A discussion on how the Old Testament applies to Christianity.

[Grailhunter]

I am thinking that beliefs will vary and that is ok.

If you think it does, explain why.

If you think it does in some ways, explain why.

I you think it does not, explain why.

I am not planning to debate the topic....this topic comes up on occasion and I thought I would give people an opportunity to get together on this topic.

 

[GISMYS_7]

OT. Is God's Word to man under the old covenant while the NT is God's Word to man under the new covenant bought with the blood of Jesus but will you believe and accept or reject??

 

[Philip James]

If you think it does, explain why

Heya Grailhunter,

I would say it applies in many ways, as a deposit of wisdom, examples to be emulated (or not), proofs and signs of just who Jesus is, other prophecy pertaining to the Church and Kingdom of God..

As an example Malachi 1:11 is a prophecy that finds its fulfillment in the sacrifice of the Eucharist.

The 'stone that becomes a mountain and fills the Earth', is Christ's body, the Church. She is Mt. Zion, the New Jerusalem,, and even now, those that have gone before us cheer us on in our pilgrimage to our heavenly home..

That said.. I would suggest that a couple chapters of who begat who are prob not that relevant..

Pax et Bonum

 

[Randy Kluth]

I am thinking that beliefs will vary and that is ok.

If you think it does, explain why.

If you think it does in some ways, explain why.

I you think it does not, explain why.

I am not planning to debate the topic....this topic comes up on occasion and I thought I would give people an opportunity to get together on this topic.

That is an incredibly vague question! "Beliefs" can mean religious orthodoxy or "opinions." With such lack of specificity, I would be here for awhile trying to cover all bases.

 

[heartwashed]

I would say that especially in Leviticus, the Old Testament speaks of sacrifices that point forward to the ultimate sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross, "the Lamb of God who taketh away the sins of the world."

Every moral tenet in the Old Testament speaks of how I can more succinctly obey the commandment of Jesus to "love the Lord my God with all of my heart, soul, mind, and strength" and "my neighbor as myself".

Other than that, there are these scriptures in the New Testament that apply.

Rom 15:4, For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

1Co 10:11, Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.

2Pe 1:3, According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4, Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

 

[Jim B]

Heya Grailhunter,

I would say it applies in many ways, as a deposit of wisdom, examples to be emulated (or not), proofs and signs of just who Jesus is, other prophecy pertaining to the Church and Kingdom of God..

As an example Malachi 1:11 is a prophecy that finds its fulfillment in the sacrifice of the Eucharist.

The 'stone that becomes a mountain and fills the Earth', is Christ's body, the Church. She is Mt. Zion, the New Jerusalem,, and even now, those that have gone before us cheer us on in our pilgrimage to our heavenly home..

That said.. I would suggest that a couple chapters of who begat who are prob not that relevant..

Pax et Bonum

Malachi 1:11, "For from the east to the west my name will be great among the nations. Incense and pure offerings will be offered in my name everywhere, for my name will be great among the nations,” says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies."

You are r-e-a-l-l-y stretching things to take this one verse out of context and claim that it finds its fulfillment in the sacrifice of the Eucharist. There is no mention of the bread or the wine. And "the Lord of Heaven’s Armies" clearly refers to God the Father.

 

[Davy]

The whole New Testament Books reveal the place of The Old Testament Books in Christian Doctrine. So really, one would have to cover the majority of The New Testament just to cover a basic understanding of this point. And it's much easier to just study The New Testament for oneself.

And for the new babe, the term 'Old Testament' simply applies to all the Books of The Old Testament. The idea of the 'old covenant' is covered mainly in the Pentatuch (first five Books that God wrote through Moses). The Books of the prophets, though written in the time when Israel was under the old covenant, are not really about the old covenant. This is important, because study in God's Old Testament prophets is a part of Christian Doctrine (2 Peter 3:2).

John 5:39
39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of Me.
KJV

 

[Charlie24]

I am thinking that beliefs will vary and that is ok.

If you think it does, explain why.

If you think it does in some ways, explain why.

I you think it does not, explain why.

I am not planning to debate the topic....this topic comes up on occasion and I thought I would give people an opportunity to get together on this topic.

