A proof that the 1000 year reign of Christ with His people is in the heavenly throne room, not the earth

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Scott Downey

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Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them.

Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God,

who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands.

Who sits on these thrones?
It is His people, to those who overcome, Christ says about them and more also, but here it is about reigning with Christ in heaven.
Think about it, where is God's throne? It is in heaven, and where is Christ's throne? Well it is also in heaven.
Christ is seated on His throne at the right hand of God in heaven, not on the earth

So, these Revelation 20 scriptures must of necessity mean this reigning with Christ takes place in the heavens, not on the earth for 1000 years.

Revelation 3:21
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
 
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Davidpt

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If this poster in the OP that has me on ignore was actually interpreting Scripture with Scripture pertaining to Revelation 3:21, he would have to admit that it proves Premil, not Amil.

And here is how.

To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

2 thrones in view, obviously. Otherwise, that would mean overcomers are also granted to sit with the Father in the Father's throne, something only Jesus is worthy of, and absolutely no one else, period. Surely, not one single person would disagree with that. Or if they do, all I can say is--Wow, you have made yourself equal to Christ, you have made yourself God. That aside. Therefore, it demands 2 thrones are in view here. It is then simply a matter of determining when Jesus sits in His own throne, not His Father's throne.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

BTW, we are looking at the thousand year reign in question right here in Matthew 19:28 , it is staring at us in our face. And the following then shows the beginning of it.

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

Obviously, per Revelation 3:21 and this--My throne--well here it is plain as day, and equally plain as day He doesn't sit upon until this happens first---When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him

But let's just ignore everything that proves Premil, thus disproves Amil, and keep on insisting Amil is true Premil isn't.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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If this poster in the OP that has me on ignore
He has me on ignore, too. He's very sensitive and easily offended. He seems to think this is a place where no one is supposed to disagree with anything he says.

was actually interpreting Scripture with Scripture pertaining to Revelation 3:21, he would have to admit that it proves Premil, not Amil.
Why is it that you get upset when I talk confidently like this because you think it supposedly means that I'm saying I have all the answers and am never wrong? So, it's okay for you to speak confidently about your view and that doesn't mean you think you have all the answers, but it's not okay for me to do that? Isn't that a bit hypocritical?

And here is how.

To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

2 thrones in view, obviously. Otherwise, that would mean overcomers are also granted to sit with the Father in the Father's throne, something only Jesus is worthy of, and absolutely no one else, period. Surely, not one single person would disagree with that. Or if they do, all I can say is--Wow, you have made yourself equal to Christ, you have made yourself God. That aside. Therefore, it demands 2 thrones are in view here. It is then simply a matter of determining when Jesus sits in His own throne, not His Father's throne.
It's not talking about literal thrones. You are thinking too literally, so that's why you don't see that the Father's throne and Jesus's throne are the same throne. Remember, Jesus said this:

John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

If you are on Jesus's throne then you are also on the Father's throne because they are one. You should not think of the Father and Son the same way you would think of an earthly father and son and you should not think of their throne in earthly terms.

Thrones, in a spiritual sense, refer to authority and power.

Heaven is the Father's throne and the earth is His footstool.

Isaiah 66:1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?

After His resurrection, heaven became Jesus's throne as well. It's just one throne and it's heaven.

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

How much more power and authority can Jesus have than all power and authority in heaven and earth? It's not possible. So, after His resurrection, heaven became His throne and earth His footstool along with the Father. Jesus being at the right hand of the Father in heaven means He currently has the same power and authority as the Father. Only after He comes and delivers His kingdom to the Father will He then be subject to the Father (1 Cor 15:22-28), but to no one else.

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

BTW, we are looking at the thousand year reign in question right here in Matthew 19:28 , it is staring at us in our face.
How do you figure that? How does "judging" equate to ruling for a thousand years? Do you see the judgment in Matthew 25:31-46 as being the same as ruling for a long period of time?

And the following then shows the beginning of it.

Matthew 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
Where is there any hint in Matthew 25:31-46 of a thousand year reign beginning at that time? What I see in that passage occurring at that time is some inheriting "eternal life" in the kingdom prepared from the foundation of the world (Matt 25:34,46) and the rest being "cast into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels" for "everlasting punishment" (Matt 25:41,46). How does anything Jesus said in that passage relate to reigning for a thousand years?

Obviously, per Revelation 3:21 and this--My throne--well here it is plain as day, and equally plain as day He doesn't sit upon until this happens first---When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him

But let's just ignore everything that proves Premil, thus disproves Amil, and keep on insisting Amil is true Premil isn't.
Scripture is very clear that He sits on His throne of glory now because His throne is heaven itself and all power in heaven was given to Him after His resurrection (Matt 28:18, Eph 1:19-23). So, Matthew 25:31-46 does not say that He will have never previously sat on His throne of glory before that. Again, it's not a literal throne. His throne of glory is heaven and He reigns on it now since He has all power in heaven. What Matthew 25:31-46 is about is not that He doesn't yet sit on His throne of glory, which relates to Him having all power in heaven and earth with heaven as His throne and earth as His footstool. It just means He hasn't yet judged the world while having that power and authority, but will do so when He comes again.
 

