yields it up.

The converse phrase “he shall have put down” comes from the single Greek word katargeo meaning: bring to nought, none effect, or abolish. This is what happens to “all” existing “rule and all authority and power” when Jesus Comes. The rule of man comes to an end and now it becomes the rule of God.

The Apostle Paul instructs the believer in 1 Corinthians 1:7-8 to “come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming [Gr. parousia] of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall also confirm you unto the end [Gr. telos], that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.”

The coming of the Lord is again associated with “the end.” We can see here how the phrases “the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ,” “the day of our Lord Jesus Christ” and “the end” are depicted as synonymous. The second coming is depicted throughout the Word as a climactic event that ushers in the conclusion of time. Within this teaching is a comforting promise for every child of God that that Christ shall “confirm” or establish or secure us “unto the end.”

The two words that are used in the New Testament to describe the start and finish of this current temporal state of time are archē meaning “beginning” and telos meaning “end.” They are the antithesis of each other. The word archē basically means the origin or the commencement. The word telos means the termination, completion or that by which a thing is finished. Notably, the Bible continually relates this phrase “the end” [Gr. telos] to the second coming. The Lord’s return is shown to usher in the completion of this age and of time.

Scripture constantly shows the creation of this earth and the beginning of this world to be the beginning of this age. Likewise, the end of this world and the regeneration of this earth is repeatedly shown to correspond with the end of this age. Time and history find themselves sandwiched in between these two great events. Simply put: “this age” refers to “time” and “the age to come” or the “hereafter” refers to “eternity.”

This contradicts numerous Scriptures. It is not just that much Scripture depicts the second coming as “the end of the age/world,” it is that it labels it as “the last day” or simply “the end.” The Bible shows the resurrection/judgment of the righteous and the resurrection of the wicked to occur on “the last (or final) day” of “the last days” when Jesus comes.

Significantly, in all the references re the last day that I gave Randy above (which he avoided), the wording in the original for “last day” is always identical – eschatee heemara. The Greek word eschatee used here comes from the root word eschatos, from where we get our word English eschatology, and simply means end, last, farthest or final.
 

Randy Kluth

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Scripture exposes your opinion. Paul confirms the finality of the return of Jesus, in 1 Corinthians 15:22-24, stating, “as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming [Gr. parousia]. Then cometh the end [Gr. telos], when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.”

Please note the careful correlation between the parousia and the telos. This is a truth that is found throughout the NT. They are synonymous with each other. There is absolutely nothing that Premillennialists can do with such a clear and climactic passage apart from deny the obvious or add unto Scripture by inserting “a thousand years” in-between the coming (parousia) of Christ and the end (telos) where it does not belong. This is the dilemma for Premil throughout the Word. They are fighting the obvious.

What a colossal waste of energy, arguing that the kingdoms of the world become the Kingdom of God and Jesus! That is what we read in Rev 11 pertaining to the 2nd Coming and the end of the age. Nobody disputes this! Premils don't dispute it. Amils don't dispute it. It is not an argument!

The end of the age is the beginning of the Kingdom Age which, according to Rev 20, lasts a literal thousand years. Your problem is you don't *believe* it.

The coming of the Lord is shown to be the end of the world.

Oh really? My Bible reads that the world never ends. The earth is everlasting!
Psa 104.5 He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.
Psa 119.90 Your faithfulness continues through all generations; you established the earth, and it endures.
Ecc 1.4 Generations come and generations go, but the earth remains forever.


The end of the current age signals the end of Israel's greatest period of Punishment, aka the Great Tribulation. It ends by giving Israel and the Christian nations a new beginning, taking the knowledge of the Lord and covering the earth with it, as "the waters cover the sea." It will be an age when sinful man is subdued by the rule of Christ and by is glorious Church. We don't need to even know the length of time to know that it will be. It is said many times in the OT Prophets, and it was promised to Abraham.
 

Randy Kluth

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Come on, Randy. You know that Amils believe that we will inherit the kingdom in its fullness in the future. To say that he is "unable or unwilling to distinguish them" is clearly not true and you know it.

You misread me. The implication is that he is misapplying the temporal Kingdom of God and the eschatological Kingdom of God in the Scriptures that he is applying to prove Amil. Go back and look at how he's applying his Scriptures (#2491). They are improperly applying current application of God's Kingdom in our world today by confusing it with the eschatological Kingdom of the future.
 
