22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

[covenantee]

The promises are IN him, not us.

You only get to enjoy a smidgin' of it now.

Quit pretending that this demon infested world is the best that Jesus can do for mankind.

Satan has whooped mankind for 6000 years, but he is going to take a 1000 year break and Jesus will reign uncontested.

Certainly. But He shares.

2 Peter 1:4
Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

That's no smidgin.

Quit denigrating Christ and elevating Satan.

Satan was defeated at Calvary, whether you think so or not.

 

[St. Joseph]

Prove what you allege! There is not a single verse found in Scripture to support Christ reigning on this earth for ONE thousand years! Nowhere to be found in the Old Testament or the New! It's a doctrine invented from the minds of men! Unless you can prove what you allege through supporting Scripture you have given nothing but your uncorroborated OPINION!

And to me.... My opinion is all that matters

 

[WPM]

Op Note

It is hard to believe when I started this thread that it would gain 100,000 views. But, congratulations to everyone who has taken part in this discussion. Hopefully, it has been a help to those watching on. When you add the 13k who engaged on the similar thread "23 major reasons to reject the Premil doctrine," it is quite a figure.

 

[St. Joseph]

Op Note

It is hard to believe when I started this thread that it would gain 100,000 views. But, congratulations to everyone who has taken part in this discussion. Hopefully, it has been a help to those watching on. When you add the 13k who engaged on the similar thread "23 major reasons to reject the Premil doctrine," it is quite a figure.

Pat yourself on the back if you need the praise

 

[rwb]

And to me.... My opinion is all that matters

Well your opinion is NOT biblical fact if you cannot prove from the Scripture! So, while your opinion is all that matters to you, it holds no merit for most who post in these forums, who desire to hear what sayeth the Bible and not your opinions! I understand your dilemma because there is no verse found in Scripture to support Christ reigning on the earth for ONE thousand years.

 

[WPM]

Pat yourself on the back if you need the praise

LOL. Relax! Read it and see that I thanked everyone for taking part. That even includes you.

When are you going back to church in obedience with God's clear directive in Scripture or do you struggle being around people?

 

[rwb]

Pat yourself on the back if you need the praise

He doesn't have to! Because there are many here who appreciate and applaud Paul's knowledge of the Scriptures! Well done, Paul, we all applaud your hard work even though some here really wish you would just stop repeatedly proving how lacking premillennial doctrine really is.

 

[St. Joseph]

Well your opinion is NOT biblical fact if you cannot prove from the Scripture! So, while your opinion is all that matters to you, it holds no merit for most who post in these forums, who desire to hear what sayeth the Bible and not your opinions! I understand your dilemma because there is no verse found in Scripture to support Christ reigning on the earth for ONE thousand y

LOL. Relax! Read it and see that I thanked everyone for taking part. That even includes you.

When are you going back to church in obedience with God's clear directive in Scripture or do you struggle being around people?

God never said go to church. He said worship him in spirit and in truth. Not at the temple or the mountains. And dont take "the assembling of yourselves together"out of context.

 

[WPM]

And to me.... My opinion is all that matters

Wow! That says it all!!! No wonder you are closed to hearing the truth from others.

 

[St. Joseph]

Wow! That says it all!!! No wonder you are closed to hearing the truth from others.

When i hear truth i listen. You're the one admitting you dont want to hear.
Remember? Download it!!!

 

[WPM]

God never said go to church. He said worship him in spirit and in truth. Not at the temple or the mountains. And dont take "the assembling of yourselves together"out of context.

What do you mean "out of context"? There's only one meaning in the text. Obviously, you are convicted of it, the fact you dismissed it before I even presented it. Let the Holy Spirit convict you and then yield to what He is telling you.

You have swallowed a lie that says “forsake the assembling of yourselves together, so much the more, as ye see the day approaching."

This says more about you than anything else.

Hebrews 10:24-25

24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

The context of Hebrews 10:24-25 is fellowship and the necessity of it. We should not miss the Holy Spirit’s introductory remarks on the subject in v 24 is: “let us consider one another.” Being a Christian is not about us, it is about (1) God and (2) about others and (3) us. In fact ministry is about others. It is a selfless thing. It is a giving thing. It is dying to self and self-interest.