Marty fox

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Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them.

Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God,

who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands.

Who sits on these thrones?
It is His people, to those who overcome, Christ says about them and more also, but here it is about reigning with Christ in heaven.
Think about it, where is God's throne? It is in heaven, and where is Christ's throne? Well it is also in heaven.
Christ is seated on His throne at the right hand of God in heaven, not on the earth

So, these Revelation 20 scriptures must of necessity mean this reigning with Christ takes place in the heavens, not on the earth for 1000 years.

Revelation 3:21
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.

But Paul teaches us that while we are alive on the earth we are also currently seated with Jesus in heaven

Ephesians 2:4-6
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
 
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Scott Downey

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But Paul teaches us that while we are alive on the earth we are also currently seated with Jesus in heaven

Ephesians 2:4-6
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,
Yes, this reign in heaven is ongoing today, not in the future only. My point is this scripture has been used as evidence for a future reign only on the earth of a thousand years.

Christians will reign on the earth, but it will be the new earth Christians will inherit, an earth where only righteousness will be dwelling, and God will dwell with man with the New Jerusalem descending from Heaven. There will not be any Satanic rebellion or decieving of the nations. The whole reigning on the old earth of Christ is one of those Christian myths.
 

Scott Downey

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When Christ returns, this happens immediately, sudden destruction, and the earth is gone.
His return means our salvation and the judging of the world in righteousness by the man God has appointed, Jesus Christ.
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2 Peter 3

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

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Hebrews 9

24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:

25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;

26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

The first time Christ came, was as an offering for sin, the second time to save us from the wrath of God on this world, which is that sudden destruction and the judgment that Paul described in Acts 17. Notice this warning of coming judgment is an important message to the unbelieving world.
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Acts 17

21 (For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing.)

22 Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.

23 For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.

24 God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

25 Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;

26 And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;

27 That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:

28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.

29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.

32 And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked: and others said, We will hear thee again of this matter.

33 So Paul departed from among them.

34 Howbeit certain men clave unto him, and believed: among the which was Dionysius the Areopagite, and a woman named Damaris, and others with them.
 

Scott Downey

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By necessity, no posting can be exhaustive. People won't read long posts. And you can only flood out so many ideas at any one time.
Posts are not meant to be an exhaustive commentary with every possible detail mentioned, if you want full explanations, study the bible yourself.
 

ewq1938

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The Millenium, the "thousand years", is on Earth because Rev 19 says the reign is over the nations with a rod of iron and the nations are on the Earth. There are no unsaved nations in heaven or the throne room. Rev 5 also speaks of a reign on Earth, matching the reign over the Earthly nations.

Even in Amill the Millennium is on Earth, with living saints reigning here while Christ reigns from heaven. That still is a Earthly reign.
 

ewq1938

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When Christ returns, this happens immediately, sudden destruction, and the earth is gone.

Nope. Not one second coming passage shows anything of the sort. Christ comes with a symbolic sword and kills an army during the second coming in Rev 19. There is no global slaughter and the text promises a rule over the nations, written in the future tense proving there is a reign over the nations AFTER Armageddon. That disproves the unscriptural concept of a second coming global slaughter.

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite (Aorist tense verb with PRESENT tense meaning) the nations: and he shall rule (FUTURE tense verb) them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth (PRESENT tense verb) the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

https://www.blueletterbible .org/kjv/rev/19/15/t_conc_1186015

https://biblehub .com/interlinear/revelation/19-15.htm

(remove the spaces before .com and .org in the two links)


Here rule/poimaino is in the FUTURE tense meaning it will happen at some point AFTER the second coming and battle of Armageddon while treadeth/pateo is written in the PRESENT tense meaning it is happening during this second coming. The treading and smiting are happening at Armageddon but not the ruling which proves some mortals will be alive after Armageddon is over. This proves the Premill position because indeed there is a future rule of people who were not slain during the second coming that Christ and his saints will rule over.
 

Marilyn C

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Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them.

Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God,

who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands.

Who sits on these thrones?
It is His people, to those who overcome, Christ says about them and more also, but here it is about reigning with Christ in heaven.
Think about it, where is God's throne? It is in heaven, and where is Christ's throne? Well it is also in heaven.
Christ is seated on His throne at the right hand of God in heaven, not on the earth

So, these Revelation 20 scriptures must of necessity mean this reigning with Christ takes place in the heavens, not on the earth for 1000 years.

Revelation 3:21
To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
I agree.