A SPIN-OFF from "JESUS IS GOD PART 2"

[Mayflower]

Kermos, you are a person who likes to interject your opinion of what others are implying....I have not "in effect " said I do not believe that Jesus is the Truth and Life...
You are deceived by your interpretation of what this OP is about...
Let me try one more time...
The Son of Man is a title that was used exclusively by Jesus - His disciples never addressed Him as such. Jesus used it to emphasize His humanity. The title goes back to the Book of Daniel where the Son of Man would inherit the everlasting kingdom of God. It is a designation of the Messiah. At His trial Jesus acknowledged that He indeed was the Son of Man - the one who would bring in God's everlasting kingdom. When the religious leaders heard this they accused Him of blasphemy - making Himself equal with God. The purpose of the title seems to be Jesus' own emphasis on His humanity.
What I am sharing is that He is the Son of God, and He is the Son of Man....
I have read all the scriptures you have supplied and still conclude the same as I did in the OP.
Now stop accusing me of denying Jesus....
This is a study...not a debate...contribute what you believe...but don't attack what others are sharing....
As I said this is a hidden wisdom which I have just discovered myself through study, prayer, and meditation.
Either join the group and contribute your beliefs without falsely accusing others or leave the thread.
Your accusation is very offensive and is not welcome.

Thanks.

I actually think he was implying me, but I know what I believe. I was saying that if the pharisees lived with Jesus, He may have said He was the Son of God elsewhere. But I believe in this case I and the Father are One= I am the Son of God. One and the same. And He refers to Himself as the Son of Man in the exact same way. He doesn't have to say it directly. He just is. He is triune God, Son of God, Son of Man.

And it is just as powerful as saying "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life" in John 14:6.

 

[Davy]

Now check this out...
Here is what I believe it is showing us...Jesus never called Himself "Son of God" because He is God....but always referred to Himself as "Son of man" because He is God made flesh....
But everytime someone else referred to Him as the "Son of God" He did not deny it but to Peter He said:
Matthew 16 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
¹⁵ He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
¹⁶ And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
¹⁷ And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

So I am curious about this and have meditated on it and concluded that it had to be revealed to man by the Father, and then later after His crucifixion it is revealed by the Holy Spirit....so Jesus true nature has to be revealed....amen?

Well... YEAH!

That's pretty much what John is saying in 1 John 2:22 about those who deny that Jesus is The Christ being antichrists. John wasn't just pointing to the idea of Jesus the man in the flesh, he was pointing to the idea of Jesus of Nazareth as God having come in the flesh. That's what the office of 'The Christ' points to, i.e., God The Son.

 

[Kermos]

Indirect is all I am saying. Unless anyone else wants to comment, I am done repeating this. Jesus is the Son of God and He proves that. I don't need to prove anything to you. But I agree with Heart2 Soul and Hidden now. I hadn't even noticed before. Thank you @Heart2Soul it is pretty cool.

Two things, @Mayflower, strike me based on your writings:

1. if what Jesus said in John 10:30 and John 10:36 are equivalents as you assert, then according to your linguistical assertion He says He is the Son of God in both verses because they are synonymous.
2. If John had written "Jesus said, ‘I am the Son of God’" someplace, then it would carry the same impact as Jesus saying "I said" in His statement of "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

The indisputable Truth is that Jesus did say "I am the Son of God" from His lips!

 

[Kermos]

Kermos, you are a person who likes to interject your opinion of what others are implying....I have not "in effect " said I do not believe that Jesus is the Truth and Life...
You are deceived by your interpretation of what this OP is about...
Let me try one more time...
The Son of Man is a title that was used exclusively by Jesus - His disciples never addressed Him as such. Jesus used it to emphasize His humanity. The title goes back to the Book of Daniel where the Son of Man would inherit the everlasting kingdom of God. It is a designation of the Messiah. At His trial Jesus acknowledged that He indeed was the Son of Man - the one who would bring in God's everlasting kingdom. When the religious leaders heard this they accused Him of blasphemy - making Himself equal with God. The purpose of the title seems to be Jesus' own emphasis on His humanity.
What I am sharing is that He is the Son of God, and He is the Son of Man....
I have read all the scriptures you have supplied and still conclude the same as I did in the OP.
Now stop accusing me of denying Jesus....
This is a study...not a debate...contribute what you believe...but don't attack what others are sharing....
As I said this is a hidden wisdom which I have just discovered myself through study, prayer, and meditation.
Either join the group and contribute your beliefs without falsely accusing others or leave the thread.
Your accusation is very offensive and is not welcome.

Thanks.

I carefully read your original post #1 and your follow-up post #2 in this thread, and I find no mention by you that Jesus is the only One who refers to Himself as the Son of Man, and I'm sorry, but I don't find it contextually in your writings there either.

But, I did find that you wrote "Jesus never spoke from His lips He was the Son of God...but there are several scriptures where it is implied..." in the original post #1.

So, I gently proclaimed Word of God where Lord Jesus Christ refers to Himself as the Son of God (see post #11).

But, you turned around to write "So Jesus never referred to Himself as the Son of God" (see post #21).