It is my experience in Northern Ireland and here that people that argue they don’t need to go to church are selfish. Their Christian walk is all about what they want or think. They have little to give others, and have little care either.

They have no concept of serving the body.

 

[WPM]

When i hear truth i listen. You're the one admitting you dont want to hear.
Remember? Download it!!!

Why would I? I am not going to listen to your Pretrib downloads. If you cannot show us any OT or NT Scripture that teaches your pet-doctrine then I am not going to waste my valuable time listening someone else who believes the same.

 

[St. Joseph]

I am not going to listen to your Pretrib downloads. If you cannot show us any OT or NT Scripture that teaches your pet-doctrine then I am not going to waste my valuable time listening someone else to believes the same.

Why would I? I am not going to listen to your Pretrib downloads. If you cannot show us any OT or NT Scripture that teaches your pet-doctrine then I am not going to waste my valuable time listening someone else who believes the same.

You're still my brother in Christ. And when we get to heaven I'm going to be coming over to your house everyday

 

[St. Joseph]

Well your opinion is NOT biblical fact if you cannot prove from the Scripture! So, while your opinion is all that matters to you, it holds no merit for most who post in these forums, who desire to hear what sayeth the Bible and not your opinions! I understand your dilemma because there is no verse found in Scripture to support Christ reigning on the earth for ONE thousand years.

You have the wrong concept of bible study.
Opinions are arrived from gathering and studying material to interpret and form a belief or an opinion. Even on facts already established,to get to other meanings and different levels. The biblie may not use the words,millennium, or rapture. But the meaning is there. The word homosexual is not used in Romans 1. But we know what Paul means.
If everything was laid out clearly like reading Tom Sawyer,where would the study be?
The rapture,millennium all sorts of things are there. With the Holy Spirit as a teacher,you have to dig it out.

What does Isaiah 11 say to you?

 

[rwb]

You have the wrong concept of bible study.
Opinions are arrived from gathering and studying material to interpret and form a belief or an opinion. Even on facts already established,to get to other meanings and different levels. The biblie may not use the words,millennium, or rapture. But the meaning is there. The word homosexual is not used in Romans 1. But we know what Paul means.
If everything was laid out clearly like reading Tom Sawyer,where would the study be?
The rapture,millennium all sorts of things are there. With the Holy Spirit as a teacher,you have to dig it out.

What does Isaiah 11 say to you?

In other words you still cannot prove from Scripture what you allege is biblical truth.

 

[WPM]

You have the wrong concept of bible study.
Opinions are arrived from gathering and studying material to interpret and form a belief or an opinion. Even on facts already established,to get to other meanings and different levels. The biblie may not use the words,millennium, or rapture. But the meaning is there. The word homosexual is not used in Romans 1. But we know what Paul means.
If everything was laid out clearly like reading Tom Sawyer,where would the study be?
The rapture,millennium all sorts of things are there. With the Holy Spirit as a teacher,you have to dig it out.

What does Isaiah 11 say to you?

Why do you keep diluting down God's condemnation of homosexuality in the Bible. Do you have you something to confess?

According to the Bible, homosexuality is sinful and wrong and explicitly shown to be an offence to a thrice-holy God. Romans 1:21-28:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

The word translated “unseemly” here (aschemosune pronounced as-kay-mos-oo'-nay) actually means indecency or shameful.

The word translated “convenient” (katheko pronounced kath-ay'-ko) means proper, suitable and appropriate.

Homosexuality is not legitimate sexual behaviour, it is sin. It is not natural for a man in his 40s to be running about in a diaper.

It is not sin that defines who you are today, it is Jesus Christ. I do not understand it when some Christians identify (or introduce) themselves by their sin. They are not getting it!

Listen to 1 Corinthians 6:9–11:

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Your identity is no longer who you used to be, it is your new spiritual life in Christ Jesus. After all, when you turn from your sins, and turn to Christ, you do not have a past.

• The things we used to love we now hate.
• The things we used to hate we now love.