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Randy Kluth

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The NT was written by Jews Randy and at the consummation of the ages their Messiah came...,

Yes, the Millennial Age, as believed by Jews, begins with Messiah's Kingdom which indeed will bring Israel's consummate salvation and the consummate fulfillment of the world of faith promised to Abraham. Jesus provided for that legally at the cross. And he will begin the fulfillment of his redemptive plan for earth in the Millennium, in my opinion.

We both believe in Christ. But I believe God promised to do something with the current world before the New Creation. And that hasn't happened yet. It must happen, in my view, in the coming Millennial Kingdom Age.
 

Randy Kluth

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It's too bad that you didn't stick what what you were taught then because it's the truth.

I abandoned Amil because I thought it *not* the truth! Revelation 20 teaches a literal Millennium--not a symbolic one. Shame on you for telling me to twist the very book that warns us not to do that!

I notice that you didn't specifically address anything I said in my post. Why not? If you disagree with what I said, can you tell me why? Luke 20:34-36 indicates that those who are found to be worthy to obtain the age to come won't die anymore. So, where do these mortals come from that you believe will populate the age to come? Jesus clearly knew nothing of them or else He wouldn't have said that those who obtain the age to come won't die anymore.

I've answered this before, and I can do it again. The world does not *end* at the 2nd Coming. The Bible specifically forbids that. Any language that *sounds* like that is talking about devastation that happens all across the earth--not the end of the planet. It is talking about the end of rule by pagan nations over God's Kingdom on earth.

So you now have to prove that everybody dies at the 2nd Coming. And that runs up against the OT Prophets who taught that Israel would be restored, nationally, one last time, "never to be defeated again." That hasn't happened, and it will happen, I believe, in the Kingdom of God. At that time we are told that the glorious Church will reign together with Christ and subdue the mortal nations, which implies that they still have a sin nature and pagan tendencies. They will have to be "subdued."

Now if you want to know where Jews get their beliefs that the Prophets taught this final restoration you can go to them. Or we can discuss it ourselves? But not just Israel was promised fulfillment as a nation of God. There also has to be "many" nations of God, in accordance with God's promise to Abraham. Christian nations are presently failing, and so, we should expect this to be fulfilled in the Kingdom of God, as well. All of these nations, called to serve God, must be restored. And it will happen when Satan's rule comes to an end, and his own Kingdom, invested in Antichrist, is completely destroyed.
 

Randy Kluth

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You mean Jewish people like the Pharisees and scribes? How did that work out for them? You understand that the Jewish people were wrong about a lot of things, right?

It never had any validity. We need to go by what is taught in scripture, not by what people like the Pharisees and scribes, who were wrong about almost everything, taught.

It's a big mistake to reject the Jewish Scriptures simply because spiritually-bankrupt Jewish leaders claimed they believed in them. Jesus said, even in his own time, that his disciples should do what they say, but not what they do. In other words, their beliefs may be right, even though they themselves are corrupt and devious.
 

jeffweeder

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We both believe in Christ. But I believe God promised to do something with the current world before the New Creation.

God promised to save the world by sending his only begotten Son to atone...that whosoever of all nations shall believe in him shall be saved. When this current age consummates at the second coming, the righteous are the only ones left standing, just like the flood in Noah's day only left the righteous.

As it was in the days of Noah so shall it be in the days of the coming of the Son of man

2Thess 1
4 Therefore, we speak of you with pride among the churches of God for your steadfastness [your unflinching endurance, and patience] and your firm faith in the midst of all the persecution and [crushing] distress which you endure. 5 This is a positive proof of the righteous judgment of God [a sign of His fair verdict], so that you will be considered worthy of His kingdom, for which indeed you are suffering. 6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with distress those who distress you, 7 and to give relief to you who are so distressed and to us as well when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in a flame of fire, 8 dealing out [full and complete] vengeance to those who do not [seek to] know God and to those who ignore and refuse to obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus [by choosing not to respond to Him].

9 These people will pay the penalty and endure the punishment of everlasting destruction, banished from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day [that is, glorified through the changed lives of those who have accepted Him as Savior and have been set apart for His purpose], and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed and trusted [and confirmed in your lives].
 
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