I proclaimed additional instances of Jesus referring to Himself as the Son of God in post #31 to you.

After that, until now, your only reply to me was "But then when I went to look for it...where He said it...I can't find it." in post #33.

By the way, that "in effect" was to @Mayflower who equated "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30) and "I am the Son of God" in post #46, and I specifically mentioned that I was using it to draw attention back to that post.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I carefully read your original post #1 and your follow-up post #2 in this thread, and I find no mention by you that Jesus is the only One who refers to Himself as the Son of Man, and I'm sorry, but I don't find it contextually in your writings there either.

But, I did find that you wrote "Jesus never spoke from His lips He was the Son of God...but there are several scriptures where it is implied..." in the original post #1.

So, I gently proclaimed Word of God where Lord Jesus Christ refers to Himself as the Son of God (see post #11).

But, you turned around to write "So Jesus never referred to Himself as the Son of God" (see post #21).

I proclaimed additional instances of Jesus referring to Himself as the Son of God in post #31 to you.

After that, until now, your only reply to me was "But then when I went to look for it...where He said it...I can't find it." in post #33.

By the way, that "in effect" was to @Mayflower who equated "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30) and "I am the Son of God" in post #46, and I specifically mentioned that I was using it to draw attention back to that post.

Again, when Jesus said to the pharisees "you are blaspheming" because I said " I am the Son of God"...Jesus was quoting what they said He said but did He actually say it?
I can't find where He actually says it...can you?

 

[Heart2Soul]

Again, when Jesus said to the pharisees "you are blaspheming" because I said " I am the Son of God"...Jesus was quoting what they said He said but did He actually say it?
I can't find where He actually says it...can you?

When He was being judged He confirmed it. .thou hast said.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Reminds me of the verse where He said of His Father, "If I testify of Myself, My testimony is not true. But there is Another that bears witness of Me, and I know that the witness which He witnesses of me is true." (John 5:31-32) The sense is He was deferring to others to testify about who He truly was.

This is so profound in understanding what this whole OP is about! And thank you for sharing it....
It ties up the loose ends so to speak and puts it in perspective.

 

[marks]

Look carefully at Lord Jesus Christ's words, "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

@Heart2Soul, Jesus Christ says "I said", not "you said", but truly "I said", then Jesus Christ appends Jesus Christ's words of "I am the Son of God" to "I said"; therefore, the context is Jesus Christ quoting Jesus Christ in identifying Jesus Christ as the Son of God.

That should settle the matter then.

Much love!

 

[marks]

@Mayflower I didn't know either of the tunes but they are both really good, I think...

The first tune was how I learned this. Beautiful song!

Much love!

 

[marks]

Two things, @Mayflower, strike me based on your writings:

1. if what Jesus said in John 10:30 and John 10:36 are equivalents as you assert, then according to your linguistical assertion He says He is the Son of God in both verses because they are synonymous.
2. If John had written "Jesus said, ‘I am the Son of God’" someplace, then it would carry the same impact as Jesus saying "I said" in His statement of "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

The indisputable Truth is that Jesus did say "I am the Son of God" from His lips!

Yes, Jesus testifies that He said, "I am the Son of God".

Much love!

 

[Heart2Soul]

Yes, Jesus testifies that He said, "I am the Son of God".

Much love!

I give up...you guys are missing the whole point.

 

[Kermos]

Again, when Jesus said to the pharisees "you are blaspheming" because I said " I am the Son of God"...Jesus was quoting what they said He said but did He actually say it?
I can't find where He actually says it...can you?

@Heart2Soul, if the Apostle John had written "Jesus said, ‘I am the Son of God’" someplace, then it would carry similar credence as Jesus saying "I said" in His statement of "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

Jesus did not say that "Jesus was quoting what they said He said", no, He did not, truly He did say "I said".

The Truth is, Jesus says "I am the Son of God".

 

[Heart2Soul]

@Heart2Soul, if the Apostle John had written "Jesus said, ‘I am the Son of God’" someplace, then it would carry similar credence as Jesus saying "I said" in His statement of "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

Jesus did not say that "Jesus was quoting what they said He said", no, He did not, truly He did say "I said".

The Truth is, Jesus says "I am the Son of God".

Ok

 

[farouk]

Either join the group and contribute your beliefs without falsely accusing others or leave the thread.
Your accusation is very offensive and is not welcome.

Thanks.

@Heart2Soul The glorious Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ in Scripture is overwhelming. Honest questions from those truly wanting to learn are fine but speculative comments that can me interpreted as misrepresentation about that glorious truth on these threads are indeed unacceptable.

 

[Kermos]

I give up...you guys are missing the whole point.

I perceive the premise in your original posts is that you intended for this to be a Bible study around your understanding that Jesus referred to Himself as Son of Man but not Son of God along with the commensurate implications.

Your premise is flawed because:

"He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God" (Jesus Christ, John 3:18)

"Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live" (Jesus Christ, John 5:25).

"This sickness is not to end in death, but for the glory of God, so that the Son of God may be glorified by it" (Jesus Christ, John 11:4).