Genesis 18:20 the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;

Genesis 19:15-16, records of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, “And when the morning arose, then the angels hastened Lot, saying, Arise, take thy wife, and thy two daughters, which are here; lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of the city.

Genesis 19:24-25 records, “the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven.” And continues, “he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.”

Lev 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Judges 7-8

7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

1 Kings 15:11-14 Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... And he took away the sodomites out of the land ... Asa's heart was perfect with the LORD all his days.

1 Kings 42:42-46 Jehoshaphat ... walked in all the ways of Asa his father; he turned not aside from it, doing that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... The remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land.

Jesus said in Matthew 19:4-6: “Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they two shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder

God created marriage; He alone determines what marriage is. And what type of environment is healthy, safe and secure to bring up children.

You cannot divorce God from His Word. Embrace this Book and you embrace God, reject this Book and you reject God.

 

[St. Joseph]

In other words you still cannot prove from Scripture what you allege is biblical truth.

I cant do you're studying for you,no.

But then it is only your "opinion",that scripture does not support the rapture.
It is your "opinion",that if there is not a verse with the exact words,then its not there.
How do you study? Just read?

 

[St. Joseph]

Why do you keep diluting down God's condemnation of homosexuality in the Bible. Do you have you something to confess?

According to the Bible, homosexuality is sinful and wrong and explicitly shown to be an offence to a thrice-holy God. Romans 1:21-28:

21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

The word translated “unseemly” here (aschemosune pronounced as-kay-mos-oo'-nay) actually means indecency or shameful.

The word translated “convenient” (katheko pronounced kath-ay'-ko) means proper, suitable and appropriate.

Homosexuality is not legitimate sexual behaviour, it is sin. It is not natural for a man in his 40s to be running about in a diaper.

It is not sin that defines who you are today, it is Jesus Christ. I do not understand it when some Christians identify (or introduce) themselves by their sin. They are not getting it!

Listen to 1 Corinthians 6:9–11:

1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Your identity is no longer who you used to be, it is your new spiritual life in Christ Jesus. After all, when you turn from your sins, and turn to Christ, you do not have a past.

• The things we used to love we now hate.
• The things we used to hate we now love.

Genesis 18:20 the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;

Genesis 19:15-16, records of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, “And when the morning arose, then the angels hastened Lot, saying, Arise, take thy wife, and thy two daughters, which are here; lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of the city.

Genesis 19:24-25 records, “the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven.” And continues, “he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground.”

Lev 18:22 Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Leviticus 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Judges 7-8

7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

1 Kings 15:11-14 Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... And he took away the sodomites out of the land ... Asa's heart was perfect with the LORD all his days.

1 Kings 42:42-46 Jehoshaphat ... walked in all the ways of Asa his father; he turned not aside from it, doing that which was right in the eyes of the LORD ... The remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land.

Jesus said in Matthew 19:4-6: “Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they two shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more two, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder

God created marriage; He alone determines what marriage is. And what type of environment is healthy, safe and secure to bring up children.

You cannot divorce God from His Word. Embrace this Book and you embrace God, reject this Book and you reject God.

What are you raving about?
I simply said Paul did not use the word homosexual in Romans 1. But we all know that he is talking about them.
In the same way,scripture doesn't use the word rapture,but yhe meaning is there.
Try to keep up.

 

[St. Joseph]

Why would I? I am not going to listen to your Pretrib downloads. If you cannot show us any OT or NT Scripture that teaches your pet-doctrine then I am not going to waste my valuable time listening someone else who believes the same.

Where does scripture say Satan is Lucifer? No where. But you probably believe it. What do you base it on. Give ma e a verse that comes right out and says.....

In other words you still cannot prove from Scripture what you allege is biblical truth.

Tell me where in scripture does it sa Satan is Lucifer. Show one verse where it states that word for word. You cant. But do you believe they are the same?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Here is what false teachers do...

Instead of giving us a line by line explanation, they generalize the chapter.

Red flag alert.

LOL. That makes you a false teacher then since you never give a line by line explanation. I, however, have done that MANY times. Just ask others her like WPM or jeffweeder and they will confirm that for you.