My opinion on this topic, taking the words from a dear friend who has gone on to be with the Lord several years ago is this, it is impossible to understand the New Testament as God intends without having a solid knowledge of the Old.

The story of the Holy Bible is the story of Redemption! It is God's specific plan and the only way man will find his way through this thing called life and find life eternal.

If you begin reading in Matthew and on through Revelation only, you will not grasp this plan of Redemption in its true form as God intended. From the time man fell in the Garden until the cannon of scripture was completed, God gave us the knowledge of His Redemption plan in stages of time, in other words, by dispensations of time.

Man fell in the Garden and we immediately see God's Redemption plan in action. He provided Adam and Eve with coats of skin from animals who shed their blood to cover Adam and Eve.

Then we see Cain and Abel bringing sacrifices before the Lord, in which only the sacrifice of an animal by Abel was accepted. Which represented the Blood of Christ as the sacrifice for man's sin. The sacrifice of Cain was not an animal and was rejected.

Then we see Noah when immediately exiting the Ark, offered animal sacrifices before the Lord, also representing the coming Messiah and His sacrifice for man through His Blood.

Next we are given more information on His plan of Redemption when the scripture says that Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness. This is justification by faith being introduced many centuries before Paul preached it in his letters.

Then comes Moses and we are given more detail of His plan by the Law. Every detail is given to the priests as to how this sacrifice is to be done through the Sacrificial System of the Law. All of it in detail shadowing Christ as the Sacrifice for man's sin.

Then the prophets come on the seen to show the errors that Israel has made with this information, and the consequences of their actions. Then we have 400 years of silence from the scripture.

And finally we come to Matthew, the first Gospel given to us where Jesus comes on the seen. Israel has completely and totally polluted the Law of Moses with their self-righteousness in adding over 600 precepts to the Law and distorting it to unbelievable proportions. By this time very, very few had the true knowledge of the intensions of the Law.

This is the problem our Christ had with His own people. And it is my opinion that you too will have this same problem if you don't understand what the Old Testament is teaching us.

 

[Bob Estey]

I am thinking that beliefs will vary and that is ok.

If you think it does, explain why.

If you think it does in some ways, explain why.

I you think it does not, explain why.

I am not planning to debate the topic....this topic comes up on occasion and I thought I would give people an opportunity to get together on this topic.

God is quoted often in the Old Testament. Why wouldn't people want to hear what he said?

 

[Grailhunter]

God is quoted often in the Old Testament. Why wouldn't people want to hear what he said?

I guess we have advertising going on....along with some forum site quirks.

Either way, you directed this at me and I have already addressed this question.
Looking at it from another perspective; Could Christianity have been successful without the Old Testament?
The Apostles were Jews and Christ's ministry was pointed at them....but as a whole they rejected Him.
So it was not the Jewish flavor that made Christianity successful.....it was the Gentiles....Pagan converts.

Several aspects of Christianity was very familiar to the Pagans, a god impregnating a human female and the offspring being exemplarily. A single god having 3 aspects. Gods that can walk on water and heal and speak to the dead. Manifest things....like fish in a basket. But Christianity had other things that the Pagans liked, a relationship with God and an eternal heavenly reward.

There were things about Jewish history, Israelite history, or Yahwist history, Hebrew history, whatever you want to call them, that the Gentiles knew something about. And the Hebrew scriptures were there if they wanted to know...So a preface to the New Testament about some of the events leading up to Christianity might of been helpful and enough. The first Bibles....bound books....were the fifty Bibles of Constantine, around 350 AD.
"They" say they were beautifully illustrated and of course hand written but they did not include the Old Testament. All the concern was over documenting and preserving the New Testament texts.

So the point and the reason I started this thread was for people to talk about what and how the Old Testament applies to Christianity. I did not start it for me to debate. You pose the question; God is quoted often in the Old Testament. Why wouldn't people want to hear what he said? I agree that people should know what God said in the Old Testament, and the Old Testament as a whole....From there continue the discussion.

 

[Enoch111]

If you think it does in some ways, explain why.

The New Testament is chock full of quotations from and allusions to the Old Testament. That should tell you something.