Note a difference in how Lord Jesus refers to Himself as the Son of Man, such as "the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands" (Jesus Christ, Matthew 17:12) for God cannot die.

Behold, a HUGE difference between Jesus referring to himself as Son of Man in some instances and Son of God in some instances with:

"I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36).

The HUGE difference here is that Jesus says that He says "I am the Son of God", yet He does not say "I am the Son of Man".

Lord Jesus refers to Himself as the Son of God, yet you claim "Jesus never called Himself 'Son of God' because He is God....but always referred to Himself as 'Son of man'" in the original post series' post #2.

For some reason, you refuse to acknowledge the above quoted John 3:18, John 5:25, John 10:36, and John 11:4 as from His lips, Jesus referring to Himself as the Son of Man, and Jesus referred to Himself as the Son of God.

You cannot, of your own initiative (Luke 12:57), have a Truthfully faithful study of the Bible based on a person's false premise.

 

[Kermos]

Ok

@Heart2Soul, since you wrote "Ok", does this mean that you now agree that Jesus was talking about Himself when He says words, "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36)?

 

[Heart2Soul]

@Heart2Soul, since you wrote "Ok", does this mean that you now agree that Jesus was talking about Himself when He says words, "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36)?

It means I am done explaining what particular point I was trying to share with others.ň
I am a believer of the Trinitarian teaching.
I believe Jesus is the Son of God and the Son of Man....

I believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, in apostles, prophets, teachers, preachers, and evangelists...
I believe in everything the Bible as the inspired Word of God.
The end.

 

[Kermos]

It means I am done explaining what particular point I was trying to share with others.ň
I am a believer of the Trinitarian teaching.
I believe Jesus is the Son of God and the Son of Man....

I believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, in apostles, prophets, teachers, preachers, and evangelists...
I believe in everything the Bible as the inspired Word of God.
The end.

You wrote that you started a Bible study. I posed a question to you about the Word of God.

A Christian is ready in season and out of season.

Your response does not tell me your thoughts about a specific saying of Lord Jesus Christ.

A response of "Ok" means an agreement as in "your writing is Ok" versus "your writing is not Ok" (which is disagreement).

You responded "Ok", then you responded that your "Ok" did not really mean "Ok" while at the time you didn't actually answer the specific question.

Please, answer the question.

Do you now agree that Jesus was talking about Himself when He says words, "I said, ‘I am the Son of God’" (John 10:36)?

 

[robert derrick]

Because of that thread I discovered a hidden treasure (hidden to me anyway)...
So here is what caught my attention:...

I find it very interesting that in Mark 14 Jesus refers to Himself as the Son of man...Mark 14 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
²⁰ And he answered and said unto them, It is one of the twelve, that dippeth with me in the dish.
²¹ The Son of man indeed goeth, as it is written of him: but woe to that man by whom the Son of man is betrayed! good were it for that man if he had never been born.

…
⁴¹ And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your rest: it is enough, the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners.
⁴² Rise up, let us go; lo, he that betrayeth me is at hand.

…
⁶¹ But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
⁶² And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
⁶³ Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
⁶⁴ Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

Jesus never spoke from His lips He was the Son of God...but there are several scriptures where it is implied...

Ex:Matthew 26 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
⁶³ But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.
⁶⁴ Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.

Jesus never spoke from His lips He was the Son of God...but there are several scriptures where it is implied...No one questions that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. The heresy of a created christ, and The Son is not God.

True, there is only on place where Jesus confirmed He was the Son of God before men on earth.

And He was of course the Son of God:

The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

No one seriously argues Jesus Christ is not the Son of God, but rather the heresy is of a falsely created christ, who is a created being, not Being God.

 

[robert derrick]

Now check this out...
Here is what I believe it is showing us...Jesus never called Himself "Son of God" because He is God....but always referred to Himself as "Son of man" because He is God made flesh....
But everytime someone else referred to Him as the "Son of God" He did not deny it but to Peter He said:
Matthew 16 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
¹⁵ He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
¹⁶ And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
¹⁷ And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

So I am curious about this and have meditated on it and concluded that it had to be revealed to man by the Father, and then later after His crucifixion it is revealed by the Holy Spirit....so Jesus true nature has to be revealed....amen?

Here is what I believe it is showing us...Jesus never called Himself "Son of God" because He is God....but always referred to Himself as "Son of man" because He is God made flesh....

This is an interesting good approach. However, calling Himself the Son of God was by humility, not by any error of being called such, since He is.

Calling Himself the son of man of course rebuked any idolatry of Mary as Jesus Christ being son of a particular woman, and so she being made Mother of Jesus Christ, and so Mother of the Son of God.

And since Jesus Christ is God, then Mother of God.

So Jesus true nature has to be revealed....amen?

True, which has already been revealed by the prophets and the apostles in Scripture. Believers simply need to read it for themselves and believe it.

It's only when heresies are brought in that the mangled mess of confusion, twisting and turning, and unreal arguments are needed to reject what is plainly written:

The Word was God, and the Word was made flesh: Jesus Christ has come in the flesh.

And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.